Pistol Specific Pet Loads

[LiveLife]

I used the search function and browsed through the threads and the "pet load" suggestions were mostly caliber specific and not pistol specific, often without all the reloading details like OAL used for a particular bullet nose profile. I have found shooting "older pet/target loads" would not reliably cycle the slide of Glock 27 with stiffer recoil springs and many XD owners reported having to shorten the OAL to properly feed in their pistols. Also, many of us have aftermarket barrels in our Glocks and M&P and the pet loads specific to these changes would benefit other shooter/reloaders thinking of doing the same.

Whether you endorse or not, many reloaders DO use Handloads.com to reference an unfamiliar powder/bullet combo or to look for accurate "pet loads" faster than conducting a full load development work up. Also, when max or over-max load data is mentioned (like using max data with shorter OAL) as some powder manufacturer's website now only list max load data (like Alliant), THR members are quick to point it out.

Why not share our "favorite accurate and SAFE" loads with those new to reloading? This way, we'll get them started on the right foot and also provide THR guidance? So I wondered. In the spirit of THR, why not have a "sticky" thread for THR "SAFE" pet loads that is specific to particular pistols? Of course, the usual disclaimers/safety warning would apply.

I can volunteer (and others can do also) and compile the ongoing pistol specific pet loads into a table like Handload.com uses and convert it into a pdf for easy download and viewing/printing.

So, here is the format example I think we can start with (I am sure it will evolve over time) to include: Pistol model and barrel length, Caliber, Bullet make/weight/type/nose profile, OAL, Powder/charge, Primer, Notes/Comments (velocity, felt recoil specific to the pistol, average/best shot group in inches/yards, feed/chambering/ejection/slide cycling, where ejected cases land and other comments like how clean burning the load is).

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Pistol: M&P45 - 4.5" barrel
Caliber: 45 ACP
Bullet: Missouri Bullets 230 gr 18 BHN lead RN
OAL: 1.25" - 1.27"
Powder: W231/HP38 5.0 gr (4.9 actual from Pro Auto Disk)
Primer: Winchester LP
Notes: Mild recoil, accurate target load with average 1.0"-1.5" groups at 7-10 yards (best 1.0" at 20 yards so far). Spent cases land behind and to the right. Clean burning. Even more accurate in 3"-5" Kimber 1911 (Sub 1.0" average groups at 7-10 yards).

Here's a current PDF version of the Pistol Specific Pet Loads.

 

[ReloaderFred]

It's probably a good idea, but I personally don't post load data, for many reasons. I also don't use data from forums, for many of the same reasons I don't post data. It may help some people, but too many will just grab a load and start banging away with it, and not work it up as they should.

Just my .02 cents worth.

Fred

 

[LiveLife]

Here's a draft PDF of the pistol specific pet loads.

 

[LiveLife]

ReloaderFred, the safety disclaimer would indicate that these loads do not exceed the published powder manufacturer's load data specific to bullet weight and OAL. We would essentially be posting below max load data that happens to produce the most accurate shot groups that reliably feed/chamber/cycle the particular pistol/barrel length.

If that is a concern, I can attach another page with the current load data start/max to reference/verify that the pet loads are indeed below published load data.

 

[Jesse Heywood]

What about making it a requirement that a source be cited from published data? Such as Lyman's 49th, pg xxx. Then you can just add a column to the database and not have to attach the load data.

 

[LiveLife]

Jesse Heywood, good point. Some of handloads.com postings do mention the source, but do not site the specific versions of manual/page etc.

Since multiple pet load postings may refer to the same manuals, we can create a published reloading manual/manufacturers' website index (like 1, 2, 3, etc.) to indicate reloading manual versions.

 

[LiveLife]

OK, I added the reference source and start/max load data to the pdf. Here's a second draft of the pistol specific pet loads.

Reference Source:
1 – Hodgdon/Winchester website: http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp
230 GR. LRN Winchester 231/HP38, .452”, 1.200”, Start 4.3 gr (699 fps) 12,200 CUP – Max 5.3 gr (834 fps) 16,900 CUP

 

[LiveLife]

OK, I added the draft disclaimer to the pdf.

Here's a third draft of the pistol specific pet loads.

The following loads were tested to feed/chamber/cycle reliably for the pistol & barrel length (factory or after-market) specified.
All load data used are below the published max load data/OAL as specified in the reference source. The notes/comments are
opinions/personal experience of individuals and their firearms – your experience with your particular firearms may vary.

 

[LiveLife]

Added reloading basics & safety practices (to include reloading manuals) to the PDF.

Reloading ammunition involves potentially dangerous components, equipment and working pressures. It is recommended that those
new to reloading learn the basics and safe practices of reloading by reading published reloading manuals. Observe all safety
precautions and wear eye/ear protections when applicable.

If you want to participate in this project, you can post your pet loads that fed/chambered/cycled your pistol well with good accuracy. I am sure the "best accurate pet loads" will percolate through the discussions and we can add/update/revise to the PDF in an ongoing basis.

We were all young and dumb once. I hope this will give the new reloaders the gift of safe/accurate loads to guide them in enjoying their shooting/reloading hobby/passion.

 

[essayons21]

Pistol(s): 4" and 5" 1911's
Caliber: .45ACP
Bullet: 200gr Plated RN, I have used various manufactures, currently using Proofmark
Powder: 6.4gr Clays Universal
Primers: Whatever I have on hand
Brass: Range pickup
Notes: Extremely light recoil, but accurate range load. I've shot 1000s of rounds of this loading, its my practice round for the range. The POI out to about 15yards is similar to full house 230gr. May not work in all 1911s, especially if you are running a heavy recoil spring, I worked this load up from minimum to where it will reliably cycle all of my 1911s, which run standard recoil springs for their respective lengths.

 

[essayons21]

Pistol: 6" S&W 686
Caliber: .38 Spcl, .357 Mag
Bullet: 148gr LWC
Powder: 5.2gr HS6
Notes: .38 Spcl. Crazy accurate paper punching load.

 

[Walkalong]

Berrys 148 Gr DEWC and 3.5 Grs of Competition loaded at 1.380 in .357 brass with a WSP primer. It is not quite as good, on average, as 3.6 Grs of Competition and the Berrys 148 Gr HBWC loaded at 1.380 in .357 brass with a WSP primer. The second load actually runs slightly slower, but has better ES & SD numbers, especially powder forward. It also has slightly lighter recoil. I prefer it, and will probably try 3.6 Grs.

There is no published data for these loads, but they are light loads that should be safe in any .357 in good condition. They have passed the powder forward testing so I do not believe they pose a threat to stick in the barrel either. Nice light target/plinking loads.

Use at your own risk.

Lots of good loads out there, you just have to try a few things. (Yes, the note on the target says Load #181. Experimenting is fun)

Shot through chrono sitting at 5 yards. If this old man with bad eyes can do this, you young guns should do even better. Both loads shoot well in my 6" Trooper Mk III, 4" 586, and 2 1/2" 686. I betcha they shoot well in my 4" model 19 too. I just haven't tried it yet.


Berrys 148 Gr DEWC at 7 yards. Shot this morning.

 

[1SOW]

A "PF" column for Power Factor might interest a lot of shooters. "Bullet Weight X Velocity / 1000" = PF. 125gr X 1040'per sec / 1000 = 130PF.
Most Spread Sheets/Data Managers will accept the formula and automatically post the results.


CZ75B, 4.72"bbl
9mm
125gr Zero JHP
OAL: 1.10"
3.9grs Vihtavuori n320
Fed SPP
Win Cases
1050'/sec
PF: 131



Notes: A light load with light recoil and flip, good ejections, shoots fairly clean, groups well at 25yds or less, haven't tried longer ranges. Dig Pro Chrono data

These are 'my' results in 'my' gun. Always work up from published data.

 

[Shimitup]

I very generally prefer H110 in my Redhawk 44 mag and Blue Dot in my Desert Eagle 44 mag. Although I get extremely good performance velocity wise from the Redhawk with light bullets and Blue Dot.

 

[LiveLife]

Thanks for the load data. Here's the updated PDF.


1SOW, unless specific chrono velocity at the specified OAL is provided, hard to calculate the exact PF. We could calculate the PF based on the Start/Max velocities to see if that particular load will meet the USPSA/IDPA PFs. What do you think?


Shimitup, need more information than what's provided in the following format.

Pistol/barrel length:
Caliber:
Bullet weight/type:
OAL:
Powder charge:
Primer:
Notes:

 

[LiveLife]

Here's my favorite load for 180 gr 40S&W that's very versatile. At 3.8 gr, it is very light recoiling load that is great for female/9mm shooter transitioning to 40S&W - very accurate even at this light load. At 4.3 gr, it is mild recoiling load that is very accurate. Both loads cycle Glock 22/27 well.

Pistol/barrel length: Glock 22/27 4.49"/3.46"
Caliber: 40S&W
Bullet weight/type: Rainier/Berry's Bullets
OAL: 1.125"
Powder/charge: W231/HP38 3.8 gr - 4.3 gr
Primer: Winchester SP
Notes: Light to mild recoil (lighter and comparable to 9mm factory) and extremely accurate load.

Here's the updated PDF.

 

[essayons21]

Where are you finding published max for a 200gr RN as 6.3gr of Clays Universal? Hornady (closest manual) lists 6.1 as minimum and 7.1 as max. Also COAL of 1.225? Thats way short. I load to 1.250. Max COAL is 1.275.

EDIT: Saw the reference, you used lead wadcutter data. Non-hollow base plated bullets can be run using midrange jacketed data, especially with the low velocity of .45ACP. Higher velocity cartridges you may see some splitting of the plating, but that's not a real worry at 800 fps.

Oh and thanks for compiling this.

 

[Shimitup]

My Ruger is a 7 1/2', The Desert Eagle 6" The image looks kind of strange, it's a screen capture of an old MS Works database. No OAL on the semi's everything with a cannelure is crimped in the cannelure.
The 9's are Ruger P85 and SW6906, .380 Walther PPKS, Ruger .357 is a Security 6 6"

 

[LiveLife]

essayons21, the Hodgdon website provided the following load data for Clays and Universal.

Clays is listed for 200 gr bullets with 3.6-4.3 gr for lead at 1.225" OAL and 3.9-4.3 gr for jacketed at 1.155" OAL.

For Universal, 5.8-6.3 gr for lead at 1.225" OAL and 5.8-6.2 gr for jacketed at 1.155" OAL.

I assumed you meant Universal. I generally use lead load data for plated bullets. Since 6.4 gr was provided with no OAL used, I added the comment to use greater than 1.225" OAL for 6.4 gr. For this project, whenever load data from reloading manual vs latest powder manufacturer's website load data are inconsistent, I will use the manufacturer's data "to be on the safe side" according to the intent of the OP.

Thanks again for the load and hope this compilation helps others.

 

[essayons21]

The load data published by Hodgdon is for very different bullets. I would generally agree with going with the manufacturers published loads, except when the manufacturer has not published data for a particular bullet/powder combo. For example the maximum listed load is higher for lead than jacketed? I'm not familiar with the bullet that is listed on the Hodgdon website, but that doesn't make sense to me.

I started at 6.1g and that wouldn't reliably cycle 100% in 3 different 1911s. I would be afraid to go lower.

I have no problem with your disclaimer, but I really am starting to question some of Hodgdon's published data.

 

[ReloaderFred]

bds,

As I stated, there are many reasons I don't post load data, nor use posted load data. If you read through the average postings on any board, they're full of misspelled words, typographical errors, etc., when trying to convey a simple message. The same applies to posted data, as in transposed numbers, typographical errors, etc. I don't want to be responsible for making an error when typing data, since someone may use it without cross referencing, and vice versa.

Maybe I'm being too sensitive about this, or even a little cynical, but before I retired, one of my duties was proofreading written documents. Even the most careful and learned people make mistakes. They certainly aren't intentional, in most instances, but they do happen.

Your intentions are good, I'm sure, but I would just advise to use caution.

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[LiveLife]

For example the maximum listed load is higher for lead than jacketed? I'm not familiar with the bullet that is listed on the Hodgdon website, but that doesn't make sense to me.

essayons21, listed max for lead is higher because the OAL is longer at 1.225" compared to the shorter jacketed OAL of 1.155"

Maybe I'm being too sensitive about this, or even a little cynical, but before I retired, one of my duties was proofreading written documents. Even the most careful and learned people make mistakes. They certainly aren't intentional, in most instances, but they do happen.

Your intentions are good, I'm sure, but I would just advise to use caution.

ReloaderFred, I agree with you. Just using essayons21's question about lead load being higher than jacketed as an example, if the reloader overlooks the importance of not paying attention to the listed OAL and uses shorter OAL for max load meant for longer OAL, then you'll have over max pressure situation.

Note: From now on, if the pet load data is over the published max, I will reduce charge to the published max used as reference/source.

Hmmmm. I think at least, I'll post more warning/caution about observing the published OAL. For those posting more pet load data, providing OAL used will help. Also, even though I am double checking the listed/reference information (I am also copy/pasting from the website/load manuals to minimize typographical/transfer errors), if you note errors, please point them out so we can correct them.

Here's an updated PDF with the warning/caution on OAL. I also put source/reference information (OAL/Start/Max load data) in parenthesis for quick reference and to help the reloader determine whether the pet load is near or at max load. I hope this helps.

 

[LiveLife]

OK, finalized the disclaimer to include explicit warning/caution on observing the published start/max/OAL load data. For this project, please only submit accurate pet loads that are below published load data/OAL. Sorry Walkalong, but I think we may need to do another "unpublished" safe pet loads (PM sent). Here's the updated PDF.

Revision: 10/11/10
The following loads were tested to feed/chamber/cycle reliably for the pistol & barrel length (factory or after-market) specified.
All load data used are referenced with published start/max load data/OAL as specified in the reference source. The notes/comments
are opinions/personal experience of individuals and their firearms – your experience with your particular firearms may vary.

= WARNING/CAUTION = Please observe the listed/published OAL (Overall Length) and note using shorter OAL will increase the
chamber pressure. If the load is at near or at max load, DO NOT USE SHORTER OAL! If you want to be on the safe side, using
longer OAL than listed/published load data will decrease the chamber pressure.

Reloading ammunition involves potentially dangerous components, equipment and working pressures. It is recommended that those
new to reloading learn the basics and safe practices of reloading by reading published reloading manuals. Observe all safety
precautions and wear eye/ear protections when applicable.