smith m19 question

[dakotasin]

went into a local gunshop this weekend to browse a bit and found 3 smiths that caught my eye. i've been looking for a blued 357 s&w for awhile that i liked, and i think i found it.

there were 2 586's, which i really like because i am comfortable and familiar with the 686. but, these 586's had issues that prevented me from buying. the third gun was a model 19. beautiful blue, wood grips, etc etc. i really think i can love that gun.

my question is one of strength. how strong is the 19 compared the 686? would i be better off holding out for a 586 than picking up this 19? will the 19 tolerate a diet of nuclear-level loads like the 686 does?

need some help here - this may be one of the most beautiful factory guns i've seen, and i'm smitten - i needs some detached help before i buy something that will not work.

purpose of the gun is hunting.

 

[18DAI]

The model 19 is probably the finest revolver ever made, in my opinion anyway. No, it won't tolerate using "nuclear loads" exclusively, but then why would you want to? Doing that with a model 19, would be like using a surgical scalpel to cut bologna. If you use 158 grain 357's, and only shoot them as 10% of the total rounds shot, your grandkids will shoot that 19.

 

[dakotasin]

thanks.
couldn't sleep last night thinking about this gun - it really is a beautiful piece. i think i just better go pick it up.

 

[jad0110]

The Model 19, though not as strong in the forcing cone department as an L Frame, is still quite capable of withstanding standard 158 grain loads.

However, if this gun will be shooting a significant number of nuclear powered stuff , I would pass. The 686 and others, including the S&W N Frame and most any Ruger would be better choices for your purposes.

Do you know the specific Model # for that 19? It would be located inside the cylinder crane on the frame. It will says something like M19-0, -2, -5 etc etc.

How much was it? I ask because the 19s are sweet guns that are tough to pass up if the deal is right, even if it is not right for firing a ton of heavy loads. If I had the $$$, I'd buy it in a heartbeat.

Be sure to use the revolver checkout sticky at the top of the forum. Pay special attention to the forcing cone - look for signs of cracking or excessive wear, especially at the 6 o'clock position.

 

[dakotasin]

the gun appears to be unfired. there is no bluing wear, no turn ring, and everything it comes with is brand new/appears to have never been used (badger grips, crimson trace grips, factory grips, scope mount, cleaning kit, speedloaders, speedloader carriers - but no box).

i *think* the gun is a 19-4, but i could be mistaken there. is there a particular -# to avoid?

i checked it for lockup and the thing locks up tighter than my 686, and the gap between the cylinder and barrel is smaller than my 686. i really think this is a pristine piece.

 

[jad0110]

is there a particular -# to avoid?

i checked it for lockup and the thing locks up tighter than my 686, and the gap between the cylinder and barrel is smaller than my 686. i really think this is a pristine piece.

The Model 19-4 was made somewhere between 1977 and 1982 I believe. Though some believe S&W's quality control could have been better in the 70s and 80s, a lot of great guns were made during that era.

I think you answered your own question. If it is in excellent condition, I don't see any reason why NOT to get it, assuming the price is decent.

I have a S&W Model 14-4 38 Special made in 1980 that is a fantastic gun. The -4 S&Ws may not be as collectible as older guns, but I don't plan on selling it so the $$$ value doesn't matter much to me.

If you get that 19, be sure to post pix!

 

[Old Fuff]

The reason S&W came out with their L-frame *86 revolvers was because the lighter K-frame .357 Magnums couldn't stand a steady diet of some Magnum loads. Ruger did the same when they discontinued their Security Six and Speed Six revolvers in favor of the GP-100.

The lighter K-frame revolvers offer a handy, easy to carry and shoot platform that's fine for occasional use with Magnums. This is especialy true with model 19-8's that had a beefed up frame and other srength improvements. All model 19's will last almost forever on a diet of regular and Plus-P .38 Specials, with an occasional .357 Magnum thrown in.

 

[XavierBreath]

will the 19 tolerate a diet of nuclear-level loads like the 686 does?

No, it will not. Expect the forcing cone to crack at 6:00. Although the cracking has been connected with a steady diet of 125 grain bullets, I would think a diet of "nuclear-level loads" would do the same. Once the forcing cone is cracked, the gun is toast. There are no more Model 19 barrels out there, except for ones attached to guns.

The 19-4 is a P&R gun, and it will increase in value. If you can get it at a great price, you may be able to use it as trade for a 686. A true NIB Model 19 should run around $450. Excellent $400. Of course, a 686 is about $25-50 more. 586's sell for about $700 NIB, 525 or so in Excellent condition. Shooting the Model 19 will decrease it's value if it's NIB, so maybe it is better to hold on to your cash. Cash is liquid, guns are not.

I'd pass on the Model 19, and buy something more suitable to the intended use you state.

 

[lee n. field]

need some help here - this may be one of the most beautiful factory guns i've seen, and i'm smitten -

Buy it. If it's like mine, you will love it.

What I have heard (internet gunboard hearsay, take it for what it is worth. If you break your gun, you get to keep the pieces), is that what the Model 19 doesn't like is a steady diet of super hot 125grain loads. Anything else is fine.

 

[Old 112]

dakotasin; I have made the decision, for toploads, to run my 19 with only
Hotter +P 38 or Cool 357 with only the heavier bullets on top of both. As far as buying the 100% 19, you can look at as an ART investment or enjoy shooting it, or both if the price is right. Either is valid. BTW, what is the barrel length? And yes, guns like this can cause one to be "smitten" and lose sleep. Old 112

 

[svtruth]

Get it

I have one and as my (non-gunny) wife said when she first saw it, "what a beautiful gun"
Damn the cost, you will soon put more than that in ammo through it.
Good luck.

 

[Confederate]

The reason S&W came out with their L-frame *86 revolvers was because the lighter K-frame .357 Magnums couldn't stand a steady diet of some Magnum loads. Ruger did the same when they discontinued their Security Six and Speed Six revolvers in favor of the GP-100.

The difference, of course, is that the Smith was upgraded of necessity and the Ruger wasn't. Some people mistakenly believed that if magnum loads were too much for a K-frame Smith, they'd be too much for a Ruger Security-Six. Ruger "updated" their guns only because Smith did.

And I think it was a mistake.

True, 125gr JHPs were very hard on the S&W 19/66 forcing cones, but heavier bullet weight magnum loads were hard on the frame. Ruger had a solid frame design and massive topstraps, but Smiths did not. Some users soon discovered that their side plates weren't fitting too well in guns that had been shot a lot with hard recoiling magnum loads. In time, the frames would warp. Thus, when Smith designed their new magnums, they added more beef to the 1) frames, 2) cylinders, and 3) topstraps. Ruger frames, as noted, already were immune; their cylinders also were larger, with the notches offset so they weren't over the weakest part of the cylinder. And Ruger topstraps (on the Security-Six, anyway) were as massive as their single-action magnums.

The Smith 19 is a fabulous revolver and I would be tempted to leave it in pristine shape. But it is an excellent shooter.

 

[cherryriver]

I've got Model 19s and they are without a doubt my favorite Smiths. The proportions, the handling, the just plain looks, are so right. I have one that's a total beater and it just shoots and shoots and shoots. Since that's what guns are for, that's the goodness thing.
But I have no illusions- 19s are .38 Special revolvers adapted to .357. The 19 will bend and break with magnums sooner than guns made for magnum use in the first place. Smith went through some bad times with the 19 and 66 when they were used hard.
That's where the L-frame came from and why they discontinued the magnum Ks.
That doesn't make the the 19 a bad gun. It's a sensational gun, but it has limits.
Anyway, I think you should go back and get the 19. Geez, I'm thinking about it now, too.
That's coming from a guy who considers guns with prancing ponies to be a good place to dump the gun-cookie jar into.
Bill