Question for Colt DA Pro's

[markallen]

I was at my local LGS this morning and looking at a 1917 .45acp revolver.
Sorry I don't have a photo. But I'm asking for some value on this one.
I can list some things here. I'm not asking for a close price, just a ball park, as I think he is asking too much for it.
The revolver is all complete, and original.
Grips are original but seem almost newer, so probably replacement stocks.( I have, since I posted this been looking at other 1917's, and they have wood stocks. The one I looked at had plastic, or bakalite stocks).
Biggest deal here is the gun has been chrome plated.
All the Colt trademarks, and numbers have been buffed off. And it has be reissued a new serial number.
The lanyard and swivel are intact.
The timing is good, and the gun functions.
Rifling is clean, and crisp.
Barrel is five inches and the front sight looks, as close as I can tell correct.
He is asking $450.00 for it. Since this is a shooter only, I was thinking closer to $350.00.
I did ask him if he was willing to wiggle, but he seems set at $450.00.

Thanks for any help.

 

[Guillermo]

the chrome job and buffing really kill the value

350 is max in my book

I would not purchase it but if you want it, I would suggest about 300.

Understand that a 1917 is probably worth 500-800 (some more) in unrestored condition.

 

[Old Fuff]

The model 1917 was a military version of the Colt New Service. Commercial versions usually came with black, gutta-percha (sometimes called "hard rubber) stocks, which to some look like plastic. If the markings, numbers, etc. have been polished off there is no way to tell a commercial New Service from a military Model 1917.

I wouldn't consider a nickel plated New Service/Model 1917 to be an especially good choice as a shooter, mainly because of its small/hard to see sight picture, and the knowledge that if something broke getting it fixed would probably be difficult and expensive. If the revolver was in original, like-new condition it would be worth somewhere in the $800 to $12,000 ballpark. As it is I would consider $350 to be high, and doubt I'd buy it at all. It has next to no collector's value, and if I was looking for a .45 ACP shooter I'd put my $450 (the asking price) toward a S&W model 25.

 

[DPris]

I'd say it has absolutely no collector value whatever.
Also would not touch the thing if the serial's been altered.
Denis

 

[Old Fuff]

I'd say it has absolutely no collector value whatever.

Sure does!! Some people collect paperweights.

 

[Guillermo]

he is looking for a shooter, not a collector.

Even though none of us would like to own it, some folks like such things.

Cheap enough it would be a good shooter. (if you like heavy, long trigger pulls)

 

[Old Fuff]

Like I said, if it's really a model 1917 you have a very thin front blade matched with a little "U" notch at the back. Add to that nickel plate in (maybe) bright sunlight...

And after buying it for $300 to $450 (whatever) it stops working and needs to be fixed (more expense)...

I like New Service Colt's, although the handle (not to mention the rest) is way too big for my hand... But personally for a shooter I'd buy something else.

On the other hand it would make a great Fitz Special!

 

[Guillermo]

it would make a great Fitz Special!

you would "fitz" a 3 inch Python

 

[DPris]

Fuff,
Yep, you're right, it would make a great paperweight.

I also agree it'd be not be a very easy gun to shoot well.
I brought home a 1918-made 1917 recently. Mechanically great, gunsmith I traded into it from brought it fully up to speed internally, uniform patina, original wood in good shape.

Were I not a fan of certain classic guns (1917 included), I wouldn't own one. This one I CAN shoot all I want, but you're absolutely right on the tiny sights (which would NOT be improved with shiny plating) and awkward grip.
I'm delighted to have a sample, and I will shoot it, but not much.
Others may feel differently about buying a 1917 to shoot.

It's the "re-issued" serial that'd be a huge deal killer for me, even if I did collect paperweights.
ATF frowns mightily on illegal paperweights & I don't want one in the house.
Denis

 

[waidmann]

If its that remodeled, don't discount the notion thats its a .455 New Service with a shave job. That would go toward explaining a smooth bottom and grips.

I would have to know more before endorsing this one at $250.

 

[bikemutt]

Not sure if this is an important consideration for you but I don't believe the Colt M1917 will headspace without moon clips. I prefer if they do, the S&W version does, sometimes I get lazy at the range and bag the moonclips, the spents just fall out of mine.

I really thought I was going to like my 1917 Smith but really I don't so much, the only plus for me is I traded a gun I liked even less for it. The model 25 as Old Fuff said would be my recommendation. The 25-2 is a pleasure to shoot all day.

 

[rcmodel]

The very early Colt 1917's had straight through bored chambers and did require half-moon clips.

After S&W entered the fray and D.B Wesson invented the half-moon clip, they chambered them so they headspaced on the case mouth just like a 1911 pistol, so they would shoot without clips, but wouldn't eject the cases.

At that point, Colt followed S&W's lead and properly chambered all later 1917's so they would work just like the S&W 1917.

Supposedly almost all the early Colt 1917's were called back in and modified with the new style cylinders.

I have a Colt collector friend who has an early one with original bored through chambers, but it's the only one I think I have seen.

rc

 

[markallen]

Thanks for the replies.
I don't NEED a .45acp revolver, but I thought if cheap enough, it would be something different, and a occasional shooter. And the idea of shortening the barrel to 3" for a snubbie, had crossed my mind, since I knew the collectors value was shot due to the chrome plating.
And yes the cylinder is bored to headspace on the cartridge.
I did take into account any future gun smithing in case it needed it.
Also the re-issued serial number gave me pause. I know that sometimes frames are damaged, and new serial numbers are given to the frame, but who issues the new number? And to what government agency is the number given to? BATF?.
Any how. thats why I wanted to check here first. To see if it was worth while.
What a shame it's a nice looking revolver despite the chrome job.

 

[waidmann]

ATF supplies the new number, there should be documentation. An M-1917 Colt has the distinction of having two official serial numbers, the one concealed by the crane and the Army serial on the butt.

 

[DPris]

If it doesn't come with ATF paperwork regarding the serial change, again- I would not touch it.
You don't just swap numbers around & then send a by-the-way note to those people.
Denis

 

[DPris]

Where IS the new serial number?
Denis

 

[XxWINxX94]

I'm not sure if its even worth the trouble as a shooter with the re-finish, new S/N, etc. You could save another $100 or so and find yourself a nice, authentic one with original finish and whatnot.