Rimfire double stack?

[Blakenzy]

Why is there such resistance to designing and putting out double stack magazines for the .22LR? I know rim bind can be an issue, and that perhaps the magazine will have to adopt a rather curved profile, but does this prohibit the making of one? There are some rimfire pistols that do have them for .22WMR, the new Keltec, Grendel, so it is indeed possible. So far, the vast majority, to not say all, of .22LR pistols and rifles limit themselves to single stack, usually no more than ten round magazines. Even the longer aftermarket magazines for some rifles seem to have trouble reaching the 30 round capacity. Is there a AWB on rimfires I am not aware of?

I sometimes look at the size of the magwell on a 9 mm pistol with a .22 conversion and think to myself "my, I bet 50 rounds could fit in there if it were double stack", but no, in .22LR I have to settle for less rounds than the pistol holds when loaded with it's much bulkier centerfire rounds.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Pistols normally do not use true double-stack magazines. Pistol magazines are usually double-column, single-feed (look at one and see how it tapers near the top.)

The first Ciener magazines for its M1911 .22 conversion kits were double column, single feed and held 15 rounds. I have one.

 

[Blakenzy]

Yes, I understand most pistol magazines taper near the top to expose a single round to be chambered, but I didn't realize there was a difference between the terms double stack and double column. Thanks for the correction I guess.

Still, the question remains why the single stack popularity, and the virtual absence of double column in guns that are usually intended for plinking (high volume shooting)?

 

[ArmedBear]

The way that .22 pistols generally solve rim bind is to stack the rims so each is behind the one before it.

If you put more rounds in the same space, the angle of the magazine gets steeper and steeper, and no longer fits in a grip with a reasonable angle or size.

What Vern Humphrey wrote about double-column, single-feed is especially significant with .22LR magazines. If a .22LR pistol doesn't feed or jams, it's most often a problem with the feed lips. That's with single-column magazines. DCSF would be very hard to do with the reliability we've come to expect from even cheap .22s.

Finally, with various magazine size limits, and with pistol competitions for .22LR using 5 rounds for most stage, 10 max, there's little demand for more than 10, at least considering the downsides.

All of that said, Browning's Double Helix is a design that offers a compact rimfire magazine. I wonder how that would work in a higher capacity.

 

[MachIVshooter]

The longer .22 WMR cartridges stack flatter, so getting a row of 15 to behave nicely is easier than it is with the LR.

I would think the best way to accomplish it would be with a mag that tapers toward the front, so that the bullet end would be more of a slightly offset single column, while the rim end would be more of a true double column. The little Phoenix HP-22 uses this concept; Though it is a single stack magazine, the rims are a bit staggered.

 

[Myles]

Didn't KelTec announce a double stack pistol in .22 WMR, back in November?

I remember thinking "I want one!" But haven't heard a peep since.

 

[oldgold]

http://www.kel-tec-cnc.com/images/PMR30-handout-v3-31.pdf

 

[Jubjub]

The Kel-Tec isn't like a 9mm magazine. It's basically two single stacks side by side that feed alternately.

 

[35wailen]

http://www.kel-tec-cnc.com/images/PM...dout-v3-31.pdf

Holy SWEET! That bundle of evil is clearly meant to compete with the 5.7

 

[jackstinson]

There are various 10/22-based "double-column single-feed" magazines used in pistols which are 30 and 50 rounds. Of course, the pistols which utilize them have the long curved magazine in front of the trigger. There are also 50-round drum mags for the 10/22 type actions. Getting anything like a 30-round 10/22 mag to fit inside a pistol grip is another matter however.

I have an old Tec-22 pistol with Ramline-made 30-round "double-column single-feed" magazines (Ramline 10/22 mags with the Intratec logo on them). And as odd as it sounds, if I stick with the Ramline brand mags, my Tec-22 is actually a very reliable feeder. I know, I know.....hard to believe...but it works for me.

BTW: When Kel-Tec chose to repop/revise the Grendel, I was quite disappointed to see they didn't offer a companion .22LR version this time around. I would have signed up for that in a heartbeat. The price of .22 Magnum cartridges are so high that a pistol chambered for them is of zero interest to me.

 

[Myles]

I'd love to see the Grendel in .17HM2 - no idea why, but that would fascinate me.

 

[hso]

Got a Grendel. Fun to shoot. More novelty than anything.

 

[Blakenzy]

For those that have mentioned you own the "higher capacity" magazines for rimfire ammo, how do they function? Is rimbind a significant problem?

BTW are those Ramline mags still in production? They seem very hard to find.

 

[Palehorseman]

The wife has a little Bersa Model 23 in .22 rf. Short as it is, the mag still has a capacity of 10 rds. This is due to an enlarged bulge at rear of mag which allows the rims of rounds to shift to the sides, rather than impinging directly on top of one another.

 

[nitetrane98]

My Ceiner .22 conversion mag for my Browning High Power holds 15 rounds. While externally it looks like a double column affair, in reality it's still just single column with maybe a little bit of side by side stacking to accomodate another 5 rounds. They still stack in one in front of the other. The mag is the exact same length as my true single column mag for my Challenger II.

The Ceiner has been great. Glad I bought it from an individual and didn't have to bother with JAC.

 

[MachIVshooter]

Holy SWEET! That bundle of evil is clearly meant to compete with the 5.7

Not really. It is a revival/revision of George Kellgren's P-30, which predated the Five-seveN by a decade.

 

[[Pb]]

I have had very bad jamming issues with 3 different Ramline double stack 50 round 10/22 magazines.

 

[LiveLife]

BTW are those Ramline mags still in production? They seem very hard to find.

I also had problem with Ramline magazines. I switched to Butler Creek 25 round single stack magazines and tossed Ramline mags. I have 0 problems with Butler Creek mags and they are $15 at Cabelas.

http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/t...40614&cm_ite=0041238227775a&_requestid=150639

 

[22-rimfire]

From a plinking perspective, I see little difference. 10 to 15 rounds is enough for me. I'll just carry extra mags. When I was 15, a 25-round mag was fun and I have never seen a larger capacity mag (>25) function reliably with any consistancy. I have some, but they just lay in a box somewhere. Never used them beyond maybe one plinking session.