LJ-MosinFreak-Buck
Member
Didn't the M1919 machine-gun need to be timed and head-spaced, too? I've heard stories that the M2 was just an up-scaled M1919.
Who knows the history of the 50 bmg cartridge?
- Thread starter CharlieDeltaJuliet
- Start date
- Status
newfalguy101
Member
If I recall correctly, JMB designed the gun ( M2) BEFORE the cartridge was actually available for testing ( yes he had the specs for the chamber etc.. ).
alsaqr
Member
Yes, it does need to be timed and headspaced.
Videos:
Timing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qh2C2InBWb4
Headspacing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNZQpX43_OE
Last edited:
BHP FAN
Member
''The JMB designed .380ACP and 25ACP are downscaled from the 45ACP and accurate within 1% in almost all dimensions. (~78% and ~59% respectively). The 50BMG does not have the same close scale relationship to the .30-06. The dimensions can be 4-10% off depending on dimension compared. The 50BMG may have been based on the .30-06, but if so, some dimensions were subsequently changed and the result is not just an upscaled cartridge..''
except it was the other way around... .25, .32, and .380 came before the .45.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.32_ACP
See also the Colt 1903.
except it was the other way around... .25, .32, and .380 came before the .45.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.32_ACP
See also the Colt 1903.
LeonCarr
Member
I read that the BAR was actually tested in the war zone and JMBs son, who was a 2LT in the Army, fired the first shots.
From Wikipedia:
By July 1918, the BAR began to arrive in France and the first unit to receive them was the U.S. Army's 79th Infantry Division, which took them into action for the first time on 13 September 1918.[7] The weapon was personally demonstrated against the enemy by 2nd Lieutenant Val Allen Browning, the inventor's son.[7] Despite being introduced very late in the war, the BAR made an impact disproportionate to its numbers; it was used extensively during the Meuse-Argonne Offensive and made a significant impression on the Allies (France alone requested 15,000 automatic rifles to replace their notoriously unreliable Chauchat machine rifle).[7]
I stand corrected on the story I read about the M2 .50s and the Thompsons on the docks, both were developed after the war, so the story is BS.
Just my .02,
LeonCarr
From Wikipedia:
By July 1918, the BAR began to arrive in France and the first unit to receive them was the U.S. Army's 79th Infantry Division, which took them into action for the first time on 13 September 1918.[7] The weapon was personally demonstrated against the enemy by 2nd Lieutenant Val Allen Browning, the inventor's son.[7] Despite being introduced very late in the war, the BAR made an impact disproportionate to its numbers; it was used extensively during the Meuse-Argonne Offensive and made a significant impression on the Allies (France alone requested 15,000 automatic rifles to replace their notoriously unreliable Chauchat machine rifle).[7]
I stand corrected on the story I read about the M2 .50s and the Thompsons on the docks, both were developed after the war, so the story is BS.
Just my .02,
LeonCarr
Shadow 7D
Member
Every M2 gunner in my old unit was REQUIRED to have their gauges physically attached to them, part of their pre-mission duties was to PMCS their gun, and that included checking headspace.
CharlieDeltaJuliet
Member
There is only one thing I would argue with on that site, the usefull range is stated as 2000yds. When we were told it was 2500 meters with the M82A1. Please note this was hard targets( vehicles, missle batteries, etc). Back then we were told 1800 meters was top for soft targets. Who knows though. I love that site though, very interresting. Thanks Tom for the link.
Last edited:
throwing some logical reasoning in here JMB designed the 25acp,380acp and 45 acp so it would stand to reason hed have diminisioned drawings of them. He didn't design the 30/06 and may have just had a piece of fired brass or for that matter just a picture. Heck knowing the genius of JMB he may have just scaled it from memory.
alsaqr
Member
My WWI Doughboy friend was named Jack. i hunted with Jack for about 25 years and learned a lot from him; he talked freely about his combat experience in the "war to end all wars". Sadly, Jack died in 1985.
Jack went to France as a second lieutenant in the first shipment of US troops. He was a platoon leader in a machinegun company and later the company commander. Their first machinegun was the British Vickers and their automatic rifle was the Chauchat. The Chauchat soon went away and they were issued the Lewis gun. The Browning Model 1917 machine gun replaced the Vickers. The BAR came to Jacks unit about one month before the war ended.
Somewhere in my junk i have the indirect fire tables for the Vickers and Browning model 1917 machineguns that Jack gave me. Jacks unit had the distinction of bringing indirect machine gun fire on a German regiment that was assembling for an attack.
Jack went to France as a second lieutenant in the first shipment of US troops. He was a platoon leader in a machinegun company and later the company commander. Their first machinegun was the British Vickers and their automatic rifle was the Chauchat. The Chauchat soon went away and they were issued the Lewis gun. The Browning Model 1917 machine gun replaced the Vickers. The BAR came to Jacks unit about one month before the war ended.
Somewhere in my junk i have the indirect fire tables for the Vickers and Browning model 1917 machineguns that Jack gave me. Jacks unit had the distinction of bringing indirect machine gun fire on a German regiment that was assembling for an attack.
Vern Humphrey
Member
Being an old Mechanized Infantry Company Commander, I have a soft spot for the M2 and the .50 Cal. I know from experience that if you can get an M113 into position, the old Ma Deuce will turn NVA bunkers into swimming holes. Defensively, it will cut down big teak trees faster than any chainsaw you ever saw.
One of my favorite tricks in a night defensive position was to dig machinegun pits, mount the M2s on tripods, and run the M113s over then to provide overhead cover. After one action near the Laotian border, we had RPG-7 holes in everhthing topsides -- hatches, vision blocks, antennas blown off and so on -- apparently a person on the receiving end of .50 caliber fire can't tell where it's coming from, and they assumed we still had the guns mounted on the commanders hatches.
One of my favorite tricks in a night defensive position was to dig machinegun pits, mount the M2s on tripods, and run the M113s over then to provide overhead cover. After one action near the Laotian border, we had RPG-7 holes in everhthing topsides -- hatches, vision blocks, antennas blown off and so on -- apparently a person on the receiving end of .50 caliber fire can't tell where it's coming from, and they assumed we still had the guns mounted on the commanders hatches.
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
