Struggling with .357 WC

[kelbro]

I have some 148gr DEWC that shoot lights out in 38Spl cases but I can't get them to shoot worth a flip in my 357 cases. Same pistol (S&W 586).

Tried upping my 38 load by 10% and worked around there.

I found two or three powders that clicked in the 38 cases. Any suggestions for the 357 cases?

I had them seated flush in the 38s. Should I still seat them flush in the 357s?

 

[joneb]

What powder/s are you using? Same primers ?

 

[Walkalong]

Tried upping my 38 load by 10%

Up it by .1 grain. Maybe .2 depending on burn rate.

I found two or three powders that clicked in the 38 cases. Any suggestions for the 357 cases?

Clays. 700X.

 

[Smokey Joe]

.357 WC's...

I use 'em for bullseye league. I, too, have a S&W 586, & like it much. BEE-Youtiful trigger, eh, wot??

I use a small load of W 231 behind a 148 grain DEWC. Have tried several brands of small pistol primers; my conclusion is that the brand of primer doesn't matter for target pistol loads. Gotta watch the cases CAREFULLY for a double charge when loading, but that's doable.

Decided to use .357 cases for the target loads instead of having .38 Spl cases for some uses and .357 Mag cases for other uses. It worked, so that's what I do.

 

[capbuster]

I dont know if this will be of any help but I also have a 586 and use both 38special and 357magnum target loads in it. They do very well for me using ww231 powder and a 150 grain cast swc bullet. The powder difference between the two is only 3/10ths of a grain. I also use a redding profile crimp die for each. Good luck and take care.

 

[kelbro]

Thanks for the replies. Primers? Yes. Just remembered, SP for the 38 and SPM for the 357. And I'm using 700x and clays. I will try backing down a little.

I was just thinking that if I chrono'd the good 38 loads and then ran the 357s up to the same speed, they should be pretty close. Same chamber and barrel. Just a little less 'jump'.



Just weighed them. They run 151.5 +/- .5gr. Water dropped wheelweights with ~2% tin. I don't have a hardness tester but I would guess that they are plenty hard. No leading to speak of.

 

[joneb]

Just remembered, SP for the 38 and SPM for the 357. And I'm using 700x and clays. I will try backing down a little.

Why would you use magnum primers for those powders ?

 

[kelbro]

Habit? I normally shoot 2400 and 158gr SWC in this pistol. Had a batch of sized, expanded, primed brass in the container and just never thought twice about it. That's probably the problem.

 

[joneb]

That's probably the problem.

Could be. I've loaded those cast slugs with good results using Bullseye and W231 with standard small pistol primers for .357 Mag.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Tried upping my 38 load by 10% and worked around there.

I agree only upping the charge .1gr to .2gr depending on the powder speed.

I found two or three powders that clicked in the 38 cases. Any suggestions for the 357 cases?

Any powder that works well for your .38 Special target loads should work equally well for the same target load in a .357 Magnum case. I found the best powder for 38/357 target loads using lead bullets is W231/HP-38.

I had them seated flush in the 38s. Should I still seat them flush in the 357s?

If the bullets have no grooves seat them flush. If they are DEWC bullets with a groove at both ends I crimp in the groove. (even though it's an extremely light crimp)

Like said above, no reason to use a Magnum primer with the powders you are using. Actually I wouldn't use a Magnum primer with 2400 either. Magnum primers are only necessary with hard to ignite ball powders like W296/H110. I've found accuracy suffers when using a Magnum primer with 2400. I would suggest trying .2gr over your .38 Special load of 700X in the magnum case but using a standard SPP instead.

Good luck...

 

[kelbro]

Appreciate it guys. Going to load some up tonight with the SPP and try again tomorrow.

 

[243winxb]

Should I still seat them flush in the 357s?

The case wall thickness is more heavy in the 357. This could mean when you seat your bullet deep, the brass might be sizing the bullet diameter smaller.

 

[joneb]

Should I still seat them flush in the 357s?

I seat to the crimp groove leaving the bullet out about 1/8".

The case wall thickness is more heavy in the 357. This could mean when you seat your bullet deep, the brass might be sizing the bullet diameter smaller.

Good point 243.

 

[kelbro]

Thanks. I will use the first crimp groove.

 

[docsleepy]

To avoid a double charge, I took a paper clip and created a shape that looks like this:

|
|
|____ _______
| |
| |
| |
|___|

That I can slip down in a case. The horizontal members establish a datum by catching on the case mouth. I have the U shaped section so that it will JUST touch a single-load of WW231 powder....if you double charge it, it will be completely covered by the powder and obvious.

rats: it doesnot show the same way on the display as it did in the edit box....

It is simple and quick to check and gives me a lot more peace of mind.

 

[kelbro]

I like to charge and seat one at a time.

 

[kanook]

me too, until I get a progressive. It sucks when the wife and I both go to a match. Wanna guess how many hours I spent behind a single stage loader?

 

[loadedround]

Simple solution, shoot what works and use the 38 special cases. You don't need magnum cases for target work.

 

[kelbro]

Simple solution, shoot what works and use the 38 special cases. You don't need magnum cases for target work.

Shot a lot of 38s in this pistol but swabbing out the extra crud in the cylinder gets to be a pain after a while.

Besides, it gives me a reason to load more and shoot more

With handguns, I need all the practice I can get. My wife and daughter shoot two or three times a year and always smoke me on the pistol range.

 

[kelbro]

Update. Switching to the SPP primers did the trick. My normal 38 loads in the 357 brass worked well as did the 38 loads+ 0.1gr of both the Bullseye and the 700X. Loaded the WCs to the first crimp groove (just a little protruding from the case) and used a light crimp.