christcorp
Member
Sam; here's some pics of my mag. They all are identical. I've given quite a few away; but I still have about 10 left. They are all the same.
Thermold AR Magazines review. Providing info, no arguments please.
- Thread starter christcorp
- Start date
- Status
I have 8 Master Mold 20s that I use all of the time, I like 20s for range shooting. These were purchased pre 1994. I shoot them in Colt AR15s, no problem locking open or any other problems. Have 5 Canadian, maple leaf, 30 rounders that has been use since pre 1994 and have no problems. Also have about 20 - 30 rounds thermolds mag and again they have preformed without a problem. I keep a few loaded at all time and have had no problems with them. I feel confident in using all of these mags.
Sam Cade
Member
Patent Pending means that a patent is on file but has not yet been granted.Since that process can take years the absence of a number means nothing as far as legitimacy.
The magazines are Dated 1993.
They were purchased new.
I personally opened the box that they came in, it was a large sectioned corrugated paper box containing around 300 magazines each in their own individual cell.
and fwiw, I'm pretty sure all of these are real.
Late 2008 Dated P-Mag, Pre-M revision
http://img251.imageshack.us/i/premw.jpg/
Late 2009 Dated P-Mag, Most M revision
http://img220.imageshack.us/i/postmj.jpg/
TD ARC magazine, fresh from the wrapper.
http://img577.imageshack.us/i/arcpat.jpg/
And a Fusil from 12/2008
http://img806.imageshack.us/i/fusil.jpg/
...and I've had even worse luck with the few 30 round Thermolds that I have tried to use.
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christcorp
Member
Please don't "TRY" and give me a lesson on patents. I know exactly what a pending patent is. It also means NOTHING about the other magazines you are showing me. I was mentioning the Thermolds. They received their patent in 1994. It's also in 1994-1995 when the AWB when into affect. And the ONLY hi-cap magazines that could be sold, were to Law Enforcement and military/government use. That's why the ones from 1995 and on say "LE & GOVT Only" on them.
My point being; it's quite possible that there were QA issues or even a sub contractor producing the ones you had. The ones from 1995-2004 were ONLY MADE FOR Law Enforcement and Military Use. I trust them. Those are the ones I originally mentioned. Those are the ones I suggested. I can't speak for yours, because they aren't the ones I'm talking about. Sorry; don't know what to tell you. It's quite possible that the "CIVILIAN" magazines (Prior to 1994) didn't have the bolt hold open on the magazine.
Again; lets deal with apples and apples. My original thread, is about Thermold, 20 round, Master-Mold, Made in the USA, LE/GOVT only, (Which means after 1994). The reason I brought up the patent number; is because ALL of the LE/Govt magazines that I'm talking about, WILL HAVE A PATENT NUMBER ON THEM. These were made for military use only at the time. Maybe it was a totally different standard prior. But those are the ones I've been using for years, and those are the ones that I've NEVER had a problem with. And apparently most people haven't.
So; for all those others who might be interested. CDNN is selling the ones I'm talking about. 1995-2004. If you find some in a shop, make sure it says LE/Govt only on them. It will also have a patent number. This shows that it was built after the automatic weapons ban went into affect; and these magazines were not manufactured for civilian use. I trust these magazines. FYI. CDNN redid their weekly special. The magazines are back to $3.99 each, with a flat rate shipping on all orders.
My point being; it's quite possible that there were QA issues or even a sub contractor producing the ones you had. The ones from 1995-2004 were ONLY MADE FOR Law Enforcement and Military Use. I trust them. Those are the ones I originally mentioned. Those are the ones I suggested. I can't speak for yours, because they aren't the ones I'm talking about. Sorry; don't know what to tell you. It's quite possible that the "CIVILIAN" magazines (Prior to 1994) didn't have the bolt hold open on the magazine.
Again; lets deal with apples and apples. My original thread, is about Thermold, 20 round, Master-Mold, Made in the USA, LE/GOVT only, (Which means after 1994). The reason I brought up the patent number; is because ALL of the LE/Govt magazines that I'm talking about, WILL HAVE A PATENT NUMBER ON THEM. These were made for military use only at the time. Maybe it was a totally different standard prior. But those are the ones I've been using for years, and those are the ones that I've NEVER had a problem with. And apparently most people haven't.
So; for all those others who might be interested. CDNN is selling the ones I'm talking about. 1995-2004. If you find some in a shop, make sure it says LE/Govt only on them. It will also have a patent number. This shows that it was built after the automatic weapons ban went into affect; and these magazines were not manufactured for civilian use. I trust these magazines. FYI. CDNN redid their weekly special. The magazines are back to $3.99 each, with a flat rate shipping on all orders.
speaksoftly
Member
I've never spent any extended amount of time with Thermold or Magpul mags on a full auto platform. However, I've put more than a few rounds down range one 3 round burst after another and they've both been fine. I prefer P-Mags for my personal rifles but I doubt that I'd be able to wear either out any time soon.
Quentin
Member
Well the 20rd Master Molders I bought at Sportsmans Warehouse recently are identical to christcorp's pictures, right down to the same patent number and the numbering/lettering in each picture. I guess the 95 is 1995 and they're selling new old-stock?
TylerPearce
Member
Any thoughts on the 10 rounders?
Maverick223
Member
IMO the STANAG magazine is the weakest link in the AR platform, therefore purchasing good (not necessarily exorbitantly priced premium) magazines is a smart move for longevity and reliable service. In my quest for good quality examples I have tried many brands and types of AR magazines, including the Thermolds; the following is a brief synopsis of my findings:
Good: USGI (cheap and easy to find, seldom used but still quite good)
Better: Magpul PMag (great general purpose magazines)
Best: Lancer L-5 (used for HD/SD)
The above three have proven to work well for me (and are currently the only ones I use) despite moderate cost (none are particularly costly). OTOH many others, while slightly cheaper, afford inferior durability and/or reliability. The Thermold ones, while not horrible, didn't perform spectacularly well either (there were a few malfunctions, but I don't recall ever having broken any), about on the same level as C-Products magazines IME. At the other end of the spectrum, there are Pro-Mags and nameless/counterfeit Al. magazines, these have been horrible and no matter the cost should be avoided (but if tempted, go with the Al. ones...their scrap value is higher).
WRT followers, the SS CMMG followers have worked best for me, but require some modification (to the magazine and/or follower) to fit in some magazines (like L-5s and 20rnd USGI). The Magpul followers are not much worse (just not as smooth IME) and require no modification to fit most magazines (and are polymer so trimming, if necessary, is a great deal easier). Additionally, all magazines (despite capacity or profile) provide better service when "anti-tilt followers" are installed, because even the straight 20s slightly tilt the follower due to the taper of the cartridges. This can, and has, caused stoppages and jams. I don't believe that leaving them out is worth the risk or aggravation.
FWIW, I prefer the 20 round variety much better because they are more compact (particularly useful when firing prone or from a bench), lighter, and ammunition generally comes in these convenient little 20 round boxes. If you need more ammo then you probably aren't doing something right, or haven't enough friends on your side of the argument.
Good: USGI (cheap and easy to find, seldom used but still quite good)
Better: Magpul PMag (great general purpose magazines)
Best: Lancer L-5 (used for HD/SD)
The above three have proven to work well for me (and are currently the only ones I use) despite moderate cost (none are particularly costly). OTOH many others, while slightly cheaper, afford inferior durability and/or reliability. The Thermold ones, while not horrible, didn't perform spectacularly well either (there were a few malfunctions, but I don't recall ever having broken any), about on the same level as C-Products magazines IME. At the other end of the spectrum, there are Pro-Mags and nameless/counterfeit Al. magazines, these have been horrible and no matter the cost should be avoided (but if tempted, go with the Al. ones...their scrap value is higher).
WRT followers, the SS CMMG followers have worked best for me, but require some modification (to the magazine and/or follower) to fit in some magazines (like L-5s and 20rnd USGI). The Magpul followers are not much worse (just not as smooth IME) and require no modification to fit most magazines (and are polymer so trimming, if necessary, is a great deal easier). Additionally, all magazines (despite capacity or profile) provide better service when "anti-tilt followers" are installed, because even the straight 20s slightly tilt the follower due to the taper of the cartridges. This can, and has, caused stoppages and jams. I don't believe that leaving them out is worth the risk or aggravation.
FWIW, I prefer the 20 round variety much better because they are more compact (particularly useful when firing prone or from a bench), lighter, and ammunition generally comes in these convenient little 20 round boxes. If you need more ammo then you probably aren't doing something right, or haven't enough friends on your side of the argument.
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PandaBearBG
Member
- Joined
- Aug 3, 2009
- Messages
- 463
I got 4 20 rounders, marked Master Mold - LE/Govt use only. for the most part they feed ok, an occasional double feed for one in particular. I live in the desert, so guns get hot, weathers hot, etc. maybe the feed lips are weak b/c occasionally the front of the top round will spring up which is the probably cause of the double feed. Also they are a bitch to positively lock and seat in the mag well, I got to press down and really jam them in for them to click. For me I am not a fan, I'll switch to metal or magpuls if I find the right deal. Just my personal experince.
christcorp
Member
Maverick; you wrote:
Good: USGI (cheap and easy to find, seldom used but still quite good)
Better: Magpul PMag (great general purpose magazines)
Best: Lancer L-5 (used for HD/SD)
My only difference would be for best, is to take the USGI surplus magazines, (Which i find all the time for $5-$6; and replace the follower with a Magpul Generation III for about $1.50). For about $7, I believe it's the best magazine. If you look at my original post in this thread, all of my 30 rounders are USGI with gen III followers. I only like plastic magazines if they are 20 rounders.
Quentin: Once the AWB went into affect in 1994, the only hi-cap magazines were for Law enforcement and govt/military use. There are some later productions of the thermolds available. I've seen 2001-2002. But believe it or not, there are still plenty of LE agencies that are still using these. The earlier productions just had a lot more produced, and you are correct that it's new old stock. But the ones I've bought/used in the last 10 years, (Including some with a sheriff's office), have ranged in dates from 1995 to 2000. But I have seen some of the 2001-2002 ones too.
You can buy brand new production directly from master-mold. http://www.thermoldmagazines.com/magazines.php . They will cost about $12.99 for a 20 round magazine. $19.99 for 30 round. But i figure, if the AWB stopped allowing them to be sold to civilians, and they were being made for LE and Govt use only, then possibly the quality was higher for them. That's why I've never had a problem trusting them. So far; so good. But again; I only buy the 20 round mags. For 30 round, I want a generation III follower. I don't like magpul plastic magazines, but I like their gen III no tilt followers in a USGI surplus metal mag.
Good: USGI (cheap and easy to find, seldom used but still quite good)
Better: Magpul PMag (great general purpose magazines)
Best: Lancer L-5 (used for HD/SD)
My only difference would be for best, is to take the USGI surplus magazines, (Which i find all the time for $5-$6; and replace the follower with a Magpul Generation III for about $1.50). For about $7, I believe it's the best magazine. If you look at my original post in this thread, all of my 30 rounders are USGI with gen III followers. I only like plastic magazines if they are 20 rounders.
Quentin: Once the AWB went into affect in 1994, the only hi-cap magazines were for Law enforcement and govt/military use. There are some later productions of the thermolds available. I've seen 2001-2002. But believe it or not, there are still plenty of LE agencies that are still using these. The earlier productions just had a lot more produced, and you are correct that it's new old stock. But the ones I've bought/used in the last 10 years, (Including some with a sheriff's office), have ranged in dates from 1995 to 2000. But I have seen some of the 2001-2002 ones too.
You can buy brand new production directly from master-mold. http://www.thermoldmagazines.com/magazines.php . They will cost about $12.99 for a 20 round magazine. $19.99 for 30 round. But i figure, if the AWB stopped allowing them to be sold to civilians, and they were being made for LE and Govt use only, then possibly the quality was higher for them. That's why I've never had a problem trusting them. So far; so good. But again; I only buy the 20 round mags. For 30 round, I want a generation III follower. I don't like magpul plastic magazines, but I like their gen III no tilt followers in a USGI surplus metal mag.
Maverick223
Member
I still don't really understand this logic, but I prefer 20s for most everything. Is it because 20rnd USGI is a little lighter constructed?
FWIW, I have never had any problems with Al. 20s as long as they are genuine USGI and not dropped on the feed lips. The easily bent feed lips is why it places at the bottom of my list, and while they are a little more robust the 30s rank the same, for the same reason.
christcorp
Member
As I mentioned earlier, 20 round magazines are straight. They don't curve. Therefor, they rarely have feed issues. 30 round magazines curve. As such, they can have feed issues if they don't have good followers and springs. I personally like the magpul generation III followers. HOWEVER!!!! You can't simply swap out the follower of a typical plastic magazine with a Gen III follower. The molded magazine won't let the gen III follower fit in them.
It's all about feeding. A straight magazine feeds instinctively better than a curved magazine. But they don't have 30 round straight magazines. Only 20 and less. So a 20 round plastic; I like. A 30 round USGI surplus metal, with a gen III follower, I like.
It's all about feeding. A straight magazine feeds instinctively better than a curved magazine. But they don't have 30 round straight magazines. Only 20 and less. So a 20 round plastic; I like. A 30 round USGI surplus metal, with a gen III follower, I like.
Maverick223
Member
All 20s are not straight, and as I said earlier a straight magazine doesn't preclude problems with a tilted follower. Anti-tilt followers are a good idea in ALL magazines. Furthermore there are some polymer magazines that will accommodate such a follower (though trimming may be necessary), there are also some USGI mags that require modification.
Additionally, the 30s require a curve due to the taper of the cartridge. They are not inherently worse, just different. All AK magazines have a severe curve, and few people complain about them; FAL magazines are straight and also tend to do well. Poor design (like changes in the curvature, poor quality materials, et al) and poor execution/workmanship are the problems.
Additionally, the 30s require a curve due to the taper of the cartridge. They are not inherently worse, just different. All AK magazines have a severe curve, and few people complain about them; FAL magazines are straight and also tend to do well. Poor design (like changes in the curvature, poor quality materials, et al) and poor execution/workmanship are the problems.
christcorp
Member
I'm not arguing with you. You asked a question, I answered it. You asked it again, I answered it again. I'll agree that not all 20 round magazines are straight. But 95%+ probably are. I also wont say that all 20 round magazines are free from tilting and feeding problems. But 95%+ are. And no, I'm not going to trim gen III followers to fit into a plastic magazine. And FWIW; I've never found a true USGI Mil-Spec surplus magazine, that wouldn't accept a magpul Anti-tilt follower.
But back to the thermold. It is the ONLY plastic magazine that I have, or probably will buy. Why? Because it's a 20 rounder and it's only $4. I won't buy a PMag or any others. Why? They are too expensive, and I'd rather have a USGI surplus metal magazine. It's really that simple. They do have some USGI 20 round metal mags for about $8; but if I'm going to have 20 round magazines, I'd rather buy 2 for the price of 1, when I know the quality of the thermold is good.
I'm sorry that some bought some that weren't part of the LE/Govt use production line. But those who have tried the LE/Govt use production line of 20 round thermolds, have generally been very pleased. They are sturdy; take a beating; don't have any of the canadian issues; lock back the bolt; and are very reliable. That's what this thread was suppose to be about.
Some people say they aren't worth a shiite; some say they are only good for the range; others say they work quite well. Me personally. I am not a follower. I don't buy or do anything because someone else said so. Not even "So Called Experts". I have to prove it to myself. My only recommendation to anyone is: At $4 a piece, maybe you buy $20 worth for "RANGE USE". Then; after you've put about 1000 rounds through it, MAYBE you wake up one day and think..... Hmmmmm, I've not had one misfeed, ejection, or other problems with these mags in over "X" amount of rounds. They are reliable. Or maybe you still think they are not trustworthy for defense, and you still only use them for the range. Either way; it doesn't bother me. But whether it's Thermold magazines; Hi-Point pistols; a $50 A1optic red-dot sight; or whatever. Whenever possible; DON'T TAKE OTHER PEOPLE'S OPINIONS!!! Try it and decide for yourself. If you can't afford to try something, then do a lot of research. Don't just go to 1 sights and make your mind up over a couple posts. And that's what I was providing here. Information so people could decide for themselves on inexpensive magazines, that have a pretty good track record. (Again; the thermold, USA made, LE/Govt Use Only, 20 round magazines). Not talking about 30 rounders; not talking about NON-LE/Govt use magazines; not talking about the canadian versions; etc... Just one particular magazine at a very good price. Possibly worth a try by some people. Make up your own minds.
But back to the thermold. It is the ONLY plastic magazine that I have, or probably will buy. Why? Because it's a 20 rounder and it's only $4. I won't buy a PMag or any others. Why? They are too expensive, and I'd rather have a USGI surplus metal magazine. It's really that simple. They do have some USGI 20 round metal mags for about $8; but if I'm going to have 20 round magazines, I'd rather buy 2 for the price of 1, when I know the quality of the thermold is good.
I'm sorry that some bought some that weren't part of the LE/Govt use production line. But those who have tried the LE/Govt use production line of 20 round thermolds, have generally been very pleased. They are sturdy; take a beating; don't have any of the canadian issues; lock back the bolt; and are very reliable. That's what this thread was suppose to be about.
Some people say they aren't worth a shiite; some say they are only good for the range; others say they work quite well. Me personally. I am not a follower. I don't buy or do anything because someone else said so. Not even "So Called Experts". I have to prove it to myself. My only recommendation to anyone is: At $4 a piece, maybe you buy $20 worth for "RANGE USE". Then; after you've put about 1000 rounds through it, MAYBE you wake up one day and think..... Hmmmmm, I've not had one misfeed, ejection, or other problems with these mags in over "X" amount of rounds. They are reliable. Or maybe you still think they are not trustworthy for defense, and you still only use them for the range. Either way; it doesn't bother me. But whether it's Thermold magazines; Hi-Point pistols; a $50 A1optic red-dot sight; or whatever. Whenever possible; DON'T TAKE OTHER PEOPLE'S OPINIONS!!! Try it and decide for yourself. If you can't afford to try something, then do a lot of research. Don't just go to 1 sights and make your mind up over a couple posts. And that's what I was providing here. Information so people could decide for themselves on inexpensive magazines, that have a pretty good track record. (Again; the thermold, USA made, LE/Govt Use Only, 20 round magazines). Not talking about 30 rounders; not talking about NON-LE/Govt use magazines; not talking about the canadian versions; etc... Just one particular magazine at a very good price. Possibly worth a try by some people. Make up your own minds.
Maverick223
Member
Not trying to start an argument, just detail a different point of view. As far as your rebuttal to the question, I didn't find your response clear the first time around.
Fair enough, just throwing out some additional information and contrary experiences.
As I mentioned earlier, they were decent (far from the worst, but not the best either), but I had a few malfunctions with the ones I tried. I don't recall the patent info or much else (and they are long gone, so there is no checking), but they were Master-Molders from here in NC. Furthermore, I am not trying to convince you or others not to buy them, just that there are others that *might* do a bit better if they don't work as advertised.
christcorp
Member
Fair enough. Definitely didn't think you were arguing. I'm an engineer. I have degrees in Computer Science and Electronic Engineering. By nature, I don't trust anything electrical or mechanical. It can and will eventually fail. I also don't believe any 2 guns are identical. Even if they are the same make, model, and year built. Just like people. I have a Walther (Respectable manufacturer) that WILL NOT under and circumstance, chamber Corbon ammo. Corbon is ALSO a respectable manufacturer. That doesn't mean corbon OR Walther are junk or suspect. Just that that particular and individual gun, doesn't like corbon.
I feel the same about magazines, ammo in general, and most things in life. I don't, and WON'T, take other's opinions on what I SHOULD DO or BUY. Never going to happen. Not even if they are supposed experts. That doesn't impress me. I take the opinions and experiences of a LOT OF PEOPLE; correlate them; and decide for myself whether or not to "TRY" it. Then, I will decide after trying it for myself, if it's GOOD or BAD. And good or bad is ONLY RELATIVE TO ME. I suggest the same procedure for ALL people for ALL things in life.
If I didn't follow this method, and only took the advice of others, I wouldn't have realized that Hi-Point pistols are actually VERY RELIABLE AND DEPENDABLE. Yes, they are ugly and bulky as hell; but for a truck, boat, garage, etc... type gun; I find it just as reliable and dependable as my Sig P220. Anyone who makes a blanket statement that Hi-Points suck, do not know crap about guns or anything. (Please no one respond that they are junk and you have a century of experience. I don't care. I already did the research, and I KNOW the truth).
Same with my AR's, my Saiga .223, and the Kel-Tec I use to own. I reviewed all the information and opinions on Thermold magazines. I found a LOT of contradictory opinions. When I narrowed it down, I found that very few individuals ever had problems with the 20 Round, Master-Mold, Made in the USA, LE/Govt Use Only, magazines in their AR's. And those who DID have issues with them, MANY happen to have Bushmaster rifles. So; being I don't own a Bushmaster, I was willing to try these magazines for myself. (Many years ago. Including DURING the AWB). I haven't had any problems with them. I started with a couple. No problems. Bought more. Still no problems. Bought more. I now KNOW that at least for ME and MY WEAPONS, that thermold 20 round LE/Govt magazines are very reliable and dependable. And yes, that is what my rifle is loaded with for self/home defense. I trust them that much. Not that others should take my word. Only, that if they did research, they too would find that many others, like myself, have had the same experience, and it's possibly worth a couple dollars for them to try it for themselves in their rifles. Maybe your rifle doesn't like it. Maybe it does.
My research led me to no trust the canadian versions or those made prior to 1994. Also, USGI surplus metal 30 round magazines with gen III followers, are BETTER and CHEAPER than Thermold 30 round magazines, so I don't even consider those thermolds an option. So; maybe some people will take my suggestions to try for themselves. Maybe they will stick with the attitude that you HAVE to pay $14-$20 for a Magpul magazine if you want quality. I personally don't care either way. I'm just not a follower. So I can't take the advice of others. Not even experts. I have to try for myself. That's what this thread was all about. Spend $7 locally for one and try it, or order a couple online for $4 each, and try them. Maybe they'll be perfect for you and your rifle. Maybe you use them only for range use. (Still saves you money). Maybe after using them for a few thousand rounds, you realize that they are just as reliable in YOUR WEAPON as the $14 magazines are. You never know.
I feel the same about magazines, ammo in general, and most things in life. I don't, and WON'T, take other's opinions on what I SHOULD DO or BUY. Never going to happen. Not even if they are supposed experts. That doesn't impress me. I take the opinions and experiences of a LOT OF PEOPLE; correlate them; and decide for myself whether or not to "TRY" it. Then, I will decide after trying it for myself, if it's GOOD or BAD. And good or bad is ONLY RELATIVE TO ME. I suggest the same procedure for ALL people for ALL things in life.
If I didn't follow this method, and only took the advice of others, I wouldn't have realized that Hi-Point pistols are actually VERY RELIABLE AND DEPENDABLE. Yes, they are ugly and bulky as hell; but for a truck, boat, garage, etc... type gun; I find it just as reliable and dependable as my Sig P220. Anyone who makes a blanket statement that Hi-Points suck, do not know crap about guns or anything. (Please no one respond that they are junk and you have a century of experience. I don't care. I already did the research, and I KNOW the truth).
Same with my AR's, my Saiga .223, and the Kel-Tec I use to own. I reviewed all the information and opinions on Thermold magazines. I found a LOT of contradictory opinions. When I narrowed it down, I found that very few individuals ever had problems with the 20 Round, Master-Mold, Made in the USA, LE/Govt Use Only, magazines in their AR's. And those who DID have issues with them, MANY happen to have Bushmaster rifles. So; being I don't own a Bushmaster, I was willing to try these magazines for myself. (Many years ago. Including DURING the AWB). I haven't had any problems with them. I started with a couple. No problems. Bought more. Still no problems. Bought more. I now KNOW that at least for ME and MY WEAPONS, that thermold 20 round LE/Govt magazines are very reliable and dependable. And yes, that is what my rifle is loaded with for self/home defense. I trust them that much. Not that others should take my word. Only, that if they did research, they too would find that many others, like myself, have had the same experience, and it's possibly worth a couple dollars for them to try it for themselves in their rifles. Maybe your rifle doesn't like it. Maybe it does.
My research led me to no trust the canadian versions or those made prior to 1994. Also, USGI surplus metal 30 round magazines with gen III followers, are BETTER and CHEAPER than Thermold 30 round magazines, so I don't even consider those thermolds an option. So; maybe some people will take my suggestions to try for themselves. Maybe they will stick with the attitude that you HAVE to pay $14-$20 for a Magpul magazine if you want quality. I personally don't care either way. I'm just not a follower. So I can't take the advice of others. Not even experts. I have to try for myself. That's what this thread was all about. Spend $7 locally for one and try it, or order a couple online for $4 each, and try them. Maybe they'll be perfect for you and your rifle. Maybe you use them only for range use. (Still saves you money). Maybe after using them for a few thousand rounds, you realize that they are just as reliable in YOUR WEAPON as the $14 magazines are. You never know.
Just a side note: 20rd, straight body, milspec 5.56 mags depend on follower tilt to compensate for cartridge taper. Some follower designs may be better than others but "no tilt" followers are not an option.
I have seen some Magpul followers modified to work in straight body mags but the mods required are to allow them to tilt.
I have seen some Magpul followers modified to work in straight body mags but the mods required are to allow them to tilt.
Maverick223
Member
Same here, but only a lowly CE (specializing in materials).christcorp said:
Most of my experience with them was in a Bushmaster M17S, also in another Bushy AR, an Olympic Carbine, and a IIRC I ended up giving them to a friend with a RRA Carbine (who said they did decently well).christcorp said:
All followers must have some tilt, as most M16/STANAG type magazines (and all USGI examples) have a straight portion that enters the mag well (whereas PMags and L-5s are curved throughout the length). Furthermore many problems are with the follower tilting to the side not forward or to the rear, the AT follower corrects these issues.DBR said:
christcorp
Member
Well, I just got back from the range. I reported in other threads my results with my new ST-T2 Spikes Tactical Buffer. But I wanted to report on the 6 new additional Thermold 20 round LE/Govt magazines that I picked up. Just like the others that I have, these all performed perfectly. I only shot about 240 rounds today, but most of them were through Thermolds. I shot about 100 rounds of Tula .223; 100 rounds of Barnaul 5.56; 20 rounds of PMC Bronze and 20 rounds of Military 5.56 I took off stripper clips. I was mixing and matching ammo and magazines on purpose. Every thermold operated perfectly. No one feed, extract, or eject problem. Everyone allowed the bolt to stay open on the last shot. I even dropped a few full magazines on the ground a couple of times to see if there would be any physical issues. Nope; they all worked perfectly. Like my others.
As I've said before, I definitely trust these magazines. Even for home defense purposes. Matter of fact, I keep 2 magazines filled with TAP ammo. One is in my M&P15 and the other is in my Saiga .223/5.56 with an AR15 magazine adapter. I definitely trust them. And for $3.99 each, I love the price.
But I'm not asking or expecting anyone to take my word or advice. I'm simply recommending that if you are in the market for some additional magazines, that you spend the $3.99 on a couple/few of these. (What's $20 for 5?) Then, use them on the range. You don't have to make them your self defense mags. Nice short 20 rounders so you don't have the inconvenience of the 30 round length hitting the table or something. Then; after your own usage and amount of time; you decide to what extent you trust these magazines. Maybe it's still only for the range. Maybe like some others, you trust it for defensive purposes. Just don't let anyone tell you that they WILL break sooner than a PMag or similar. They don't know that. They are only guessing. "And rationalizing their $15 purchase of the PMag". There isn't a magazine manufacturer on the planet, that hasn't had a magazine break. But there's no firm data that shows the Thermold 20 round LE/Govt mags are inferior. And FWIW: I've never heard anyone who's used them, complain that they had any issues. Not at the individual magazine level. As in a QC issue. It's only been with NON-LE/Govt mags; and usually with that one particular rifle. And it can never be expected that ALL rifles will work with ALL magazines. Just like my Walther PPK will not, ever, under any circumstance, feed Corbon Ammunition. Now Walther is a fine respected company. Corbon is a fine respected company. I've never seen another Walther have a problem with Corbon ammo. But the fact remains, that the rifling in my PPK barrel starts at just the right spot, where a Corbon round of ammo simply won't feed all the way into the chamber. Not without one hell of a push. Then you can't get the round out of the chamber.
Anyway; there's my review of my newest batch from CDNN. For $3.99, I think it's worth the chance. especially for range magazines. later... mike....
As I've said before, I definitely trust these magazines. Even for home defense purposes. Matter of fact, I keep 2 magazines filled with TAP ammo. One is in my M&P15 and the other is in my Saiga .223/5.56 with an AR15 magazine adapter. I definitely trust them. And for $3.99 each, I love the price.
But I'm not asking or expecting anyone to take my word or advice. I'm simply recommending that if you are in the market for some additional magazines, that you spend the $3.99 on a couple/few of these. (What's $20 for 5?) Then, use them on the range. You don't have to make them your self defense mags. Nice short 20 rounders so you don't have the inconvenience of the 30 round length hitting the table or something. Then; after your own usage and amount of time; you decide to what extent you trust these magazines. Maybe it's still only for the range. Maybe like some others, you trust it for defensive purposes. Just don't let anyone tell you that they WILL break sooner than a PMag or similar. They don't know that. They are only guessing. "And rationalizing their $15 purchase of the PMag". There isn't a magazine manufacturer on the planet, that hasn't had a magazine break. But there's no firm data that shows the Thermold 20 round LE/Govt mags are inferior. And FWIW: I've never heard anyone who's used them, complain that they had any issues. Not at the individual magazine level. As in a QC issue. It's only been with NON-LE/Govt mags; and usually with that one particular rifle. And it can never be expected that ALL rifles will work with ALL magazines. Just like my Walther PPK will not, ever, under any circumstance, feed Corbon Ammunition. Now Walther is a fine respected company. Corbon is a fine respected company. I've never seen another Walther have a problem with Corbon ammo. But the fact remains, that the rifling in my PPK barrel starts at just the right spot, where a Corbon round of ammo simply won't feed all the way into the chamber. Not without one hell of a push. Then you can't get the round out of the chamber.
Anyway; there's my review of my newest batch from CDNN. For $3.99, I think it's worth the chance. especially for range magazines. later... mike....
Maverick223
Member
Just to play devils advocate a bit...what is an additional $12 (based upon the cheapest PMags and L-5s) or so, when the ammo to fill it will cost almost that much (sometimes more)?
OTOH, the less money you spend on magazines, the more money you have for said ammo. Eh, what the heck, if I see a good deal on them locally (or with a company I am placing an order with) I might give a couple another shot...see if things have changed (after all the others weren't horrible, but they had a few malfunctions). Worse case scenario I can donate them to a friend.
OTOH, the less money you spend on magazines, the more money you have for said ammo. Eh, what the heck, if I see a good deal on them locally (or with a company I am placing an order with) I might give a couple another shot...see if things have changed (after all the others weren't horrible, but they had a few malfunctions). Worse case scenario I can donate them to a friend.
christcorp
Member
Not sure I understand your post Mav. What's the extra $12, when the ammo to fill it will cost that much??? 90+% of all my ammo for my AR's and my Saiga .223 is $3.59 - $4.00 per box of 20.
But as far as giving them another chance; you should. But from our past discussions, I have to reiterate that you make sure they are the "20 Round; NOT 30" and make sure they are "LAW/GOVT USE ONLY". Those were built basically 1994/5-2004. At the time of their production, civilians were NOT ALLOWED Hi-Cap magazines per the AWB. So these were specifically built for Law Enforcement and Government departments. The AWB expired, and there are still a lot of New/Overstock surplus left. Maybe it's better QC because of the customer, e.g. LE/Govt; but either way; these are the ones to get. CDNN has them for $3.99 and Centerfire Systems has them for $4.99. I've seen them locally at Sportsman's Warehouse, local gun store, etc... for $6.99-$7.99. I've seen them at gun shows and online for $8.99-$12.99.
So; you need to be careful. If they aren't Law/Govt use only; then they could be older stock; canadian (Some were built in canada with inferior material, BUT still had the Wilson N.C. USA stamped on them, because legally, the canadians bought the right to produce, but the original company is in fact in north carolina. So all I will personally vouch for, as having NEVER had one issue with it feeding, breaking, melting, or any other possible complaint against thermold and master-mold; are the 1994/5-2004: 20 ROUND: Law/Govt Use Only; magazines. Good luck Mav.
But as far as giving them another chance; you should. But from our past discussions, I have to reiterate that you make sure they are the "20 Round; NOT 30" and make sure they are "LAW/GOVT USE ONLY". Those were built basically 1994/5-2004. At the time of their production, civilians were NOT ALLOWED Hi-Cap magazines per the AWB. So these were specifically built for Law Enforcement and Government departments. The AWB expired, and there are still a lot of New/Overstock surplus left. Maybe it's better QC because of the customer, e.g. LE/Govt; but either way; these are the ones to get. CDNN has them for $3.99 and Centerfire Systems has them for $4.99. I've seen them locally at Sportsman's Warehouse, local gun store, etc... for $6.99-$7.99. I've seen them at gun shows and online for $8.99-$12.99.
So; you need to be careful. If they aren't Law/Govt use only; then they could be older stock; canadian (Some were built in canada with inferior material, BUT still had the Wilson N.C. USA stamped on them, because legally, the canadians bought the right to produce, but the original company is in fact in north carolina. So all I will personally vouch for, as having NEVER had one issue with it feeding, breaking, melting, or any other possible complaint against thermold and master-mold; are the 1994/5-2004: 20 ROUND: Law/Govt Use Only; magazines. Good luck Mav.
Maverick223
Member
Most of what I shoot, either Fed. Am. Eagle, WWB, or handloads (which are a little cheaper), cost about double that, which works out to $8/20 rnd. magazine or $12/30 (about the price of a PMag). Tula/Wolf has not cycled well for me in the past, though I recently picked up a box @ WW to re-test (it has been years since I last tried it).
You don't have to worry about me buying 30s for most anything, as I greatly prefer 20s (no matter what brand/type).
christcorp
Member
Not sure if any of you have a Sportsman's Warehouse around;
http://www.sportsmanswarehouse.com/storelocator/index.jsp
But if you do; they've bought a lot of the thermold New: Overstock and are even packaged new. They were selling for over $12.99 each. Was there today; and they have the Thermold 20 round, Law/Govt Use only, 95, magazines for $4.99 each. Online is $3.99-$4.99; but if you have a sportsman's warehouse nearby, and they have the thermolds; this would be a good opportunity to get a couple without having to deal with S/H charges. Just something I saw today on my way through Colorado.
http://www.sportsmanswarehouse.com/storelocator/index.jsp
But if you do; they've bought a lot of the thermold New: Overstock and are even packaged new. They were selling for over $12.99 each. Was there today; and they have the Thermold 20 round, Law/Govt Use only, 95, magazines for $4.99 each. Online is $3.99-$4.99; but if you have a sportsman's warehouse nearby, and they have the thermolds; this would be a good opportunity to get a couple without having to deal with S/H charges. Just something I saw today on my way through Colorado.
Ignition Override
Member
Elmer:
When they were used with the Mini 14, was that often with fully loaded mags, or less?
I bought an old 1990 vintage ("State of Indiana" sticker) Mini 14 in February '08 and the same month a new 30-rd. plastic Promag.
In order to avoid excess ammo consumption, it was loaded mostly with 10-15 rds., and it Never had a misfeed, despite having a real wobbly fit.
The only ammo was my favorite, Russian-made.
When they were used with the Mini 14, was that often with fully loaded mags, or less?
I bought an old 1990 vintage ("State of Indiana" sticker) Mini 14 in February '08 and the same month a new 30-rd. plastic Promag.
In order to avoid excess ammo consumption, it was loaded mostly with 10-15 rds., and it Never had a misfeed, despite having a real wobbly fit.
The only ammo was my favorite, Russian-made.
Maverick223
Member
Nope, don't know of any Sportsman's Warehouses on this coast (near here anyway), though I do appreciate the recommendation. I'll eventually pick some up on the cheap either at a gunshow, with an online order (CDNN?), or perhaps even from my LGS.
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