Shipping a gun given to me from WV to MO

[dogtown tom]

kingpin008

Quote:
I said we were going to do the transfer...way back earlier in the post. The debate as to whats legal kept going, after I decided I was going to do the transfer. As in, I'll see what the local gun shop says, either way I want a locking case.

What you don't seem to understand, is that you CAN'T have it transferred to you while you're in state.

Sure he can.........for a rifle or shotgun. And I posted how to do so above.

Federal law clearly allows nonresidents to acquire rifles or shotguns outside their state of residence from a licensed dealer. All the OP needs to do is have his grandfather take the long guns to a local dealer and have them transferred to the OP right on the spot. The handgun would require shipping to the OP's state of residence.

 

[rellascout]

The reality is that you are clearly ignorant of the law. That you do not understand it nor are you willing to take the advice from people who do understand the law.

YOU CANNOT TRANSFER THE PISTOL IN THE STATE OF WV UNLESS YOU ARE A WV RESIDENT. PERIOD...

Now you can transfer a shotgun to you in WV, again if you can find a FFL willing to do it. A lot of FFLs will not do this type of transfer even though it is legal. You then can transport that gun to MO.

 

[hirundo82]

What you don't seem to understand, is that you CAN'T have it transferred to you while you're in state. The only legal way to do it is to have it shipped to a FFL in your state.

That depends on the gun, since the OP's grandfather was considering giving him either a shotgun or a handgun.

You can legally recieve a long gun from a FFL in a state in which you are not a resident as long as that is OK with the state where the FFL is located and your state of residence (I'd be surprised if either WV or MO had a problem with it). The OP could therefore get the shotgun transferred to him by a FFL in WV.

However, a handgun can only be transferred by a FFL in your state of residence. The OP's grandfater would have to ship the handgun to a MO FFL.

Or he could just take possession of the long gun and ship it to himself (or take it on the plane in accordance with FAA/TSA requirements). It is perfectly legal to buy long guns interstate without FFL involvement under federal law. It is only illegal for a non-FFL to ship to another non-FFL interstate.

A private party transfer cannot legally take place between residents of two different states. It is the residency of the parties that makes it illegal, not the state where it occurs.

 

[rellascout]

Federal law clearly allows nonresidents to acquire rifles or shotguns outside their state of residence from a licensed dealer. All the OP needs to do is have his grandfather take the long guns to a local dealer and have them transferred to the OP right on the spot. The handgun would require shipping to the OP's state of residence.

If you can find an FFL willing to do the transfer. Lots will not. I know a lot of FFLs who do not want to have to book these types of transfers. It is not worth the time and the extra work. I have seen FFLs refuse long gun purchases out of their inventory to out of state purchasers. Just because its legal does not mean every FFL is going to do it. Think about how many FFLs will not receive a gun from a private citizen from outside their state. Perfectly legal but a lot of them refuse.

You are also ignoring the fact the OP states:

He's old school, and paperwork other than a signed statement from him with his name, address and phone number, and the gun make and serial number stating he is giving it to me as a family heirloom is out of the question.

Does not sound like Grandpa feel the need to follow the law.

 

[rellascout]

However, a handgun can only be transferred by a FFL in your state of residence. The OP's grandfater would have to ship the handgun to a MO FFL.

Yet his is looking to pick out a FAA approved case for a pistol or a shotgun...

 

[hirundo82]

How hard is it to find a locking case for a pistol or rifle... just about any gunshop? or online with QUICK delivery as I'll only be in town a week.

TSA regs say hard-sided locking case with locks to which only you have the key/combo (ie non-TSA locks). Any sporting goods store should have an appropriate case; heck, I bet you could find one in just about any WalMart in WV.

Yet his is looking to pick out a FAA approved case for a pistol or a shotgun...

Multiple people in this thread have told him the legal way to do the transfer for a handgun or long gun, now it's his choice to follow it or not. I'm just passing along how to avoid getting arrested at the airport for inappropriately transporting a fiream in his checked luggage.

 

[hirundo82]

If you can find an FFL willing to do the transfer. Lots will not.

Depends what part of the state we're talking about. Bubbles is in the WV panhandle; I bet she'd be willing to do the long gun transfer.

 

[NavyLCDR]

Holy he said, she said, I think batman.

How about this:

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/18/usc_sec_18_00000922----000-.html

18 USC 922, Federal law:

(a) It shall be unlawful—
(3) for any person, other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to transport into or receive in the State where he resides (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, the State where it maintains a place of business) any firearm purchased or otherwise obtained by such person outside that State, except that this paragraph (A) shall not preclude any person who lawfully acquires a firearm by bequest or intestate succession in a State other than his State of residence from transporting the firearm into or receiving it in that State, if it is lawful for such person to purchase or possess such firearm in that State, (B) shall not apply to the transportation or receipt of a firearm obtained in conformity with subsection (b)(3) of this section, and (C) shall not apply to the transportation of any firearm acquired in any State prior to the effective date of this chapter;

That makes it illegal for the grandson to receive any gun from the living grandfather as a gift because they are residents of different states, unless the gun is transferred through an FFL.

(a) It shall be unlawful—
(5) for any person (other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector) to transfer, sell, trade, give, transport, or deliver any firearm to any person (other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector) who the transferor knows or has reasonable cause to believe does not reside in (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, does not maintain a place of business in) the State in which the transferor resides; except that this paragraph shall not apply to
(A) the transfer, transportation, or delivery of a firearm made to carry out a bequest of a firearm to, or an acquisition by intestate succession of a firearm by, a person who is permitted to acquire or possess a firearm under the laws of the State of his residence, and
(B) the loan or rental of a firearm to any person for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes;

That makes it illegal for the living grandfather to give any gun to the grandson as a gift without going through an FFL because they are residents of different states.

(b) It shall be unlawful for any licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to sell or deliver—
(3) any firearm to any person who the licensee knows or has reasonable cause to believe does not reside in (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, does not maintain a place of business in) the State in which the licensee’s place of business is located, except that this paragraph (A) shall not apply to the sale or delivery of any rifle or shotgun to a resident of a State other than a State in which the licensee’s place of business is located if the transferee meets in person with the transferor to accomplish the transfer, and the sale, delivery, and receipt fully comply with the legal conditions of sale in both such States (and any licensed manufacturer, importer or dealer shall be presumed, for purposes of this subparagraph, in the absence of evidence to the contrary, to have had actual knowledge of the State laws and published ordinances of both States), and (B) shall not apply to the loan or rental of a firearm to any person for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes;

That makes it illegal for a West Virginia FFL to transfer any firearm other than a rifle or shotgun to the grandson because the grandson is a Missouri resident. A rifle or shotgun may legally be transferred to the grandson by a West Virginia FFL. The grandson may be legally transferred any firearm by a Missouri FFL.

Once the grandson receives the guns via an FFL transfer, they are his to transport however he sees fit to West Virginia. They can go in checked baggage on an airplane, they can go in a car with him. He can mail, via US Post Office or ship via UPS or FEDEX a rifle or shotgun to himself. He can ship via UPS or FEDEX a handgun to himself.

 

[rellascout]

Depends what part of the state we're talking about. Bubbles is in the WV panhandle; I bet she'd be willing to do the long gun transfer.

I know in my town in S WV 3 out of the 4 FFLs would not do this transfer. Guess which one I use.... LOL

 

[rellascout]

Well stated LTNavy. My issue is that he continues to talk as if he can legally transfer a pistol in WV and then transport it to MO which he cannot.

Also unless I misunderstand him he thinks it is OK to transport the shotgun via airplane to MO and transfer it there.

 

[NavyLCDR]

49 CFR 1540.111, Federal Regulations:
http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/tex...8&view=text&node=49:9.1.3.5.10.2.10.6&idno=49

§ 1540.111 Carriage of weapons, explosives, and incendiaries by individuals.

(c) In checked baggage. A passenger may not transport or offer for transport in checked baggage or in baggage carried in an inaccessible cargo hold under §1562.23 of this chapter:

(1) Any loaded firearm(s).

(2) Any unloaded firearm(s) unless—

(i) The passenger declares to the aircraft operator, either orally or in writing, before checking the baggage, that the passenger has a firearm in his or her bag and that it is unloaded;

(ii) The firearm is unloaded;

(iii) The firearm is carried in a hard-sided container; and

(iv) The container in which it is carried is locked, and only the passenger retains the key or combination.

You can get a suitable gun case at Wal Mart or any sporting goods store for $5 to $10 and it gets a standard, non-TSA padlock on it that only the owner of the firearm retains the key/combo to. The gun case can then be placed in a regular suitcase, if desired, along with the spare underwear, socks, etc. Just keep it readily accessible inside the suitcase because the airline counter may want you to open it to show the gun is unloaded. The gun case can also go completely separate and outside all other checked luggage, but I wouldn't recommend it.

 

[rellascout]

I agree with others for a long gun which has been transfered in WV a $10 Plano case from Walmart with a proper lock will do.

 

[NavyLCDR]

Well stated LTNavy. My issue is that he continues to talk as if he can legally transfer a pistol in WV and then transport it to MO which he cannot.

Also unless I misunderstand him he thinks it is OK to transport the shotgun via airplane to MO and transfer it there.

1. He cannot legally have the pistol transferred to him in West Virginia. The current owner of a pistol, the grandfather, will have to ship a pistol to a Missouri FFL for transfer.

2. He cannot legally take any firearm to any FFL for transfer to himself. The owner of the firearm, the grandfather, must deliver or ship the gun to an FFL for transfer to the new owner, the grandson.

 

[rellascout]

1. He cannot legally have the pistol transferred to him in West Virginia. The current owner of a pistol, the grandfather, will have to ship a pistol to a Missouri FFL for transfer.

2. He cannot legally take any firearm to any FFL for transfer to himself. The owner of the firearm, the grandfather, must deliver or ship the gun to an FFL for transfer to the new owner, the grandson.

Agreed and from my reading the OP does not understand either of these points.

PS he has already admitted to committing a felony.

If I was driving, I guess it would not be an issue. I did that back in Feb. He gave me two 22 rifles.

 

[GWARGHOUL]

Sorry but you are clearly ignorant of the law. There is no way you are going to transfer a pistol in WV. You should be able to do a long gun if you find a FFL who will do it.

You have already admitted to committing a felony....

If I was driving, I guess it would not be an issue. I did that back in Feb. He gave me two 22 rifles.

Sorry but your actions reflect poorly on the rest of the shooting community.

Your attitude makes worse reflections than my ignorance of insane laws. Seeing as I posted here to get the education. I find such comments slightly abusive.

What you don't seem to understand, is that you CAN'T have it transferred to you while you're in state. The only legal way to do it is to have it shipped to a FFL in your state. So, unless you're planning on checking an empty gun case on your flight back home, we were correct in assuming that you were flirting with a felony.

In short, if you don't like people calling you a poor example of gun ownership, don't go around misunderstanding or ignoring the law.

I came here to find out such laws. I'm not a bad example because of a simple mistake on my past actions. I will put a $100 that almost everyone here has broken a gun law, either on purpose or because of the natural ignorance that comes with insane gun laws.

Point being, I came here to learn, and learn I have. No reasons for the personal attacks, or insulting demeanor. To me, that speaks poorly of our community, more so that someone seeking answers that has made a mistake.

 

[rellascout]

Whats the best way that's either legal, or closest with the least hassles?

:banghead:

 

[GWARGHOUL]

The reality is that you are clearly ignorant of the law. That you do not understand it nor are you willing to take the advice from people who do understand the law.

YOU CANNOT TRANSFER THE PISTOL IN THE STATE OF WV UNLESS YOU ARE A WV RESIDENT. PERIOD...

Now you can transfer a shotgun to you in WV, again if you can find a FFL willing to do it. A lot of FFLs will not do this type of transfer even though it is legal. You then can transport that gun to MO.

Someone seeking information, and you want to call them ignorant?

Come on, with the demeanor that you're speaking, yes, I find it insulting.

If you want to take me calling you out on your attitude, a threat... you're out of line and should probably re-asses what you consider a threat.

I'm not here to be treated like crap for posing a question or two. I'm also no posing the question to be picked apart, mis-understood, or misconstrued into something its not.

SOME people in the community have a real "gun guy" complex, and if I didn't see right through it, I would have already left.

I've been educated in this thread...AWESOME...
I've been insulted in this thread... NOT COOL..
I've been offered help by a member with a local FFL, and a PM or two from some member... MOST HELPFUL AND KUDOS..

 

[GWARGHOUL]

Whats the best way that's either legal, or closest with the least hassles?

I probably should have presented that the way I intended to mean it. I didn't mean as an alternative to legal...

With that being said.. lets focus on the topic at hand, and quit the pissing match please.

 

[rellascout]

If you are getting the shotgun have your great grandfather bring it to a local WV FFL. Then have that FFL transfer it to you. Then place it in a FAA approved case, get one at Walmart, and transport it to MO via plane train or automobile.

If your Great Grandfather is giving you a pistol have him ship it directly to a FFL in MO via common carrier like Fed Ex or UPS and transfer it in MO. OR have your Great Grandfather take it to a local WV FFL and have him ship it to your local MO FFL via USPS Priority Mail, depending on what the WV FFL charges this will be cheaper than shipping directly via common carrier. UPS and Fedex will require you ship overnight with Adult signature etc..... which is expensive.

These are the two scenarios you need to explore.

 

[GWARGHOUL]

Thank you rellascout.

 

[scythefwd]

You can be willed the gun. No FFL transfer is needed. I do not know if you can ship the handgun to yourself at your residental address. You can a long gun, hunters do it all the time. They ship the rifle to the hunting "resort" in care of themselves and they sign for it there when they get there.

A will, as in last will and testiment, can pass a gun from one person to another without a ffl as long as the gun can be legally owned (no sbr, aod, destructive device, full auto, you get the point). You will have to have proof that the will, at least that part, was enacted before he died.

 

[Art Eatman]

More than enough correct answers...