NY large magazine ban?

[drsfmd]

Whoa... where did you hear or read that preban mags cannot be brought into NY? That's simply untrue. If you can get your hands on pre-ban mags, you can have them in NY... there's NO issue.

Anyone telling you otherwise is WRONG.

 

[pseudonymity]

You are correct. However, what I am referring to is that every one purchased or transferred through a FFL holder has the records kept. For example, if a crime is committed or an arrest is made involving the rifle, the serial numbers will be traced - allowing them to find the original configuration from the factory. Legally, I can not drive it into the state, it is supposed to be transferred through a FFL holder to me after being shipped in (according to the BATF officer I spoke to). In this case I will not be allowed to have the magazines shipped in with it, so I am told by the same officer. As I am told, the magazines possessed (in the state) before the ban are legal.

Finding the factory original configuration is not really relevant as far as I can tell - if a rifle that was not in a banned configuration was purchased before the ban, and then modified to a form that was then later banned, it would still be grandfathered under PL265. I would say that a prosecutor would have to establish the rifle was sold in a non-ban configuration, was in a non-ban configuration after 9/94 and then was changed to a banned configuration.

Sounds like the ATF officer was answering a different question - if you buy any rifle outside your state of residence, you need to transfer it through an FFL. You can take possession of a rifle from a FFL outside your state of residence (not a handgun though). This has nothing to do with the AWB stuff in PL265.

I do not see how any rifle that was "lawfully possessed" in a pre-ban configuration before 9/94 could not be transferred in or out of NYS via FFL (just like any other rifle).

I see no reason that the NY law would consider a AWB rifle owned outside NY to not be "lawfully possessed". Keep in mind, at the time the NY law was passed, there was an AWB nationwide, so all AWB items were already grandfathered in. The lawmakers in NY probably thought that the federal AWB would re-up but it thankfully did not of course. At the time the law was written, there did not need to be a distinction between items possessed in or outside of NY.

If what the BATF officer is saying is true, then it would have been legal to transfer an grandfathered AWB item into NY while the federal AWB was in place, but now that federal AWB has expired, it is now illegal to transfer in a grandfathered item? Makes no sense, and I have not seen any case law to support it.

 

[hoodfu]

Exactly. Unlike handguns, there's no registration of long guns in NY. Some states (I think Massachusetts) have registration of "assault weapons" so that people couldn't bring in more grandfathered guns. NY has no such registration.

 

[lobo9er]

I can't have it brought into the state with the hi-cap magazines.

you can if they are pre ban. For one how would anyone know if you bought those pre ban mags in a gun shop in upstate NY or a gun show, where they are legal to buy and sell?

 

[lobo9er]

Fact is you can buy pre ban mags and guns in most upstate gun shops. (as long as they have them in stock)

 

[SavageManAntonio]

Okay, so we are past the issue of whether or not it is legal to possess. Please do not distort what I am saying. The local BATF officer said the AR could be brought in without the mags. I am not saying it seemed right or that I agree. Also, I checked with two local dealer that said no to transferring it to me.

I feel better knowing that there are others whom seem to agree with me. I could not see why I could not possess the mags and/or have them sent with the gun. There seems to be a disagreement with whether or not pre-ban mags can be brought in. One of the dealers mentioned that he only takes in mags from inside the state (if that makes any sense).

I also looked and did not see anything in PL 265 to prevent having them brought in - seems I was originally misinformed. I will be doing more research to make sure but either way pushing to get my father's gun WITH the mags.....

 

[drsfmd]

The local BATF officer said the AR could be brought in without the mags.

And we're telling you that:

1) The BATFE agent is wrong.
2) The BATFE has no jurisdiction on this one-- it's a state law, and the mags are totally unregulated at the federal level since the expiration of the AWB.

 

[hoodfu]

And more importantly, unlike the gun, there's no serialization of the mags. You can just bring pre-ban mags in yourself, you don't need outside help for that.

 

[xtriggerman]

When i was a ny full service dealer 82-96, i had numerous troopers stop in to pass the time and i have to step in here with something you all should keep in mind. ANY large capacity ammo feeding device >10 rds can get you arrested. If you think it is on the trooper to identify a preban from current manufacture, you are flat out wrong. That is what the court system is for here. The LEO will not be peanalizied in ANY WAY for an arrest that eventualy gets thrown out of court once proper identification can be proven. Now that is not to say a trooper will make a arrest every time, its up to their descretion. Also please know that a trooper that wishes to get promoted to BCI ( criminal investigater), needs to show a minimum number of felony arrests on his performance elval. The arrest eval pays no attention to weather a conviction was a result or not. So you figure it out. As i posted in another thread, a friend of mine is currently out on bail for a felony arrest on possetion of a pre ban daewoo rifle that he was "NOT" ALOWED to retrieve his purchase receipt during the arrest. His lawyer cost him $5000 to have the privlage of showing his receipt for the gun at his yet to be held court hearing. LEO descretion, physical proof, and lots of cash is what matters, not your interpretation of the law.

 

[X-Rap]

Silly law in what seems to be a silly state, I'm glad all contact I need with the place is gone.
We should all read and heed these threads from NY in case we forget what it was like all over the country for 10 yrs.
There is a group that shares power in this country that has institutionalized hatred for guns as a majority, they control NY and every other anti gun state like it or not.

 

[Double_J]

After any arrest SUE THE PANTS OFF THE INDIVIDUAL OFFICER, THE DEPARTMENT, AND THE STATE. This will show that you do not appreciate false arrests, and if it happens enough then "maybe" we can get the Federal Justice Department to step in and do an investigation for deprivation of rights under color of law.

 

[X-Rap]

Problem is not many have a money tree to go after gov. entities who misbehave. That's the problem with a police state and NY is very near it. We hope to have representative government and when that fails and they run amok our rights suffer.

 

[lobo9er]

His lawyer cost him $5000 to have the privlage of showing his receipt for the gun at his yet to be held court hearing.

your friend didn't need to hire a lawyer for this. All the lawyer did or will do I suspect is go over the laws with the DA and show the sales receipt, prove the gun is legal and be on his way.

a friend of mine is currently out on bail for a felony arrest on possetion of a pre ban daewoo rifle that he was "NOT" ALOWED to retrieve his purchase receipt during the arrest. His lawyer cost him $5000 to have the privlage of showin

And to be honest the sales receipt has nothing to do with it, its the serial numbers on the gun. I can have a receipt say what ever I want and if the serial #'s don't go along with my story the receipt is worthless. If the serial # says its pre-ban, its legal.

 

[xtriggerman]

As a current NYS corrections officer, i as well as any LEO are indemnifyed from a private law suit while acting in accordance with department directives. What that means is the state will pay for the entire defence of the LEO, while you, joe citizen will need to come up with a very minimum of 60,000 just to get the ball rolling against the NYSP and plan on 8 to 12 years minimum befor any kind of decision is handed down. "Money tree" is an understatement in the prior post. Personaly, i intend to spend my NYS retirement checks in mid state TN in the near future........ cuz once i retire, i to will be subject to the NYS AWB.

 

[hoodfu]

You're right. We should turn in our millions of preban mags right now because we're all just walking around, biding our time until we're falsely arrested. Way to make the law worse than it actually is.

 

[hoodfu]

The reality is that you never hear of NY prosecutions for post-ban mags unless you also hear that it had "law enforcement only" stamped on it. Those people deserve what came to them. As far as the Daewoo pre-ban gun, the ATF has a record of every serial number put through their system since any of this started mattering, and they can easily run a trace on a serial number for a requesting law enforcement agency. If that cop who seized the gun is moving forward with that prosecution, I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt that there's something sketchy involved with it. Receipts don't matter, letters from the manufacturer don't matter. What matters is what the ATF responds back with concerning the first 4473 recorded for that serial.

 

[lobo9er]

hoodfu hit it on the head.
I wondered the same thing if a receipt has that much pull anyways. Only way I see the Receipt mattering in court is if it helps track down the records at the gun shop it was bought or the shops books.

 

[drsfmd]

As far as the Daewoo pre-ban gun, the ATF has a record of every serial number put through their system since any of this started mattering, and they can easily run a trace on a serial number for a requesting law enforcement agency.

Only if their importation data includes that. No serial number is transferred to NICS with a 4473.

 

[X-Rap]

Back at the onset of the national ban there was a list published of serial # for at least AR's that were the cut off numbers for pre/post. I am sure that the same was available for all guns affected by the ban. I'm sure those numbers are readily available to NYSP if they were inclined to use them but the info wouldn't readily be gathered from 4473's unless they did quite a bit of tracking back through the importer/distributor/wholesaler and FFL dealer and even then if it was private sales it would take some more investigation and possibly a cold trail if sellers couldn't recount who they sold to.

 

[xtriggerman]

oops wrong post:

 

[Prince Yamato]

Ship the mags separate from the rifle with a letter reading, "here are the 1970s era mags for your Colt AR-15 per your request."

 

[bushmaster1313]

As far as I know mags over 10 rounds are outright illegal in the city. Preban or not.

Be careful
I think magazines over 5 rounds, even fixed magazines, are illegal in New York City
No Model 12 shotguns in NYC

 

[Frank Ettin]

Old thread and nothing new here.