S&W 59: A few questions

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w_houle

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Is it okay to dry fire? How do I get used to the difference between DA and SA?
I'm glad I wasn't at an actual range, or they might not have been happy. I brought it to my little shooting spot and loaded it. I de-cocked and took aim, then fired. Nice trigger, and everything worked fine. Okay, so I go to pull the trigger again and end up pulling the trigger three times in very quick succession. I breathe and calm down a bit, and fire another round. It's a very easy trigger. I de-cock it and try the DA trigger again. Yep... It's definitely longer and stiffer than SA, but good. All right, I got this:) and then proceed to double tap it:( I shoot the rest of the magazine SA, pack up and call it a day. Needless to say I am not used to this trigger.
Now what?
 
Make it a feature, a skill, place all of your shots on target and squeeze out the whole magazine in two or three seconds.
 
Has the gun been worked? TDA S&W triggers are decent in SA mode, but not that light.
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I don't know if it has or not. It wasn't advertised as such, but it is literally the best trigger that I've squeezed.
 
My first pistol in 1978 was a S&W model 39, durring the Ban I picked up a model 59. These pistols have not been in production since the mid 80s, the pistol was spotless, the trigger was scarry. Double taps, unintentional double taps, like an automatic burst sometimes. It became a safe queen, traded it off about 6 months ago, for a CZ PCR, at least the trigger is as advertised, just a typical service pistol. For a sweet trigger get a good model 1911, or a S&W 952, but a 30 year old pistol like my 59 was mechanicaly worn out IMO.
 
It's OK to dry fire a 59. Just don't dry fire it without the slide in place. That has been known to knock the block out of the frame which junks it.
The DA pull on a 59 will typically run 10-12 lbs. The SA pull will typically run 3-4 lbs and is considerably shorter pull than in the DA mode. The trigger reset on the S&W autos are very quick so getting that 2nd and subsequent shots in SA mode can be a surprise for those not use to the gun.
To truly get use to the trigger you're going to need to burn some ammo in practice. A box of ammo won't do it. A good practice drill is firing 2 rds. Fire the first rd DA and the 2nd rd SA. Decock the gun and repeat the exercise. You're going to do this hundreds of times over a period of days, not just one time out. Take your time and don't rush it. You're trying to get use to the trigger pull and the transition from DA to SA.
It's not hard to master, it just takes practice. It's like acquiring any other skill - practice. It's not hard. Thousands and thousands of LEOs were trained to master the DA/SA trigger.
 
I good friend of mine was a Cop back in the late 70s/early 80s. He carried a 59 Nickel in a Jordan River holster. He was way ahead of his time. RIP John G.
 
you mention the smoothness of the trigger and the lightness, but you don't talk about how well you're placing the rounds on target.

try pressing the first DA shot until it breaks and than holding the trigger to the rear. then release the trigger only to the point of reset, before slowly beginning to slowly press the trigger again to fire the next shots while your sight are aligned on the target.

the best way to learn this is to de-cock your gun after every two shots so that you're shooting a DA shot for every SA shot. learning a smooth DA trigger press will make your SA shooting better
 
w_houle said:
Is it okay to dry fire? How do I get used to the difference between DA and SA?
I'm glad I wasn't at an actual range, or they might not have been happy. I brought it to my little shooting spot and loaded it. I de-cocked and took aim, then fired. Nice trigger, and everything worked fine. Okay, so I go to pull the trigger again and end up pulling the trigger three times in very quick succession. I breathe and calm down a bit, and fire another round. It's a very easy trigger. I de-cock it and try the DA trigger again. Yep... It's definitely longer and stiffer than SA, but good. All right, I got this:) and then proceed to double tap it:( I shoot the rest of the magazine SA, pack up and call it a day. Needless to say I am not used to this trigger.
Now what?
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First off, l love the fast reset on a S&W DA/SA type pistol. It sounds like you need to learn the SA (single action) first. With an empty gun and empty magazine inserted. Cock the gun and press the trigger back until it dry fires. HOLD IT BACK against the frame after the hammer drops. Don't let the trigger go forward again until you have recocked it. Now let the trigger go forward slowly, until you hear a click or feel it reset. Cock it again (using the weak hand) and repeat it until you hear and feel the trigger reset again. The travel distance needed to reset the trigger is very short. Usually less than a quarter of an inch. Its a common mistake to let the trigger finger go all the way forward off of the trigger and then slap it back onto the trigger, resulting in the gun firing before your ready to do so. Keep constant contact on the trigger from all the way back (against the frame) to the short reset point while dry firing and you should learn the trigger on that gun pretty quickly.

A second area that can cause this is the grip. A loose grip thats too LOW on the backstrap can cause the gun to rock back and forth in your hand and cause it to fire before your ready. Keep the hand high on the grip and use a firm two handed grip until your more confident.

Third, the finger position on the trigger. There is a tendency to use the joint of the finger to pull the heavy double action and then reposition the finger to use the pad or fingertip for single action. Don't do that! It can also cause the single action to fire before your ready. Instead position the pad or tip on the trigger at the start and use the same position for both modes of the trigger. Double and Single action. Master this while dry firing and if you still have problems shooting it, then I would have an armorer look at it.
 
I bought one of those brand-new back in the early 80's. I never did make friends with that gun, the only one I've ever had that just didn't like me.
 
The first generation (Model 39/59) not only had so many problems of reliability, they also could discharge if dropped (if the safety wasn't engaged). One magazine years ago did an article entitled, "Why a $49 Raven .25 is Better Than a $220 S&W 9mm 59." The magazine showed numerous photos of the 59 jamming. Some time after that article appeared, S&W finally fixed the reliability problem, but the gun still would discharge if dropped. The next generation (459/559/659) fixed all of those problems and was a much better gun -- but the 59 continued to be popular with collectors.

Massad Ayoob wrote a book on combat handguns in which he said that the second generation fixed all the problems except the ergonomic ones, which I didn't agree with (as I liked the ergonomics of both the first and second generation pistols). The third generation also was excellent, but other than the 3-dot sights, offered no substantial improvements.

Alas, when the third generation of pistols passed, I lost all interest in S&W autos. I recall the excitement over the 59 when it first appeared -- the idea of a 15-shot 9mm was electric. Alas, because it was unable to take JHPs (even after the reliability problem was fixed), it was generally looked down upon by .45 fans.

If you ever find a good deal on a 659 or 5906, go for it. They just don't make them like that anymore. Indeed, they can't make them like that and keep the gun under a grand. You can get some good deals on them if you look around.


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, S&W finally fixed the reliability problem, but the gun still would discharge if dropped
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The discharging if dropped wasn't a reliability problem. That's just the way the 1st gen S&W autos were designed just like a lot of other autos at the time, 70 series Colts included. Their design did not include a firing pin block which was included in the subsequent generations. Few autos in the 60s-70s had firing pin blocks and risked firing if dropped from sufficient height and it hit on the muzzle at just the right angle.
The problem with feeding and ejecting could usually be traced to people using lower powered ammo which didn't run the slide right to eject/feed reliably. Use hot ammo and keep them lubed and they would work fine.
 
I got to playing around with it today and did some dry firing of it and the DA trigger has some travel to it, while SA is less than an eighth of an inch. So it's just something to be mindful of.
... you don't talk about how well you're placing the rounds on target.
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Umm... I didn't actually have a target per se. I was just popping off rounds at hedge apples. I just managed to get it from my FFL and wanted to run a few rounds through it to see how well it would function.
Hey Confederate, do you have an idea has to when that article came out? I want to see what those dollar values look like when compared to inflation.
 
I have a virgin NIB M-59 I got way back in 1977 in my collection. She went back for the recall and even has adj sights option. She was the 1st of the wonder nines. Only thing close was an old browning HP.
 
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