.243 or 7mm-08

[Arkansas Paul]

I agree 100% with bpl. I know the .243 lovers will come out of the woodwork saying how you don't need anything bigger, but I have personally seen too many deer run for hundreds of yards, leaving little or no blood trail when shot with a .243. Maybe the shot placement wasn't perfect or the wrong bullet was used. I know when you hit em' through the shoulders with a 7mm ballistic tip, they don't make it out of their own shadow. Now to sit back and wait for the .243 lovers to hate on me.

 

[Art Eatman]

Aw, c'mon, Arkansas Paul. If you shoot 'em in the white spot, they don't go anywhere. Shoulders? Hey, there's some meat, there! Don't shoot Bambi in the eatin' meat!

 

[TexasPatriot.308]

the 7-08 with muzzle brake or managed recoil ammo or the 6.5 with a muzzle brake. she will grow into either of these and they will take just about anything in the lower 48. most people outgrow the .243 though there are diehard .243 hunters. after years of 30-06 and other shoulder bruising rounds the largest caliber I shoot is the .308. I guess I am old school and feel the magnums and such are a fad, macho type round that most people cannot accurately shoot due to recoil. another of my 2 cents.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

I don't like tracking deer. I'll gladly sacrifice the off shoulder for dead right there results.
TexasPatriot.308, I agree to some extent about the magnums. I don't personally shoot one, I'm happy with the .30-06 or .280. Longer ranges or heavier game is where the magnums shine, obviously. But I will never be guilty of not using enough gun for the game I'm hunting. I won't use a marginal round when I have access to a better one. And I don't care what anyone says, for whitetails, .30-06, .270, .280, 7mm-08, and a host of others are flat out better than a .243 Win. That's not to say a .243 won't do the job. It obviously will. It's advantage lies in the fact that it is a better varmint round than the others. See, I do give the .243 it's due. It's hard to beat for coyotes and the like.

 

[highorder]

rizbunk77,

Conversely, sighting in at 100 yds makes no sense, at least where we are from. Very novice advice. With that kind of advice the poor girl would be put at a severe disadvantage out here.

If you added your location to your profile, people wouldn't be so quick to shout you down.

As for me? I'll take the 7mm-08.

I like the heavier bullet, and recoil can be mitigated in many ways that don't involve caliber.

 

[jbkebert]

I'll throw in my .02. I really don't think you could go wrong with either caliber. I do think the .243 is the better dual role caliber. That being said I believe that shots taken at deer sized game over 200 yards the 7-08 wins. I don't know where the OP is located. If shots are typically taken under 200 yards and his daughter is a competent marksman the .243 all the way. Longer shots the later. Also what type of situation are we talking about. Will she be shooting from a stationary treestand with a shooting rail or walking and shooting from steady stix. Steady stix leave more margin for error and bullet placment is much harder to be pin point accurate. In that case I think the 7-08 for the heavier bullet. Also I really don't think that recoil is a huge issue here. A 7-08 is very similar to a .308 win both of my boys ages 8 and 10 shoot my .308 without any concern for kick. Caleb my 8 year old is 4' 6" and weighs around 75 pounds. A good recoil pad and a fairly heavy rifle at least 7 lbs will tame most loads. Just my thoughts but plenty of good advice on this thread.

The 243 is a compromise cartridge and is at the low end of the range for deer hunting. It is probably best suited for use by experienced (and ethical) hunters who know how to pick their shots and exactly where to place the bullet. It leaves less margin for error

Good advice as well. I had my son sight in his rifle at 150 yards and really work for tight groups. We then set in the treestand that he would be using. I placed 8 clay pigeons at various ranges from 50 yards to just shy of 200. I had him take aim over a empty chamber and dry fire a shot at each target. Then we repeated with live ammo. I think this builds confidence in the childs abilites to shoot accuratly. Finally while hunting we had several does and turkeys in the field we were hunting. I had my son take aim at several deer and looking for that tuft of fur that was the sweet spot. He would take aim and gently squeeze the trigger without hammer being cocked. He would quietly whisper bang. I then would ask did you get your deer and after a couple times. He looked at me with the assured look and say yeah its down. Well when crunch time came he preformed like a season vet. Anyway long story short being able to hit at the range and being able to hit in the field requires some practice at both.

 

[Franklin7X57]

how about splitting the difference? 250 Savage or 257 Roberts

 

[All4eyes]

I know little of either, but am interested in the .257. Please tell more.

I updated my profile a touch, I am in Central North Dakota. I am in the heartland of waterfall, pheasants, and deer. I hunt alot, and bring the kids with me. As far as deer hunting goes, they walk in the field with me. There is very little stand hunting here, as there is lots of open prairie, so you are limited. Most of your shots are from 20 to 150 yds, with 100 about being average.

 

[litman252]

Here are a bunch of numbers, I went off a reloading manual and used middle of the road #'s. I did use 100 for .243, might be big for caliber compared to 7-08, but used 115 instead of 120's for the BOB, please feel free to correct if needed....

I'll do balistics next

.243
Bullet weight in grains 100
Velocity in fps 3000
Powder charge in grains 41
Weight of firearm in lbs 8

Recoil Impulse in (lbs sec) 2.06
Velocity of recoiling firearm (fps) 8.29
Free recoil energy in (ft/lbs) 8.53

.257 Roberts
Bullet weight in grains 115
Velocity in fps 2700
Powder charge in grains 38
Weight of firearm in lbs 8

Recoil Impulse in (lbs sec) 2.05
Velocity of recoiling firearm (fps) 8.29
Free recoil energy in (ft/lbs) 8.47

7-08
Bullet weight in grains 120
Velocity in fps 3000
Powder charge in grains 43
Weight of firearm in lbs 8

Recoil Impulse in (lbs sec) 2.36
Velocity of recoiling firearm (fps) 9.5
Free recoil energy in (ft/lbs) 11.21

Tony

 

[litman252]

.257 w/ a 115 @ 2700 1.5 @200 again...
I would not sight in quite this high this time, just over 3" at the common range of 125 yards would bug me, YMMV

Range Impact
0 -1.5
25 0.06
50 1.32
75 2.25
100 2.85
125 3.09
150 2.98
175 2.49
200 1.6
225 0.31
250 -1.4
275 -3.57
300 -6.18

Tony

 

[lefteyedom]

Quarter bore rule!!

250 savage, 257 Roberts, 25-06, 257 weatherby.

The Bob would be perfect for your young Lady.

Other wise a 260 Remington.

 

[rangerruck]

the 257 is nice; it is based off the old 7x57 mauser, that really knocked em dead(us) during battle of San Juan Hill(?) Have I got the right battle here?
I think this was the round which made us give up the Krag rifle, and look for better.
It holds a bit less powder than a 308 cart, and fires a bit heavier bullet than a 243, but slightly less weighty than a 7milly.
Only prob is, it is not a 308 case, and the ammo is a bit harder to find, factory wise, but any decent gunshop or chainstore should carry it, such as Dick's, Gander mtn, Bass pro, Academy, maybe even Wallyworld, if your's still carries ammo.

As for the 257 Weatherby; could be the best deer getter round of all time, a pure lightning strike, it is also one of the fastest and flattest shooting centerfires ever made. If I rmrbr right, a 250 yd zero, is only like 21 to 25 inches low at 500 yds. Amazing!!! But it is Weatherby ammo, so be prepaired
for Wallet anuerism.

 

[bpl]

The 257 Roberts is an excellent, low recoiling choice. Slightly more recoil than 243, but capable of firing 115, 117 and 120gr bullets for deer. Bigger hole, heavier bullet. Less recoil than 7mm-08. If your down in TX hunting the deerlits, you can use the 100gr bullet in the 257 Roberts as well. The 243 fires its 95 or 100gr bullets slightly flatter but if you look here: http://www.chuckhawks.com/rifle_trajectory_table.htm

you will see that the Max Point Blank Range +/-3" is 283yrds for 243 100gr and 271yrds for 257 Roberts 120gr.

The downside is ammo availability. The Bob is not very common, so you'd need to plan ahead and not expect to find it in a store when you get there. Also, many factory loads are underloaded, so the ballistics don't look so good. Remington's load is an example, 117gr 2650fps. Hornady and Winchester load the 117gr at 2780fps and Hornady Lite Magnum load drives it at 2940fps. I like the Hornady offerings, myself. Not real expensive and of high quality.

http://www.midwayusa.com/browse/Bro...3&categoryId=7971&categoryString=653***690***

 

[bpl]

The 260 is also a good, low recoiling round, but suffers from the ammo availability problem as well.

 

[Leaky Waders]

I really like this thread

I like the information - especially the linked ballistics tables.

I'm wondering...most ballistics tables try to keep a 3 inch arc for deer sized loads and 1.5 inch arc for varmint sized loads.

What would the ballistics tables look like for deer sized loads, with varmint sized arc's?

In other words...you buy one rifle...to shoot deer and varmints. You don't want to have to keep changing your scope and setup all the time during hunting season to accomodate the critter of the weekend.

So how do you set-up your rifle for maximum point blank range? Do you setup your rifle to shoot the standard table and then hold over for varmints? Or, do you setup your rifle for the flatest shooting table based upon a deer sized bullet and then use that bullet and hold over for long range varmints?

Or...to complicate it further...is there a scope with some kind of built in memory setting for the reticle for different bullet weights? Like setting "a" could be for varmint sized loads and ballistics and setting "b" for deer sized loads and ballistics?

Personally I just setup for the standard table and then holdover for what I need too. But, since i'm 7mm08 scope shopping now i've found that things have changed with mildot reticles. My scopes now have duplex or german #4 reticles, but the mildots look intersting.

 

[bpl]

I would think ideally you would change your zero for the load you're using, be it a light vamint load or a heavy deer load. I suppose you could spend some time at the range firing both and record your scopes elevation changes when you have sighted in for MPBR for your varmint and deer loads and ensure that they are repeatable. If I was using one rifle for both, I'd probably sight in for the deer load during deer season and change my zero for the varmint load for the rest of the year.

 

[All4eyes]

What benefits will the .257 have over the 7mm08, as far as felt recoil, and will it also double as a varmint round?

See now you have dad looking at something that is not just for his little girl, but a s a new project for them to share. LOL

 

[bpl]

The 257 Roberts was the dual purpose round until the 243 came out. If you plan to do a lot of varminting and don't reload, the 243 would be the better choice, I guess. The 257 Roberts is a bit better choice for primarily deer hunting. The 257 Bob will have slightly more recoil than the 243 and a bit less then 7mm-08. Probably closer to a 243 than a 7mm-08. I see 257 Bob loads listed down to a 60gr bullet, but it looks like tha standard varmint bullet is about 75gr.

 

[bpl]

Look up some old posts on the 257 Roberts by GooseGestopo and MCgunner. They are both quite experienced with this cartridge.

 

[NCsmitty]

The 257 Roberts and the 6MM/244 Remington are both based on the 7MM/8MM Mauser case. The 257 has about a 2gr powder advantage over the 7MM-08 but has a lower SAAMI rated working pressure.


NCsmitty