Southla1
Member In Memoriam
Hummmm I saw that ruling yesterday..............been d-loading music at a feverish rate ever since then....get it before they shut it down 
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Net Providers Must Turn You IN
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NewShooter78
Member
cratz2,
If you already have the cds then why would you need to download the songs? You can upload them onto your computer if you so want them there. But if you can prove that you've already bought the cd, then there shouldn't be any real problem with that. Copyright law allows for you to make a copy of a source that you've already paid for as long as you aren't selling it to someone else. They do this because there is already case law for making cassette copies of albums, and the cases were remedied by said taxes in my previous posts. More like tarrifs than taxes for practical reasons, but that's besides the point. The releasing of IP addresses will allow the gov't (however wrong it is for security and 4th, 6th, 7th, 8th amendments) to see who is downloading the most, and conversly who has been uploaded from the most. Since there is no other way to "police" the internet effectivly, this is the best the gov't has come up with.
Pendragon,
You are right in that the market will dictate what the price of something will be. Value is a subjective term. And since the labels and distributors have found what the market will bare, that's where the MSRP of loosely around $15 has come from. And overall sales might be up, but the thing that has dropped are markets traditionally made up of buyers around 13-35, namely pop and rock. I don't think they are worried about the sea change, but more about getting paid. It's a business. Its actually a lot easier if people just download the music they want, but if they are doing it for free then there is no profit. And that's all this boils down to: money.
If you already have the cds then why would you need to download the songs? You can upload them onto your computer if you so want them there. But if you can prove that you've already bought the cd, then there shouldn't be any real problem with that. Copyright law allows for you to make a copy of a source that you've already paid for as long as you aren't selling it to someone else. They do this because there is already case law for making cassette copies of albums, and the cases were remedied by said taxes in my previous posts. More like tarrifs than taxes for practical reasons, but that's besides the point. The releasing of IP addresses will allow the gov't (however wrong it is for security and 4th, 6th, 7th, 8th amendments) to see who is downloading the most, and conversly who has been uploaded from the most. Since there is no other way to "police" the internet effectivly, this is the best the gov't has come up with.
Pendragon,
You are right in that the market will dictate what the price of something will be. Value is a subjective term. And since the labels and distributors have found what the market will bare, that's where the MSRP of loosely around $15 has come from. And overall sales might be up, but the thing that has dropped are markets traditionally made up of buyers around 13-35, namely pop and rock. I don't think they are worried about the sea change, but more about getting paid. It's a business. Its actually a lot easier if people just download the music they want, but if they are doing it for free then there is no profit. And that's all this boils down to: money.
NewShooter78
Member
And to try and get this back on topic...
I think that this type of gov't "intervention" in the internet is totally off base. I don't trust the gov't to do anything legal with this. Now I do think that they have been monitoring the internet just like they can monitor any centalized database, probably since its inception. That said its crazy that they would openly announce that they are doing this, and to pass laws to make it legal to usurp the Constitution. Just more proff that the Office of Homeland Security is a scam.
I think that this type of gov't "intervention" in the internet is totally off base. I don't trust the gov't to do anything legal with this. Now I do think that they have been monitoring the internet just like they can monitor any centalized database, probably since its inception. That said its crazy that they would openly announce that they are doing this, and to pass laws to make it legal to usurp the Constitution. Just more proff that the Office of Homeland Security is a scam.
cratz2
Member
Well, if I'm at work and I want to listen to a song that I have on CD at home, it is more convinient to download it than drive home. Plus, with better DSL and cable modem speeds, it is much quicker to download the song I want on MP3 than it is to get the CD and rip it. Of course, a lot of what I download, I delete, do to poor quality.
My point was that if 'they' start cracking down, 'they' are going to arrest someone at some point for having downloaded a song that the downloader legitimately owns. I was just wondering what the ramifactions of that would be.
In all honestly, I probably only have 50 songs that I don't have on CD. I just have a MP3 player in my car and as I said, it is much easier and quicker to download songs and burn them to CD than it is to rip CD after CD after CD and then burn them.
Plus, with better DSL and cable modem speeds, it is much quicker to download the song I want on MP3 than it is to get the CD and rip it. Of course, a lot of what I download, I delete, do to poor quality.My point was that if 'they' start cracking down, 'they' are going to arrest someone at some point for having downloaded a song that the downloader legitimately owns. I was just wondering what the ramifactions of that would be.
In all honestly, I probably only have 50 songs that I don't have on CD. I just have a MP3 player in my car and as I said, it is much easier and quicker to download songs and burn them to CD than it is to rip CD after CD after CD and then burn them.
NewShooter78
Member
I see what you mean now cratz2. I guess its one of those grey areas that laws, or actions like this is bound to create. And in all honesty this is why going after end users is not effective, ala the War on Drugs. But since you can't stop people from writing code, 1st Amendment, you can only go after them when a law is actually broken. Unfortunatly its not a clear distinction when it comes to trying to regulate the internet. We'll just have to see how this all plays out when the gov't actually starts taking people to court over these types of infractions.
2nd Amendment
member
Little problem with this. I'm sitting here at my nice little desk at this ISP and I couldn't tell anyone where anyone is, has been or may be. I don't even know for certain who is on. I can tell you what account is logged in to what server, but not from where, who is using it or when it was last used. We're very specific about NOT knowing these things.
NewShooter78
Member
So you are saying there is no way to track individual IP's, to the extent of knowing what they are doing when they are logged on? And then when they are logged on, not hacking through any firewalls and taking a look see at a hard drive. I know very little about computers to begin with, so I am not trying to be sarcastic.
2nd Amendment
member
There's lots of ways. I'm just saying that we, and a lot of other ISP's, specifically refuse to have a method of doing it. It's none of our business and short of a court order forcing us to do it we won't. Considering the way our system is set up I really don't know if we could do a lot even then, without the cooperation of the phone company, some new software and someone to literally sit and monitor the system 24/7.
Something that I have long wondered about: Say I track an account/IP#. OK, the problem is I still know nothing but the account useage. I have no idea who is actually using it. Even if a tracked addy matched an account address it doesn't mean someone isn't sitting there on a laptop instead of the PC. Point being, how do you connect in a courtroom the use of an account with any one individual? Especially in this day of dirt cheap HD's that you can pull out and walk off with, hide, etc.
Something that I have long wondered about: Say I track an account/IP#. OK, the problem is I still know nothing but the account useage. I have no idea who is actually using it. Even if a tracked addy matched an account address it doesn't mean someone isn't sitting there on a laptop instead of the PC. Point being, how do you connect in a courtroom the use of an account with any one individual? Especially in this day of dirt cheap HD's that you can pull out and walk off with, hide, etc.
cratz2
Member
The IT manager at my location can tell you what songs have been downloaded, what songs and/or video has been streamed to a given IP address.
If he can, as ISP can.
If he can, as ISP can.
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