(OH) Arguments against gun restrictions carry no water

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Drizzt

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Columbus Dispatch (Ohio)

April 23, 2003 Wednesday, Home Final Edition

SECTION: EDITORIAL & COMMENT; Pg. 12A

LENGTH: 648 words

HEADLINE: CONCEALED-WEAPONS DEBATE ;
Arguments against gun restrictions carry no water

BODY:
In the court challenge to Ohio's statutory ban on carrying concealed weapons, history and precedent should weigh heavily on the side of the state law.

Article 1, Section 4 of the Ohio Constitution reads in part: "The people have the right to bear arms for their defense and security." The concealed-weapons statute, on the other hand, bans the carrying of such weapons except under certain narrow circumstances.

The issue is how to square the two.

The constitution uses words of affirmation, while the law uses words of prohibition. Should the law say people may carry under certain conditions, or should it say people may not carry except under those conditions?

Either way, the Ohio Supreme Court would be following tradition and precedent if it upholds the law and reaffirms that the constitution does not confer an absolute right to carry weapons, that restrictions may be placed on that right.

The Supreme Court heard oral arguments last week in Klein vs. Leis, a test case that pits gun-control groups against Second Amendment activists. The case is up on appeal by Hamilton County Sheriff Simon Leis and the state of Ohio after lower-court victories for plaintiffs Chuck Klein, a private investigator, and Patrick Feely, a former pizza-delivery driver.

Earlier, the Hamilton County Court of Appeals affirmed a trial court's ruling that the statute is unconstitutional. The appeals court held that the law is so vague that gun owners cannot tell when they are violating it and that people who are lawfully carrying concealed weapons are subject to arrest and prosecution before they can clear themselves by raising affirmative defenses that the law allows. One such defense is that the carrier is in an occupation that comes with a reasonable fear of criminal attack. In the lower courts' view, the statute unconstitutionally presumes guilt until a person proves himself innocent, because the defenses can be raised only at trial.

The plaintiffs argue that the weapons ban interfered with their work and safety. Feely was arrested, strip-searched and prosecuted for carrying a concealed weapon, then acquitted after proving that he carried it for defensive purposes related to his job. Klein was not arrested, but he argues that he risks being arrested for carrying a weapon he needs for on-the-job protection.

Some of their supporters hope to make this a landmark case that abolishes restrictions on who may carry a gun and when. But their arguments for an unfettered right are off-target.

Words in a constitution are given meaning by the context in which the words were written and by the heft of legal precedent and societal tradition.

Ohio's constitution, like the U.S. Constitution, speaks of the right to bear arms, but both constitutions were written in the context of a society that kept a small standing army and employed citizen militias as a first line of defense.

As the state argues, Ohio has had some type of ban on concealed weapons since 1859, and the bans have withstood court tests. The current law has been on the books in substantially the same form at least since 1917. In State vs. Nieto, a 1920 decision upholding the statute, the state Supreme Court held: "The statute does not operate as a prohibition against carrying weapons, but as a regulation of the manner of carrying them. The gist of the offense is the concealment."

Although some may paint Nieto as outdated, it remains good law today. The Dispatch , for one, does not see the need to change this interpretation of the constitution.

The Hamilton County Court of Appeals may have a point if the statute is being applied in a way that presumes guilt. But this problem can be cured by a ruling that clarifies the law's application, or the legislature could amend the law to do the same. But the state's power to restrict the carrying of concealed weapons should be upheld.
 
"The statute does not operate as a prohibition against carrying weapons, but as a regulation of the manner of carrying them. The gist of the offense is the concealment."

Although some may paint Nieto as outdated, it remains good law today. The Dispatch , for one, does not see the need to change this interpretation of the constitution.

Good. Based on these statements, the Dispatch is for open carry :D

Glad I moved away from that fascist he&%hole. :mad:

MR
 
"The statute does not operate as a prohibition against carrying weapons, but as a regulation of the manner of carrying them. The gist of the offense is the concealment."

Of course, the court also acknowledged that there is a prohibition against carrying in an automobile, either open or concealled. So I can open carry legally as long as I am within walking distance of my home?

Mark
 
its insane to think the surrounding states have a ccarry law,there has been no wild west shootouts over a petty parking space there as im told thats part of the reason we cant have the same law here.people up top afraid we cant handle ourselves or what?apparantly these people dont feel crime is such a big deal here(or its politically motivated to not have cc-laws..),theyve probably never been involved in attempted carjackings either-twice.yeah,wait for someone to stop and help you and call an ambulance to save your bleeding self.:cuss:
 
Its crazy. I live in Michigan, my father lives in Ohio. On my way to visit Dad, I stop at the last rest stop before I cross the border and disarm, unload my handgun, and lock it in a case in the trunk. Ammunition is stored separately. Oh, the absurdity of it all. What am I. a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde? The Ohioans think I somehow trnsform into a dearnged killer at their border? This is just nuts.

By the way, this website had an audio recording of the Ohio Supreme Court precedings. From what I heard, the justices believe that the prohibition on concealed carry is a regulation on one's right to bear arms, and not a ban, as it it NOT illegal to carry unconcealed. Sure sounds like Ohio is getting Supreme Court blessing of open carry.

http://www.ofcc.net/

Wouldn't that be a hoot? The moment I drive across the border, I lift my shirt up to reveal my handgun?
 
The moment I drive across the border, I lift my shirt up to reveal my handgun?

If you try that before this case(s) is(are) resolved, see how many moments it is before you get busted for inducing panic, disturbing the peace, inciting a riot, or some other 100% pure BS bogus charge.

Example...last fall I was working in my garage, cleaning all the cosmoline out of my newly acquired Mosin-Nagant M-44, and the local constabulary stopped by to see what I was doing. After illustrating that I had no 7.62 ammo in the garage, bolt was on the shelf, soaking in a pan of mineral spirits, and rifle was currently not shootable, all was OK.
 
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