NFA/Hughes Amendment Challenge

[Phaedrus/69]

You'll likely note that none on this SCOTUS was alive when those decisions were made. Even their grandparents may not have been. So obviously those decisions have nothing to do with our current partisan political SCOTUS. You may also note that the Dred Scott decision, monstrous though it was, was probably correct. It was the Constitution itself that contained the profane permission of slavery. This was changed by Congress, not the courts. Mistakes should be corrected of course, but this SCOTUS seems not to mind reversing this trend towards more freedom by rolling back rights long enjoyed. To all outward appearances the actual Constitution isn't informing many of their decisions.

 

[Elkins45]

You'll likely note that none on this SCOTUS was alive when those decisions were made. Even their grandparents may not have been. So obviously those decisions have nothing to do with our current partisan political SCOTUS. You may also note that the Dred Scott decision, monstrous though it was, was probably correct. It was the Constitution itself that contained the profane permission of slavery. This was changed by Congress, not the courts. Mistakes should be corrected of course, but this SCOTUS seems not to mind reversing this trend towards more freedom by rolling back rights long enjoyed. To all outward appearances the actual Constitution isn't informing many of their decisions.

“Rolling back rights long enjoyed” means abortion, right? You might have noticed that there has been significant disagreement that a Constitutional right to an abortion can be found in the right to privacy since the day that decision was made.

Besides abortion what other long enjoyed right has the SCOTUS restricted? More to the point of this forum, how has the current SCOTUS aided in the loss of gun rights?

 

[Spats McGee]

This one's threatening to drift out of bounds, so I'll just say this:

 

[12Bravo20]

A new bill has been introduced to abolish the ATF. It is: H.R.3960 - Brian A Terry Memorial Eliminate the ATF Act

H. R. 3960

To eliminate the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, remove firearm restrictions on lawful gun owners, and provide funds to surviving families of border patrol agents killed as a result of Operation Fast and Furious.

IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
June 17, 2021
Mrs. Greene of Georgia (for herself, Mr. Norman, Mr. Gaetz, and Mr. Gosar) introduced the following bill; which was referred to the Committee on the Judiciary, and in addition to the Committees on Ways and Means, and Homeland Security, for a period to be subsequently determined by the Speaker, in each case for consideration of such provisions as fall within the jurisdiction of the committee concerned

A BILL
To eliminate the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, remove firearm restrictions on lawful gun owners, and provide funds to surviving families of border patrol agents killed as a result of Operation Fast and Furious.

Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,

SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE.

This Act may be cited as the “Brian A. Terry Memorial Eliminate the ATF Act”.

https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/house-bill/3960/text

I am sure that this bill does not stand much of a chance on passing, but it is a start. There is also an article on Fox New too.

Quoted from the Fox News article. https://www.foxnews.com/politics/gaetz-introduces-abolish-atf-act-ruling-against-stabilizing-braces

"The continued existence of the ATF is increasingly unwarranted based on the actions they're taking to convert otherwise law-abiding people into felons," he said. "My bill would abolish the ATF. If that doesn't work, we're going to try defunding the ATF. If that doesn't work, we're going to target the individual bureaucrats at the top of the ATF who have exceeded their authority in rulemaking. And if that doesn't work, we're going to take a meat cleaver to the statutes that the ATF believes broadly authorize their actions

So even if this bill goes nowhere, Congress is still looking to rein in the ATF.

 

[AlexanderA]

So we complain that NFA applications are taking too long to process. How about never having them processed? Of course, the NFA itself would still be in force, so that means that the current ownership of every NFA item would be frozen in place.

ATF funding should be increased so that they can do their job.

 

[Gun4Fun90]

So we complain that NFA applications are taking too long to process. How about never having them processed? Of course, the NFA itself would still be in force, so that means that the current ownership of every NFA item would be frozen in place.

ATF funding should be increased so that they can do their job.

or or and I know this may sound crazy but instead of spending more money on this we could just decrease their workload by maybe removing SBR's and SBS's and Silencers/Suppressors from the NFA allowing them to focus their energy on Machine Guns, Destructive Devices and tracking down gunrunners and actual criminals!

I know completely crazy thought. Imagine such a world.

 

[dogtown tom]

or or and I know this may sound crazy but instead of spending more money on this we could just decrease their workload by maybe removing SBR's and SBS's and Silencers/Suppressors from the NFA allowing them to focus their energy on Machine Guns, Destructive Devices and tracking down gunrunners and actual criminals!

I know completely crazy thought. Imagine such a world.

Whelp.........now that you bring it up....remember six years ago when this was leaked?
https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/02/06/breaking-atf-white-paper-leaked/
It came out when the Republican Party held both the House and Senate and we had a staunch Second Amendment advocate in the White House.

So in short, ATF leadership wanted to dump silencers and every Republican sat on their hands.

 

[JN01]

So we complain that NFA applications are taking too long to process. How about never having them processed? Of course, the NFA itself would still be in force, so that means that the current ownership of every NFA item would be frozen in place.

ATF funding should be increased so that they can do their job.

What makes you think they would use any of a budget increase to speed up NFA applications?

 

[dogtown tom]

What makes you think they would use any of a budget increase to speed up NFA applications?

What makes you think budget increases are just blank checks that an agency can spend on anything they like?
It isn't like that. Federal $$$ are earmarked for specific programs, staffing, etc.


Every year since I became an FFL, ATF has asked for additional funding to enable faster NFA Form processing.

 

[JN01]

You think that bureaucrats with an agenda don't have ways to shuffle assets around? Just about every time a Federal agency or department is audited, there are millions or billions of dollars they can't account for (IRS is a repeat offender). No one is ever held responsible. The FBI paid social media companies to stifle free speech. Do you think they had a budget earmark for that?

But maybe the ATF you are in love with is different and all those honest, Second Amendment loving agents will insure that every nickel is devoted to facilitating the needs of the gun owning citizens they are there to serve.

 

[rust collector]

There is a different thread running on the Gaetz v ATF legislation, so let's get back on the issue of the NFA and Hughes amendment.

 

[dogtown tom]

You think that bureaucrats with an agenda don't have ways to shuffle assets around? Just about every time a Federal agency or department is audited, there are millions or billions of dollars they can't account for (IRS is a repeat offender). No one is ever held responsible. The FBI paid social media companies to stifle free speech. Do you think they had a budget earmark for that?

Yay! Another silly conspiracy theory.

But maybe the ATF you are in love with is different and all those honest, Second Amendment loving agents will insure that every nickel is devoted to facilitating the needs of the gun owning citizens they are there to serve.

First, I have no love for ATF. But I do have to abide by their regulations.
Second, you think any explanation of a law or ATF regulation means the person explaining agrees with such law. That's just dumb.
Lastly, stick to facts....and the fact is ATF NFA Examiners are working their butts off. Unlimited overtime will do that,

 

[JN01]

Unless you know all the ATF examiners, your statement that they are working their butts off is opinion, not fact.

You may think they are all a great bunch of guys, but their recent actions don't support that- Fast and Furious was a disaster, a ploy to drum up support for more gun bans resulting in death; ATF director nominees that support severe 2A restrictions, sending agents to gun owner's homes, without warrant, on fishing expeditions, and this latest pistol brace interpretation that seems tailor made to entrap anyone trying to comply with it.

You can ignore these and the many other misdeeds of our government over the past few years or chalk them up to coincidence or right wing conspiracies, but I wouldn't count on any favors from them anytime soon.

 

[rust collector]

Whenever we get to this stage we are not learning anything new. Whether you call them bureaucrats or public servants, they are hired and required to do their masters' bidding and there is little to be gained by vilifying them. Time to give it a rest.