Why not a .45ACP L-Frame?

[Tom Servo]

Before you say, "well, what about the .44 Special?" I'll mention that you're preaching to the choir. I love the round, but .45ACP is more ubiquitous, and it's a bit cheaper.

All the S&W .45ACP wheelguns have been N-Frames? How come? The .45 isn't generating the pressures to mandate the larger frame (in fact, the .44 Special can be loaded alot hotter).

I got to thinking about this when I handled one of the new 396 models today. Make it a 3" barreled L-Frame (like the 696), and chamber it in .45ACP. I don't imagine they'd have any trouble moving it.

(There is a 325 Night Guard, but it's an N-Frame.)

 

[rgs1975]

I'd buy one.

 

[Skofnung]

Shorten the cylinder and frame to fit the shorter cartridge, make it a five shot with a 3" barrel, round but and I would buy two.

Call it the New American Bulldog

 

[MCgunner]

Is the cylinder diameter enough? I remember the walls of my 1917 chambers being rather thin and, of course, that's an N frame. Maybe a 5 shooter? It'd need its own designed moon clips regardless.

 

[Youngster]

A 5 shooter is given, personally I'd rather see a shortened 'N' frame.

 

[steveracer]

I'm IN! Where do I sign?

 

[rcmodel]

If someone with a dial caliper and a 696 could measure the cylinder wall thickness, then subtract .010" from it, we would know if it would work or not.

If the answer is less then .064" or so, an L-frame 5-shot .45 ain't gonna happen.

I would certainly think though, that if it would work, S&W would already be selling them.

rcmodel

 

[BBroadside]

Oh, the gun makers really have to be reading this site, or they're missing out. If they can make an 8-shot .357 on the L-frame, I'd bet money they can make a .45 ACP L-frame, six shots, maybe. If they can put .357 into a J-frame, can they put .45 ACP into a K? I wouldn't bet money on that but I'm curious.

Then they could put .460 Rowland into the old N-frame....

 

[bluetopper]

If Taurus can do it, I know S&W can do it.

 

[steveracer]

8-shot .357s are on the N-frame. Not L.

 

[SouthpawShootr]

I was going to say, my Taurus 2 inch 455 (.45ACP) Tracker fits L-frame leather easily. There's a slight difference in styling, but it's the same size as my 686 2.5." So it is possible. S&W will maintain that there's not enough demand to justify the costs.

Since these things are CNC machined and are governed by programs, why not make a run every other year or so? Sell out the existing pistols then do another run. You keep a niche of the market supplied and happy.

 

[Tom Servo]

If someone with a dial caliper and a 696 could measure the cylinder wall thickness, then subtract .010" from it, we would know if it would work or not.

If the answer is less then .064" or so, an L-frame 5-shot .45 ain't gonna happen.

I would certainly think though, that if it would work, S&W would already be selling them.

Drat; I think you're on to something there. I don't have the tools handy, but the cylinder walls would be getting thin.

It just occured to me that a line like the Night Guards could be well marketed in "service" calibers like 9mm, .40SW, etc...

 

[Blueduck]

Cylinder thickness is one thing, but remember the forcing cone also has to be thick enough.

The 5 shot 44 special L-Frames cone was considered "on the edge" by a some people, hogging it out even further from .429 to .452 might not work.

 

[Kerf]

you all aware of this man's work...?

I've never had any work done at Clements, but thought it looked interesting and appears to be right up the alley you're discussing. Following is all the info I have.

Kerf

&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&

Clements Custom Guns
2766 Mt. Zion Rd.
Woodlawn, VA 24381
Phone: 276-238-8761 e-mail: Clements Custom Guns


S&W revolvers can be converted to several different calibers. .357 to .44 Special, .41 Magnum to .45 Colt, .44 Magnum to .45 Colt, etc. Factory barrel is rebored and cylinder linebored and rechambered. Endshake set to minimum. Barrel is refitted to frame after rebore to improve barrel/cylinder gap, recrowned, and forcing cone cut to 11 degrees. Base price is $500 on a stainless gun and $550 on a blue one. Action work and taller front sight, if needed, along with barrel shortening are extra. I can convert the M27 & 28 to .45 ACP or 10mm/.40 S&W. Cost for these conversions is $50 extra. Both would use moon clips.
I am currently only accepting N-frame cal. conversions. I cannot do action work on newer guns with MIM parts. If the back of the trigger has cavities cast in it, then the gun is a MIM gun and not suitable.

Barrel shortening- from $185 S&W has changed the front sight several times over the years. Sometimes I can remount the factory front, while other times a new front will need to be fabricated.
Action work- from $75
Recolorcase hammer and trigger- $25 each
Ball/crane lock- $40
Pinned blade front sight conversion- $90
Install new blade in guns with plunger type or pinned front sight bases- $50

 

[Gator]

Cylinder thickness is one thing, but remember the forcing cone also has to be thick enough.

The 5 shot 44 special L-Frames cone was considered "on the edge" by a some people, hogging it out even further from .429 to .452 might not work.

Ditto. The L frame really isn't big enough for .44, so .45 is out.

 

[BlindJustice]

I am also a S&W Forum member, as well as a 625 5" bbl. .45 ACP shooter. The L-frame & a .45 ACP hookup thread. THe problem is
1. to get sufficient cylinder wall thickness it has to go to a 5 shot
capacity but, the show stopper is
2. by the time you position the .45 cal. chamber shape into the L-frame
diameter cylinder the extractor in the middle is too squeezed to work.

Maybe a GP100 would be the in-between the N & L frame S&Ws.

How about a .41 Magnum 5 shot It would have a thicker all around cylinder as well as the forcing cone.

heck, an L-frame 10MM AUto/.40 S&W 5 shooter maybe a six?

Randall

 

[Brian Williams]

heck, an L-frame 10MM AUto/.40 S&W 5 shooter maybe a six?

Tis called the 646 and is a 6 shooting 40S&W

 

[Walkalong]

If someone with a dial caliper and a 696 could measure the cylinder wall thickness

I can do that when I get home.

Blueduck has a point about the forcing cone.

BUT, it would be sweet.

 

[Stainz]

With a forcing cone OD of .524" on my 696-1 - and that .429+" ID - the edge of thr fc is too thin now. Also, I don't have the max pressure for a .44 Special nearby, but the .45 ACP - at 21-22 kpsi - has to be higher. I am afraid it's a no-go.

I had wanted Ruger to make a GP-100 in .44 Special - or .45 ACP. I gave up years ago and bought my 696 (1/03) - and saw why Ruger wouldn't do it. Of course, Taurus did - they don't any more. Wonder why? Actually, I regret not buying a friend's 4" .45 ACP Tracker 5-shooter - or another one when they were closeout-priced at $275-$299 for the 4" - a 'Stellar' price, so to speak!

BTW, the best .44 Special deal is either a 4" 629 or a 629MG - only 4-6 oz more - and a 4"/6-shooter - with a 'real' fc!

Stainz

PS I love my 625JM.

 

[Navy joe]

I've got enough big .45 wheels, I want a 3 or 4 shot .45 J-Frame.