Powder for 45 Schofield

[jski]

I’ve been looking for good loads using 230 gr Berry’s bullets for my 45 Schofield brass. Hodgdon has multiple recommendations:

• Clays
• HP-38
• Titegroup
• Trail Boss
• Universal

But not much from other powder marketeers? (You really can’t say manufacturers because they don’t manufacture powder.)
Recommendations?

 

[MEHavey]

Red Dot (as one might expect)
https://thefiringline.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6632935&postcount=15

 

[jski]

Red Dot (as one might expect)
https://thefiringline.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6632935&postcount=15

I’d like something the generates >900 FPS.

 

[MEHavey]

I’d like something the generates >900 FPS.

Note that (op cit) load was a 260gr bullet doing ~715fps actual (LABRADAR)
Note also service loads:

Bullet mass/type Velocity Energy (Wiki)
200 gr (13 g) Lead SWC 859 ft/s (262 m/s) 328 ft⋅lbf (445 J)
230 gr (15 g) Lead (factory load) 730 ft/s (220 m/s) 276 ft⋅lbf (374 J)
250 gr (16 g) Lead 710 ft/s (220 m/s) 283 ft⋅lbf (384 J)

What frame/what bullet are you trying to fire where you are effectively trying to duplicate 45 Colt loads?
(Not necessarily recommended in that short Schofield case -- nor does Hodgdon show such loadouts either)

 

[Targa]

I don’t know about the other powders on your list, I haven’t used them but I don’t think you can go wrong with HP38/Win231 and Universal. I am using both for 9mm, .38 special, .45acp, 45 Colt and for light magnum stuff in .357mag, .44mag and even .454Casull.

 

[jski]

Note that (op cit) load was a 260gr bullet doing ~715fps actual (LABRADAR)
Note also service loads:

Bullet mass/type Velocity Energy (Wiki)
200 gr (13 g) Lead SWC 859 ft/s (262 m/s) 328 ft⋅lbf (445 J)
230 gr (15 g) Lead (factory load) 730 ft/s (220 m/s) 276 ft⋅lbf (374 J)
250 gr (16 g) Lead 710 ft/s (220 m/s) 283 ft⋅lbf (384 J)

What frame/what bullet are you trying to fire where you are effectively trying to duplicate 45 Colt loads?
(Not necessarily recommended in that short Schofield case -- nor does Hodgdon show such loadouts either)

I’m using Berry’s 230 gr bullets. I’ll be firing them thru a S&W 45 Colt Mountain Gun. The brass is Starline.

Nothing fragile!

 

[MEHavey]

Go for it then....

 

[AJC1]

Well you know mater of factly there is a unique load floating around. Also herco would be a good choice. Seems like faster powders are preferred in this cartridge.

 

[Barbaroja]

My I ask why your using the Schofield cases? No 45 colt available?

 

[AJC1]

My I ask why your using the Schofield cases? No 45 colt available?

Sounds like he has brass he wants to use...

 

[MEHavey]

230 lead/ 925fps/5" barrel/In descending order of pressure (21K down to 14K), with acceptable fill/burn.
Stronger actions -- not breaktops

21,000 psi
Norma R1
Vihtavuori N32C Tin Star
Hodgdon TiteGroup
Shooters World Sparta 100
Vihtavuori N320
Shooters World Clean Shot
Hodgdon HP38
Winchester 231
Ramshot Zip
Hodgdon Universal
Vihtavuori N340
Shooters World Ultimate Pistol
Vihtavuori N330
Winchester WAP
Ramshot Silhouette
Ramshot True Blue
Winchester 540
Hodgdon HS-6
Hodgdon Longshot
Vihtavuori N350
Vihtavuori 3N37
14,500psi

 

[AJC1]

230 lead/ 925fps/5" barrel/In descending order of pressure (21K down to 14K), with acceptable fill/burn.
Stronger actions -- not breaktops

21,000 psi
Norma R1
Vihtavuori N32C Tin Star
Hodgdon TiteGroup
Shooters World Sparta 100
Vihtavuori N320
Shooters World Clean Shot
Hodgdon HP38
Winchester 231
Ramshot Zip
Hodgdon Universal
Vihtavuori N340
Shooters World Ultimate Pistol
Vihtavuori N330
Winchester WAP
Ramshot Silhouette
Ramshot True Blue
Winchester 540
Hodgdon HS-6
Hodgdon Longshot
Vihtavuori N350
Vihtavuori 3N37
14,500psi

Missing the good part of the data.

 

[EricBu]

AA#2 is a good Schofield powder. They even have published load data in the Western Powders manual.

I should add, I do 4.7 grains of AA2 or Shooter's World Clean Shot in a Cowboy 45 Special case under a 180 RNFP, that should be real close to a schofield load...might even be right there as a start load in schofield under a 230.

 

[Barbaroja]

Sounds like he has brass he wants to use...

I was asking if there was a particular reason behind it. No mailice intended in my question.

 

[AJC1]

I was asking if there was a particular reason behind it. No mailice intended in my question.

None inferred. I started loading 38 for my 357 for the same reason. Piles of 38 brass and nothing else to do with it.....

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

.45AR/ACP loading data should put you right at .45 Schofield +P. The case volume will be real close. I'm going to guess you aren't using old balloon-head .45 US brass.
Brian Pearce pet loads article on .45AR +P: https://www.handloadermagazine.com/45-auto-rim-p

 

[jski]

My I ask why your using the Schofield cases? No 45 colt available?

I like the smaller cases. They’re just enough smaller to make them quicker to load and unload. And, of course, less case capacity is sometimes better when the powder occupies only a small % of that capacity.

Sometime go read one of Mike "Duke" Venturino’s rants in American Handgunner about the case capacity of the 45 Colt.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

I like the smaller cases. They’re just enough smaller to make them quicker to load and unload. And, of course, less case capacity is sometimes better when the powder occupies only a small % of that capacity.

Same reason .45 Cowboy exists?

 

[jski]

Same reason .45 Cowboy exists?

Exactly!

On the other side of the coin, it’s also the reason the 454 Casull exists too.

Titegroup is often used because it’s position independent. So if you have but a few grains of Titegroup in your 45 case and you’re pointing the barrel down when you fire, when the those few grains are resting on the copper of your GC bullet, everything still works well. Of course, the Schofield case doesn’t completely remedy this but it is better.

BTW, I do love history so here’s a little piece of history most are unaware of: The 45 ACP performance wasn’t based on the 45 Colt rather it was base on the 45 Schofield. Hence the reason the 45 ACP was first seated with a 230 gr bullet, standard for the Schofield, rather than a 255 gr bullet, standard for the 45 Colt.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

Exactly!

On the other side of the coin, it’s also the reason the 454 Casull exists too.

Titegroup is often used because it’s position independent. So if you have but a few grains of Titegroup in your 45 case and you’re pointing the barrel down when you fire, when the those few grains are resting on the copper of your GC bullet, everything still works well. Of course, the Schofield case doesn’t completely remedy this but it is better.

BTW, I do love history so here’s a little piece of history most are unaware of: The 45 ACP performance wasn’t based on the 45 Colt rather it was base on the 45 Schofield. Hence the reason the 45 ACP was first seated with a 230 gr bullet, standard for the Schofield, rather than a 255 gr bullet, standard for the 45 Colt.

That's why I pointed you to .45AR and ACP data. Basically, a standard pressure/mid-range .45AR/ACP lead load is a higher pressure/high-end .45Schofield lead load. The case dimensions don't quite align but they're close and it's pretty easy to back-calculate case fill to compensate.