14.5" or 16" barrel for AR15?

[cgv69]

You can find that statement any way you wish but the fact remains that by the time you put on optics, BUIS, possibly a change in stock etc, any "balance" difference of that 1.5" barrel length is gone

You do realize that not everybody adds all of that stuff to their AR's right? My 14.5 doesn't have any optics, BUIS, rails, etc. and that is out of choice, not a lack of funding or other reasons. That said some times those items have their place and there are ways to add items like that and not loose the balance. Going with a shorter barrel like you did is one way. Going with a lightweight profile barrel is another way. I try to find a happy medium between weight, balance, utility, etc. Some times the weapon ends up front heavy but why start off that way if you don't have to?

And if you're not willing to go down the NFA route, you limit yourself even further with the 14.5 by having to fool with that "permanent attachment" BS.

What's BS is that statement. There is no part out there that you can't install on a 14.5" upper with a permanent FH (that you can on a weapon without one). If you plan it out ahead of time it's no big deal at all. If you decide to add something later, depending on what it is it may be a little harder and\or cost a little more but it is still do-able. All that has to be done is cut\grind the old FH off and after the new part is installed, permanently attach a new FH. No that isn't as cheap or easy as just unscrewing a FH but it's not that hard or expensive either.

Don't forget that the only time you would have to do that is if you just had to have a one-piece FF rail and didn't have the foresight to install it before permanently attaching the FH. Let's also not forget that there are plenty of rails out there (both FF and non FF) that do not require any of that.

Probably more importantly, how often does the average shooter do that? Sure there are some Gucci shooters that are always switching parts out for the latest and greatest add on but they represent a very small minority.

If people want 16" barrels that fine, I just wish people would quit overstating the negative aspects of the 14.5" barrels

 

[cgv69]

No, I'm pointing out that a soldered muzzle device can have serious corrosion issues. This is relevant because a fair amount of manufacturers do solder and do show poor attention to QC. In addition you would be unlikely to discover the problem within the warranty period of many rifles.

Roger

I understand you feel strongly that the 14.5" option is the best choice for you. That's OK with me. It just isn't the best choice for me.

I understand that point of view and feel the same way. I just feel that a lot of people over-blow the shortcomings (both real and imagined) of the 14.5" barrel. I like to try and make sure that both sides get fairly discussed so that a person can make up their mind with the most accurate info.

I actually view the 16" barrel as slightly better suited for an all-around, do it all AR and for a newbie or somebody who will only own one AR, it's probably the better choice. But if you are going to go 16", it's got to have a mid-length gas system as far as I'm concerned. I know you agree with me there!

 

[Bartholomew Roberts]

But if you are going to go 16", it's got to have a mid-length gas system as far as I'm concerned. I know you agree with me there!

Definitely.

 

[TexasRifleman]

If people want 16" barrels that fine, I just wish people would quit overstating the negative aspects of the 14.5" barrels

No one is overstating the NEGATIVE aspects, it's just that no one can find any POSITIVE aspects.

There isn't a downside to a 14.5 at all, but I can't find a compelling reason that it's BETTER than the 16, thats all.

 

[cgv69]

No one is overstating the NEGATIVE aspects, it's just that no one can find any POSITIVE aspects.

Then you are not paying attention. They are shorter, weight less and balance better. This is not opinion, it's fact.

There isn't a downside to a 14.5 at all, but I can't find a compelling reason that it's BETTER than the 16, thats all.

Well I guess we will have to agree to disagree because for a CQB gun, I can't think of any reason why 16" gun is better. Apparently the Military agrees with me

 

[saltydog]

If people want 16" barrels that fine, I just wish people would quit overstating the negative aspects of the 14.5" barrels

Hey I agree. Get what you want. I know people who like the 24 incher's. Fine. Go for it. I have an 11.5 inch (old CAR15 setup) because that's what I like and that's what I want. My home is 80 yards from the tree lines in any direction. If I could get out a 100 yards at my place I would be lucky. More than good enough for that distance and good enough if I had to enter the bush. Less lethal then the other barrels? Yes and I don't care. I don't know anybody who would stand in front of my shorty from the 100 yard line or closer who has any sense.

 

[Crosshair]

They are shorter, weight less and balance better. This is not opinion, it's fact.

Yes and you are defeating the whole purpose of the 5.56. With FMJ ammo you basicly have a 22 Magnum rimfire on crack, small hole in, small hole out. Go with it if you want to, but realize that you are going to have issues with velocity. Me, I like my guns with longer barrels.

 

[TexasRifleman]

Apparently the Military agrees with me

Man, if you're argument is that it's better because it won a government contract we'll have to have a whole other thread there

 

[Don't Tread On Me]

That argument is bizarre, because if CQC is the primary concern, that's what 11.5" AR's are for.


As far as "carbines" go...16" is better for 3 reasons 1] more velocity 2] no SBR paperwork and tax 3] easy to work with ie, no perm attached muzzle device.

If you know you're never going to need to remove the front sight post, and you don't want to go the SBR route - no problem.


Someone said that there are 2 piece FF's etc...well, yeah there are options, however, if the one that you really want requires the removal of the front sight post and muzzle device - it will be a PITA. The costs involved (gunsmith if you don't DIY) will not justify doing it. It would be cheaper to sell the barrel then buy a 16" ..

 

[MrAcheson]

They are shorter, weight less and balance better. This is not opinion, it's fact.

Length and weight are often overstated. Shorter barrel length is a two edged sword. Yeah it is a little handier, but you lose important velocity.

The difference in weight between the two is probably more minimal than you think. It is really a function of barrel profile anyway. For heavier profiles it might amount to something, but I'm willing to bet the longer handguards on a 16" mean there probably isn't much difference between the two in a government or lightweight profile.

Balance is also not a "fact" issue. It is almost entirely subjective to the shooter. Some people like guns that are a little barrel heavy, etc.

Apparently the Military agrees with me

Unless you are filling out SBR paperwork, you aren't carrying a military 14.5".

 

[JNewell]

They are shorter, weight less and balance better. This is not opinion, it's fact.

If you're comparing a 16" A1 profile + USGI FS to a 14.5" M4 profile (the onlly way the come AFAIK) + AK brake, I'll bet the weight difference is either negligible or in favor or the 16". Balance just isn't going to be much different either way. As far as the difference that the USGI FS makes in length - 1 1/4"? - I just don't see that that is going to make a clear difference in any deployment situation. If you want to shorten the rifle for vehicle deployment or CQB situations, put on a collapsible stock...

 

[Alex45ACP]

Bump... I want to order today and I can't decide.... someone help, haha.

I highly doubt I'll ever take a shot over 100 yds... and the slightly lighter weight and better handling sound good to me... will M193 fragment reliably within 100 yds out of a 14.5" barrel?

Also, I'm not going to bolt tons of useless mall ninja crap onto my rifle... defeats the purpose of the AR IMO. It will have no accessories whatsoever except the sling. I'm using a regular carry handle sight.

 

[Bartholomew Roberts]

Actually, a government profile midlength 16" will weigh less than a 14.5". Weight-wise you are talking a difference of a few ounces. If you intend to leave the rifle pretty stock the weight difference isn't that significant. If you intend to add accessories, then a few ounces here and there add up quickly.

 

[Alex45ACP]

What about in a gas piston upper? Would the weight/handling difference be more noticeable?

As long as the rounds perform the same within 100 yds from both barrels, I think I'm gonna go with 14.5". Ammo-Oracle.com seems to say that they perform the same within 100 yds.

 

[blackhawk2000]

I wish my 14.5 was a 16. It a PITA to deal with the permanently attached muzzle device.

 

[Ivy Mike]

my choice would be 16 unless you're gonna bother with the SBR hassle.

no reason to give up velocity.

 

[tI2ouI3LesoIVIe]

14.5" vs 16"

Here is the general answer to the question:

1. No right or wrong length
2. Use a 14.5" if you:
a. want the profile and don't mind spending the extra $$$ for it and
pinning it unless you wanna fill out the extra paperwork.
b. gonna mount an Trijicon ACOG TA31RCO-M4 it is calibrated for it, but
you won't notice the difference in a 16" barrel ballistically.
c. understand the inherent problems with the shorter gas tube on the
overall reliability of the weapon and the extra stress it causes
d. don't mind a little less accurate rifle at distance and want a more
compact style
3. Use a 16" barrel for any other reason other than shooting for accuracy
than go much longer.

I just bought parts for my new M4-gery, I prefer to call it a
M4-wishesItCouldBe, they'll all be here in the next week or so:

Geissele Hi Speed Trigger (Match)
Magpul Enhanced Trigger Guard
Stag Ambi Selector Switch
Sun Devil Lower Receiver
Magpul M93 Strike Plate
Magpul M93B w/ Carbine Spring and really want H2 Buffer
VLTOR MUR Upper w/FWD Assist & Deflector
PRI (Precision Reflex Inc) Gas Buster Charging Handle
Norgon Ambi-Catch Magazine Catch
Colt NIW M4A1 14.5" SOCOM MDWT 1/7 Barrel
Colt NEW FA M-16 bolt and carrier
Gas Tube Carbine Length w/roll pin
YHM Phantom 5C2 Compensator/Flash Hider
Stag Delta Ring Assembly (Delta Ring, Barrel Snap Ring, Weld Spring)
KNS Anti-Spin Pins (Matched size to Sun Devil Lower)
Magpul MIAD grip
Magpul HK style single pt sling mount
HK 30 rnd high reliability mags w/ Magpuls
Surefire M500A-BL Integrated Weaponlight/Handguard
Trijicon TA31RCO-M4
Colt & Stag lower receiver miscellaneous parts

It'll pretty much look like this:

 

[Brian Williams]

If I can not have an 18" I would take a 16"

 

[Still 2 Many Choices!?]

I voted 14 1/2", cause it looks cool!

Really, I don't think 16" vs. 14 1/2"w muzzle device, really makes all that much difference in terms of lethality at the ranges a .223 carbine excel in. So I don't have an extra 100 fps of velocity... SOOOOO WHAT! If I know I will have the potential to need to be shooting 150+ yards I will probably have a way to retreat, or I would have forseen it, and be using a more suitable firearm(read as: cartridge) for the situation:banghead: ! My M4gery is a selfdefense weapon/Home Defense carbine nothing more... To be honost, I wouldn't trust a 16"( or 20") barreled AR to make bad guys DRT without a well placed FMJ shot at over 200m, YMMV. So unless you are just THAT GOOD at 200+m with your carbine, keep the AR inside of it's niche range of below 200m. Inside 200m, a loss of 100fps will not turn a ,"good hit", into a ,"bad hit" even with FMJ IMHO.

I prefer soft points for my 10 1/4" AR pistol(wich suffers REAL velocity loss compared to a 16"),and 55gr M193 spec for the 14 1/2" barreled Bushmaster with little worry of not putting the hurt on bad people inside of 200m with either.

I don't have the tools or the desire to remove my welded on brake, and enjoy the recoil absorbtion it provides when shooting off hand. It does make for one hell of a light show when shooting at night though! She's a fire breather lol...

Still 2 Many Choices!?

 

[Thin Black Line]

1. I'd rather have a 17" tube with 16" of bore than a 16" tube with 14.5" of bore - 5.56x45 benefits from the extra 100 fps or so of velocity

+1...or +100 fps or so in this case.