need help for 45acp cast bullet recipe

[Tiny]

I cast my own bullets using a lee 228 gr bullet mold .. with the mixture of Lead I've got ... wheel weights and old plumbing lead either one the bullets come out weighing 217 to 216 gr ... I use hodgdon titegroup powder but can't find any data for cast bullets at all ... I've been loading them using the same powder amount for 230 fmj but they feel like they're too light of a load ... I'm wanting to compete in some competitions using these bullets but need some powder measurement information if anyone has it for cast bullets... I'm also using cci large pistol primers if that's needed in the recipe

 

[Khornet]

I'll bet

that Bullseye 3.5-4.5 gr will do the trick for that bullet weight. I've gone as low as 3.3 gr with it for 200 gr lead bullets in my Gold Cup. 231 will also work fine.

 

[Paul "Fitz" Jones]

Wheel Weights alone

The wheel weights alone ought to be fine for your bullets and do not add any softer plumbing lead unless a small amount if it is plumbing solder. The only other thing to add to your bullets is Linotype if found at a scrap yard or gun show. A lead hardness tester is handy for making identical alloy lead and identical weight bullets if you wish to be a serious winning competitor.

Fitz

 

[Tiny]

thanks paul and khornet

my problem wasn't with the lead ... I like the plumber's lead better than the wheel weights or a larger mixture of the plumbing lead cause it doesn't cool as fast and the bullets turn out more uniform ... the leading in my barrel isn't a problem ... I've tried pure wheel weights and I have to pour about 6 or 7 times even after I've placed the mold on top of the lee pot with the temp setting on hi before the bullets will not have blemishes or wrinkles ... when I use the old scrap plumbing lead it takes longer to harden and they're more uniform at lower temps ... around 750 and the difference in the bullet weight is just 1 gr ... the plumbing lead produces and average of 217 gr bullets and the wheel weights are 216 gr.

the problem I was having was the amount of powder to use for the bullets using hodgdon titegroup powder. I couldn't find any data on the use of titegroup with lead bullets ... all their literature on this powder is with fmj's so I finally gave up looking for info and just called hodgdon ... took about 30 seconds to get the info and the range for that lead bullet weight was 4.0 to 5.0 gr ... with that info I had two autodisk's that'd get me in the range on my progressive Lee pro 1000 reloader .... .46 and .43. the autodisk literature wasn't the same as what was actually being poured ... I put the .43 in and weighed the powder and it was 4.2 gr ... I loaded up some and fired them through my kp97dc ruger and they were very accurate but a little weak ... they were too weak to operate the slide with authority so I figured I'd get jams with that amount so I put the .46 in and the amount it dumps is 4.75 gr and that felt a little strong but there will be no jams with it ... I don't know the speed of the bullets or anything but I'm pretty confident they'll work fine for the competition's requirements of the 165,000/bullet weight=speed minimum

I got a big bottle of the titegroup powder so that was my delima ... if it was just a pound of powder I coulda switched to a powder that had the data for lead bullets.

thanks for the input guys

 

[Poodleshooter]

Hi Tiny,
I know what you're experiencing. I tried using Hodgdon's FMJ data to create loads for Valiant and Star 230gr LRN and TC bullets using Titegroup. Most of the Hodgdon FMJ maximum listed loads would barely function the slide, and chronographed around 500-600fps with 230gr cast lead. After experimenting with loads, I ended up with two conclusions: you either need a very heavy crimp (I used a Lee FCD), or you need to boost the load a bit over maximum. A warning is that the pressure builds up quickly beyond the max so be SURE to measure the loads carefully.
Hodgdon's max for FMJ is,IIRC, 4.8, and I went a few tenths over that after experimentation in my Glock 30. I'd recommend working up slow from 4.1grs until you get good function. Don't worry about the lack of absolutely perfect data, just load carefully. Truth be told, you are NEVER going to get perfect data for the exact cast bullet that you are using. Every bit of data is still going to result in you making an educated guess to some degree. Since you're loading for a power factor that seems to be for IDPA, don't worry too much about speed, you only have to hit 720 or so fps to make custom defense pistol. The momentum based figure makes it easy to use 230gr .45 loads.

 

[Sunray]

Buy another manual. If you're using a bullet maker's manual you'll find they only publish data for their bullets. Lyman puts out a manual specifically for cast bullets. Their manuals give loads for all kinds of bullets. Worth every cent. http://lymanproducts.com/lymanproducts/books.htm

 

[budman46]

tiny--

like you, i'm a fan of the cast .45acp. when i started casting and loading for it 30 years ago, there weren't near as many powders available, but the ones i had were bullseye, unique and red dot. unique has a good reputation in the .45, but i found it to be very dirty. bullseye worked really well, but is so dense that a double charge could occur and not be noticed on a progressive press...5.0gr of red dot gave me a nice, accurate, clean load which bulked enough that a double charge would overflow the case. as a bonus, brass ejected just about a foot to my right, making it easy to find and weren't dented from the slide hood like unique loads tended to be.

don't worry about the large stock of titegroup...if you stay in this game, you'll find a use for it somewhere down the line.

budman

 

[Khornet]

I have a P90

and my Gold Cup has a light recoil spring for those soft target loads I mentioned. Those loadds will not reliably work the slide in my P90, which is really set up for defense loads rather than target.

 

[Fatelvis]

I agree with Khornet. 4-4.5 grns Bullseye is a great load with this bullet.

 

[crackerjack]

powder

I have been using WST 4.7g-4.8g with 200g Lead SWC it meters well, very clean burning and very accurate, have been very pleased with it.
Good Luck

 

[WESHOOT2]

Your Bullet, Your Gun

5.3g W231, IMI (sized) case, CCI300, OAL 1.230"+whateveryouneedtomakeitreliable.

 

[Johnny Guest]

One load I shoot a LOT - - -

Bulk pack 230 LRN, 5.3 gr. W-231, WLP primers, almost any kind of brass. Clocks about 820 fps from at least two different 1911-types with five-inch barrels. Barely 800 from a 4-1/4" Commander barrel.

Best of luck - -
Johnny

 

[presidents_topgun]

Tiny! What kind of competition are you shooting in? Conventional Bullseye, bowling pin sweep, Banchi Cup, PPC, etc? I shot bullseye competion in the 70's and 80's (Camp Perry) but haven't shot competition much since then. I shot a 200 gr cast bullet I had custom built by H&G molds (now out of business so I hear). I used bullseye, but at the moment I can't remember the load gr. weight. Winchester 231 ball powder a touch hotter, but cleaner burning. I wouldn't try to match factory 230 gr FMJ's as they are pretty much max loads. If you've had your 45 custom built, you surely don't want to run hot loads unless your smith built it to handle those loads, that is of course assuming you are shooting a wad gun for conventional bullseye. For that course you want powder puff loads, or just enough to make the action function. The advise given above is sound, but you need to let us know what type of course you're shooting. You may want to consider recoil recovery time if you're in a timed shoot like conventional bullseye, where you must get 5 rounds on paper in 10 seconds. That's just something to consider and best of luck in your matches.

Nobama!

 

[ArchAngelCD]

With that bullet it will be hard to beat 5.5gr of W231. That is my favorite powder for the .45 Auto and .38 Special...

 

[Marlin 45 carbine]

I use Bullseye for all loading of cast slugs in the pistol rounds I shoot. fairly mild practice loads all.
.32acp, .380acp, 9mm Makarov, 9mm Para, .357 mag and .45acp all.