Please diagnose my 625 reload troubles

[ChristopherG]

Here's my problem (at least the one I'm trying to solve right now): When speedloading my 625, my moonclips won't drop all the way in. I've chamfered the cylinder mouths, and I don't think they're my problem--it's farther down in the cylinder.

I'm loading Berry's 185 gr. HBRN bullets. I started at 5 grs of 231, and moved up by stages to 5.5, since I was getting granules of unburnt powder at the lower charges (which would get under the ejector star etc., hanging things up in a bad way). At 5.5 grs, I don't see any granules in the way, but there still appears to be enough 'crud' (to get technical about it) on the chamber walls (and on the sides of ejected cases) to make it sticky to put new cases in without having to shove them down the last quarter inch or so. This is a problem when going for fast reloads, which, let's face it, are why I'm shooting the 625 in the first place. So what's to be done? Do I need to shoot a fuller charge, to create enough pressure to seal the cases against the cylinder walls (which would put me WAY over the necessary 125 power factor), or should I be polishing the cylinders, or using a different powder, or what? It's starting to get me down--at last night's IDPA shoot, I more or less fell apart on two stages when my reloads broke my rhythm, and I'd like to put a stop to it.

Thanks for sharing your experience--
CG

 

[scott45b]

Chrisotopher G:

Ran into the same problem using Winchester 231 in my 625. It seemed that once the debris was baked into the cylinder bores, I had to brush out the bores after every other load. The rounds would not drop the last 1/8 of an inch. Switched to Titegroup, a cleaner burning powder. Have not had the problem since

I use a 200 gr RN bullet with 4.0 gr of Titegroup and Federal primers

Hope this helps

 

[JoeHatley]

ChristopherG,

Starting with clean charge holes, how many rounds can you shoot before the "crud" starts slowing down your reloads?

Joe

 

[Jim K]

That gun has sharp shoulders in the chambers for case support, just like an automatic. This allows it to fire OK without the clips, but if the case is not crimped right, crud can get between the case mouth and the chamber wall and the result will be as you describe.

If you are not already doing so, try using a taper crimp, just as if you were loading for an auto pistol. The cleaner powder suggestion sounds good, also.

Jim

 

[mec]

You probably already know this but just in case: The revolvers are much less forgiving of the full diameter of the bullet sticking out past the case mouth than most autopistols. Loads seated to the handbook recommended depth for autos often fail to fuly chamber in revolvers.

 

[ChristopherG]

Thanks for the suggestions and comments so far:

Joe--from clean and dry to sticky only takes a couple of moonclips worth.

Mec--an interesting reminder about seating. I'm trying to seat right to the ogive, and I don't think the bullets are the problem, since they'll drop right in to the shoulder/case rim when the gun is clean.

Jim--you could have an interesting point, here. I'm accustomed, having loaded only for revolver cartridges before stepping into .45 acp, to using a tighter crimp to solve this kind of problem (e.g., to get complete ignition with a slow-burning powder like 296/110, a mega-roll crimp); you're suggesting almost the opposite, but it makes a certain amount of sense. I'll check the crimp for sure.

Scott--you sound directly aquainted with my problem here, and I'm going to try Titegroup, of which I have a little on the bench. Think I'll start at 4.3 or 4.5 (for the slightly lighter bullet) and see how it goes. What kind of 200 grainer are you using, and do you have any chrono data (or good guesses) about its PF?

Thanks again--
CG

 

[scott45b]

ChristopherG:

I have not checked within the last 60 days, but I believe that a PF of 135-140 is what I have been attaining with the 200 gr load. These were chrono'd for the IRC, Utah State IDPA and South Mountain Showdown (Regional).

 

[ChristopherG]

Knocked a few rounds together yesterday, and 4.3 grs of Titegroup looks just fine; no more sticking, they drop right in. I may try to back that load off just a little more--see if I can get down to 4.0 and still have complete ignition behind the 185 gr. bullet. That oughta make that 625 barrel pretty steady, I'd think.

Thanks all, for your input.

CG

 

[Jim Watson]

Well, you seem to have it sorted out, but I'll mention that I use Clays in light load .45s for my old sawn off M25-2. Very clean for the easy reload.

I also carry one of those 6-brush cylinder cleaners and drybrush about every other stage.

 

[knzn]

For what it is worth I have both a 625 and an old 25-2. The 25-2 take a reload all day long, and the 625 I have to brush oftern.

 

[knzn]

Forgot!

I just remembered something! Back in "the old days" when pin shooting was king, and the reason I purchased my 625 and 25-2 in the first place, the importance of having good moon clips. When I first purchased my 625 I bought a hand full of moon clips at a gun show. Although at the time I didn't know it was their fault, but I had all kinds of problems getting my fresh reloads to fall in the chambers. Someone at a pin shoot saw my problems and told me that if I only used moon clips from Ranch products that my problems would be solved, and he was pretty much right. I don't even know if the Ranch product people are still around, but I think the folks at Wilson Combat make a good moon clip too. So, if you are using moon clips of unknown origin, you may give these a try.

 

[scott45b]

If moon clips are a problem, try the RIMZ 625 polymer clips. They might just give you another perspective.

 

[Stainz]

I had the same problem - first with LSWC's, then with the same 185gr Berry's RNHB's - and after I had loaded 1,000 of them with 5.1 gr W231, too! They are now meant solely for my Marlin Camp 45 carbine... it loves them!

That rim step in the cylinder, even if not lightly fouled, is the culprit. Some of my LSWC's wouldn't drop all of the way, so I reseated them all - deep, too. I then tried reseating a few RN - both 185gr & 230gr - to 1.200" OAL - voila, a fix! The switch to Tite Group helped, too.... and Federal primers allow a lower strength hammer leaf as well.

I chrono-ed my 5.1, 5.3, & 5.8 gr W231 & Berry's 185gr RNHB (WLP) to yield 662, 683, & 744 fps. That lowest level was a PF of 122... I would suggest the 5.3gr level - PF of 126. By comparison, the 230gr FMJ's hit 734 fps with 5.3gr W231 (PF - 168) - leave less residue. The TiteGroup is better... I just loaded ~500 rounds with 4.5gr and shall chrono them when I can (Some nut shot the range's chrono... again!). Very consistent and less residue.

Look for crumbled crimped copper at the crimp, too... a little crease can keep a moonclipped bunch from fully seatting, although it may 'drop-in' by itself. I load my 65 moonclips (Wilson Combat - excellent, although pricey.)at one time - and remove my 625's cylinder, while I am cleaning it, to test fit the clipped rounds before placing them in my ready locker. Note: I never had a problem loading/shooting the $10/box 230gr FMJ Blazers...

Stainz