Who makes true Commander size pistols?

[Aguila Blanca]

Stopped in at my local gun shop yesterday to look at a new Springfield Armory GI series. The one he had was a Government model and I am interested in a Commander size, though, so the guy reached into the used gun cabinet and pulled out a SA Mil-Spec in Commander size for me to look at. Then he pulled out a used Para P12-45 and set that on the counter.

Which led me to realize that the SA isn't a true Commander size. It claims to have a 4" barrel, but the P12 has a 3-1/2" barrel and if the SA was 3/8" longer I'd be very surprised. I was also surprised to see that the overall thickness at the grips was exactly the same for the SA single stack and the P12 double stack.

So why would I give up 5 rounds of capacity for a barrel that might be 3/8" longer, and grips that aren't any slimmer?

I've been checking, and I see that Armscor/RIA/Daly also have 4" barrels in their mid-size 1911. Auto Ordnance doesn't appear to offer a Commander size. Are there any lower-end manufacturers who offer a true Commander size pistol, with a 4-1/4" barrel?

 

[Cameron Lamont]

Get a New Roll Mark Colt 1991 Commander.

4 1/4" barrel and about $545 of the best pistol for the money.

Regards,
Cameron

 

[Wildalaska]

Ditto...Colt, often imitated, never duplicated

WildponyboyAlaska

 

[stans]

When it comes to a true Commander, I don't think anyone does it better than Colt. Most manufacturers seem to have gone to 5 inch Government models with a standard barrel and bushing, 4 inch compact or mid size models, usually with a bull barrel and no bushing (4 inch bushing barrels usually don't work reliably-research by Colt and the U.S. Army in developing the Commander) and 3-1/2 to 3 inch bull barrel and no bushing ultra compact pistols.

I think the Commander is really a better combat sidearm than the Government model. The 4-1/4 inch barrel seems to have a nuetral balance as opposed to the slightly muzzle heavy 5 inch barrel.

 

[TooTech]

The slide on a Para P13 is the same length as a Commander, but of course the frame is wider to handle the double-stack mag.

 

[bubbaturbo]

Para Ordnance makes a commander length single action single stack now in steel or aluminum.

 

[tex_n_cal]

It's also pretty easy to find Colt XSE Commanders, besides the NRM's. Some folks don't care for the style, but they seem to be fine pistols, from all reports.

 

[MoNsTeR]

True 4.25" models are available from Colt, Les Baer, SVI, Rock River, Ed Brown, probably others, and of course built from scratch. Kimber and Springfield only sell 4" models.

 

[Aguila Blanca]

Monster

Thanks for the inout but you seem to not have understood the question:

Are there any lower-end manufacturers who offer a true Commander size pistol, with a 4-1/4" barrel?

Other than Colt (if comments regarding prices for Colts are correct, those you named are so far out of my price range I can't even think of an appropriate metaphor to express it.

 

[stans]

Oh, you must mean Charles Daly and Armscor! The answer is no, they us a 4 inch bull barrel. Springfield Armory is the same, 4 inch bull barrel. Colt is likely to be your least expensive true Commander.

 

[DHart]

There's no Commander quite like a Colt Commander...

Colt LW Commander XSE - Wilson Drop-in Grip Safety, McCormick Slip-in Sight, Arched MSH

Of course, there are Ed Brown's bobtail variants, which are quite nice, but no more reliable and cost almost 4X as much as one with a Pony on it. I have both and I'm as happy with my Colts as I am with my Ed Brown. The bobtail is a fantastic feature for a carry gun... you still carry full size magazines, but the butt of the gun is less obvious and is very comfortable to hold and shoot. The bobtail modification is easy for a competent gunsmith to do to a Colt if you don't want to spend the dough on a Brown.

Ed Brown Class A Bobtail Commander

 

[MoNsTeR]

Sorry, missed that word! I guess the answer is "just Colt" then eh?

 

[Smoke]

Para guns are tricky. The P12 has a shorter grip, thus is not a commander sized gun. Even the P13 that has a commander length barrel still has an abbreviated grip.

Many makers vary from 4 - 4.25 inch and refer to it as Commander sized.

Officer's sized is another animal, I hate short grips.

Smoke

 

[XMP]

Believe it or not, the most reasonably priced commander sized gun is the Commander. A new Colt Commander in blue can be found for around $500. And then you'll have an actual Colt, which should you ever want to sell, will actually be attractive to buyers.

 

[DHart]

I so agree with you X94B... the basic Colt 1991A1 blued Commander for around 500 bucks is a gorgeous, reliable, and wonderful 1911 indeed.

 

[MoNsTeR]

500 bucks?
The lowest price I can find on the web for an NRM Commander is $630.

If that's just regional price variation, I want to live where you guys are!

 

[Aguila Blanca]

By Smoke:

Para guns are tricky. The P12 has a shorter grip, thus is not a commander sized gun. Even the P13 that has a commander length barrel still has an abbreviated grip.

The Para P12 is a 3-1/2" barrel, more of an officer size double stack. I have one, and that's the whole point. With a SA laid right next to it, the SA barrel was barely 3/8 of an inch longer. If I'm going to give up 5 rounds in capacity, I want more than 3/8" or barrel length in exchange. Should be 3/4" in a "true" Commander size pistol.

 

[45auto]

I believe Colt is the only production commander with a bushing and standard bbl, non ramped. I have never "read" that a ramped bbl was an advantage in 45ACP.

Those two items alone would sway me towards Colt, despite the fact I'd have to add a beavertail, better sights, etc, etc.

 

[patentmike]

I understand the S&W 1911Sc is supposed to be in stores by the end of the month.

 

[Slowhand]

I think the Smith Scandium Commanders have been delayed and are shipping sometime in July. I have my eye on one of those. In the meantime, my Colt XSE LW Commander will have to do. I also prefer true Commanders over the bull barrelled guns, they're just easier to deal with. Great carry guns, although I only use them when I must. My daily CCW (unless it's hot or I need something a little smaller) is a Govt Model.

I would recommend against getting an Armscor, no matter how cheap it is. Look for a used Colt or something. I hate cutting corners when an extra $150 will really make the difference between a nice firearm you'll be proud to own and something you may regret down the road.

 

[Marshall]

That Colt beats that Bear in looks, hands down!

 

[stans]

I have never "read" that a ramped bbl was an advantage in 45ACP.

I think this is misinformation. Generally speaking, in the 1911 chambered in 45 ACP, ramped barrels offer only a little addictional case head support and they may be less reliable that the standard (non-ramped) barrel. They may be of benefit for the slimmer cartridges such as 10mm and 38 Super. but in 45 ACP, you sometimes end up grinding away at the feed ramp just to get the gun to feed and all that extra support is gone.

 

[Pythonman]

My 1991A1 *Commander* was the sweetest shooting, most accurate piece I've ever owned. Traded it off for a mint 60s nickle plated Model 27 with the wood case like and have missed it ever since. If you've gotta have a Commander, might as well pony up and get the Colt for a measly few extry $$$. In the long run you'll be glad you did.