25-06 vs whitetail
- Thread starter dubya450
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The .25-06 Rem is an under-estimated round. While some prefer the 120 grain, I prefer the 100 grain projectile in .257 caliber. Don't overlook practicing for deer season by popping some varmint-type critters. The hand-loaded 75, 85 and 95 grain projectiles are explosive on them. 
Valnar, I really do like the 260 rem. One of the guys that hunted with us last year had one and about 2 hours after I shot my 9 pointer (1 shot kill BAR 7MM-08) we were walking a well used trail and jumped a very strange looking 12 pointer which, unfortunately, took 6 shots and an hour of tracking to bag. I don't blame the 6 needed shots on the 260. I think it was just the fact the guy was older (55 is old to me lol I'm 25) and hadn't been hunting since his brother died some 10 years ago and he got a bad case of buck fever. I'm going to post pics of the two bucks last year if i can figure out how to from my phone. Anyone that can help me with uploading a pic?
Olympus
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.25-06 is my preferred caliber now. I have .243, .270, .308, and .300 Win Mag and I have yet to run into a situation that my .25-06 couldnt handle. I've even taken two hogs with the caliber, one was a 298lb boar. I always get a clean pass through and devastating results with a Hornady SST bullet.
Kachok
Member
^ I will second that.
260Rem, 6.5x55SE, 6.5 Creedmore, and 6.5x47 Lapua are vastly more versitle then any .257 cal. Here is what I mean.
For varmint class game, the 25-06 has a slight edge over the 6.5 ballistic quadruplets, if sheer speed is your game an 85gr BT at 3,600fps is sure to make a mess of anything small and furry. The 6.5s are no slouch either, they can push speeds up to 3,500fps with the same bullet weights.
CXP2 (aka deer/pronghorn) class game, now we level the playing feild, while the 25-06 has some zippy 100s and solid performing 115gr bullets the 6.5s bring 120s and it's mainstay the 140gr bullets to the table. No .257 cal can come close to the ballistic performance of a high BC 140gr 6.5, even with it's higher intitial speed and energy the differnce at long range is astounding. Take a look at a max load comparison using the best BC bullets for each. Assume 10mph crosswind
25-06 115gr Berger VLD muzzle speed/energy 3,150fps/2,534ft lbs. 500yd speed/energy/drift 2164fps/1196ft/ft lbs/ 17.4"
6.5x55 140gr Berger VLD muzzle speed/energy 2,800fps/2,437ft lbs 500yd speed/energy/drift 2101 fps/1372 ft lbs/ 14.65"
Clear victory for the 6.5s
Other then their astounding external ballistics the 6.5s with 1:8 twists can also use ultra heavy for caliber 155-160gr bullets, these can penatrate as well as many of the much larger safari calibers and give the little sissy kickers disproportionate killing power on much larger game. They have been used for many years on game ranging from the largest of bear to elephant with great sucess.
Now all of that said no deer is likely to notice the difference between a good bullet from a 25-06 and a 6.5mm within normal hunting ranges, so if the 25-06 floats your boat by all means go with it.
BTW three of the 6.5 quadruplets are short action giving them a touch more utility if a handy rifle is in your criteria, and they all run about 8-10gr less powder then the 25-06 so they are a touch cheaper to reload and are a little easier on barrels.
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Wow! Thats a monster. The closest place from where I live that wild boars roam is about 5 hours south in Iowa. My buddy and i have been talking alot lately about making a trip there to get a few. Sounds like alot of fun. Are they pretty gamey tasting? I think some grilled wild pork chops sound delicious!
Kachok
Member
Wild pork beats store bought junk anyday. Just make sure you prep them right and they are fantastic, the smaller sows are the best. We are overrun with hogs here in the southeast, and poor Texas is flooded with them, we have an all year hunting season for piggies I like heavier and or bonded bullets for hogs, the big ones can have a very thick tough hide that is made up of nothing but scar tissue. They are known to reach over half a ton here in the southeast, a 780 pounder was killed in my county a couple years ago, took three shots from a 30-06 to put him down, and a fourth to finnish him off!
http://blog.al.com/live/2009/10/big_boar_wild_hog_weighing_780.html
I like heavier and or bonded bullets for hogs, the big ones can have a very thick tough hide that is made up of nothing but scar tissue. They are known to reach over half a ton here in the southeast, a 780 pounder was killed in my county a couple years ago, took three shots from a 30-06 to put him down, and a fourth to finnish him off!http://blog.al.com/live/2009/10/big_boar_wild_hog_weighing_780.html
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Kachok
Member
No sponsership program in Alabama, but the year round season is for private land only. I don't have any woodland myself otherwise I would invite you down to blast a few of these things. If you ever want to see thousands of hogs go to Texas, I lived there for years, they are so thick they started attacking cattle and in some areas they have even started killing people, their hog hunting laws are very liberal needless to say. We never had a hog hunt where we went home empty handed.
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Old krow
Member
I've hunted just to the east of Kachok in the adjacent county. I killed a 300 pounder a couple years ago. There is some public land there, but you'd need a boat to get anywhere decent... at least from the Baldwin County side. Aside from that, it isn't too expensive.
I haven't read the rules lately, but I believe the southern portion is still guns as long as another season is open. Maybe Kachok can clarify for you. I don't think that you can on the North side... not sure though.
Kachok
Member
The WMA to the north of me allows rifles but the one to the west is shotguns and bows only. I don't hunt either of them, I have friends with thousands of acres of land just north of Pensacola. Lots of nice souther bucks around there and not much hunting pressure. I know a few people that hunt the WMAs and they told me that you need a boat on this end too.
Tentwing
Member
Well,.... I'm kinda late joining this party, but I'll throw in two cents
Just like Kachok said in the second post on this thread. I myself have had great success with 117gr Sierra Gamekings. I'm sure other bullets will do well, but so far I have only used the SGK's. I have been using a 25-06 for 3 years now,( Ruger Hawkeye ) and have all but retired my other hunting rifles. Five Whitetails, three Boars and two Coyotes all looked like they had been hit by the Hammer of Thor.
The kick is easily manageable. There is plenty of range, and the trajectory is comparably flat. There are also different loads available among most bullet makers for folks like me who still need to learn how to reload. I have a buddy who swears by 100gr Barnes TSX bullets.
I only regret not giving the 25-06 a try earlier in my hunting life.
......Tentwing
Just like Kachok said in the second post on this thread. I myself have had great success with 117gr Sierra Gamekings. I'm sure other bullets will do well, but so far I have only used the SGK's. I have been using a 25-06 for 3 years now,( Ruger Hawkeye ) and have all but retired my other hunting rifles. Five Whitetails, three Boars and two Coyotes all looked like they had been hit by the Hammer of Thor.
The kick is easily manageable. There is plenty of range, and the trajectory is comparably flat. There are also different loads available among most bullet makers for folks like me who still need to learn how to reload. I have a buddy who swears by 100gr Barnes TSX bullets.
I only regret not giving the 25-06 a try earlier in my hunting life.
......Tentwing
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GooseGestapo
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The matter of the 1/10" twist of the .25's and it's relevence is greatly over-blown.
FWIW; the b.c. of the Berger 115gr .257" VLD is .550.
I've loaded and shot the .25/06 a good deal, and have used the near duplicate .257Roberts at essentially the same velocity for over 150 deer since 1983. I also have, and have taken deer (and lost some too, more on this shortly) with the .257Wby.
A favorite deer bullet is the simple Hornady 100gr "Interlok" Soft point. It expands to 1/2" and only sheds ~35% of it's weight, even at 3,600fps from the .257wby. Another excellent bullet is the Hornady 117gr BtSpt. Another "Interlok".
IMO; the "WORST" bullet for the .25/06 and .257wby is the 115gr Nosler B.T. along with the 100gr B.T. I've had both "blow" up and lose deer.
The Berger VLD is actually better as it penetrates a bit further before it "disintegrates". But, it also retains ~50% of its weight and in every instance in which I've used it,it has exited the deer. Leaves a 5-6" exit wound...... This is with the .257Roberts @ 2,975fps, so do shoot them in the ribs....
I have a .260 as well as .270wcf, and 7mm08. I would use the .25/06 for any application that I would use any of the others. I can't imagine an elk or moose going far with a well placed Swift or Nosler partition....
The small difference in b.c. and s.d. is over-blown, and only matters in target shooting far, far further than the bullets are designed to expand at. (far below the expansion threshold of 1,600-1,900fps for most "hunting" bullets.
Out to 400-500yds the difference between the .257, .260, .277, and .284 is really insignificant......
I hit a ~110lb doe at a later "lased" 547yds. The 129gr Hornady PtSpt hit the deer low through the chest as observed.. The deer jumped straight up and kicked, and ran into adjacent woods. No hair, blood or deer was found.... So much for the mythical 6.5...... Another 180lb buck was shot with the Speer 120gr Spt. at 2,900fps chrono'd from the .260. It penetrated ~18" and was against the pelvis and was expanded to .550" and weighted 90gr. Exactly as I'd expect the .257Roberts (and likewise .25/06) to have done with a 100-120gr .257" Speer "HotCor".
FWIW; the b.c. of the Berger 115gr .257" VLD is .550.
I've loaded and shot the .25/06 a good deal, and have used the near duplicate .257Roberts at essentially the same velocity for over 150 deer since 1983. I also have, and have taken deer (and lost some too, more on this shortly) with the .257Wby.
A favorite deer bullet is the simple Hornady 100gr "Interlok" Soft point. It expands to 1/2" and only sheds ~35% of it's weight, even at 3,600fps from the .257wby. Another excellent bullet is the Hornady 117gr BtSpt. Another "Interlok".
IMO; the "WORST" bullet for the .25/06 and .257wby is the 115gr Nosler B.T. along with the 100gr B.T. I've had both "blow" up and lose deer.
The Berger VLD is actually better as it penetrates a bit further before it "disintegrates". But, it also retains ~50% of its weight and in every instance in which I've used it,it has exited the deer. Leaves a 5-6" exit wound...... This is with the .257Roberts @ 2,975fps, so do shoot them in the ribs....
I have a .260 as well as .270wcf, and 7mm08. I would use the .25/06 for any application that I would use any of the others. I can't imagine an elk or moose going far with a well placed Swift or Nosler partition....
The small difference in b.c. and s.d. is over-blown, and only matters in target shooting far, far further than the bullets are designed to expand at. (far below the expansion threshold of 1,600-1,900fps for most "hunting" bullets.
Out to 400-500yds the difference between the .257, .260, .277, and .284 is really insignificant......
I hit a ~110lb doe at a later "lased" 547yds. The 129gr Hornady PtSpt hit the deer low through the chest as observed.. The deer jumped straight up and kicked, and ran into adjacent woods. No hair, blood or deer was found.... So much for the mythical 6.5...... Another 180lb buck was shot with the Speer 120gr Spt. at 2,900fps chrono'd from the .260. It penetrated ~18" and was against the pelvis and was expanded to .550" and weighted 90gr. Exactly as I'd expect the .257Roberts (and likewise .25/06) to have done with a 100-120gr .257" Speer "HotCor".
Kachok
Member
Ballistic tips are not designed for impact speeds over 3200fps, which with a 115gr 25-06 you won't excede even at the muzzle, for 257 WBY speeds you should have been using the Accubond or Partition on close-medium range shots, always know your bullet I have shot Ballistic Tips for years and never had one come appart, they have a pretty sturdy base and I have yet to recover one even with over 3,000fps loads and close range shots, they have all gone through and through. Don't take my word for it check out the reviews for them on Midway http://www.midwayusa.com/product/65...iber-257-diameter-115-grain-spitzer-box-of-50
BTW the BC of the 115gr Berger hunting VLD is .466 (not .550) hardly any better then the .453 of the Nosler BT
I have shot Ballistic Tips for years and never had one come appart, they have a pretty sturdy base and I have yet to recover one even with over 3,000fps loads and close range shots, they have all gone through and through. Don't take my word for it check out the reviews for them on Midway http://www.midwayusa.com/product/65...iber-257-diameter-115-grain-spitzer-box-of-50BTW the BC of the 115gr Berger hunting VLD is .466 (not .550) hardly any better then the .453 of the Nosler BT
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SlowFuse
Member
The 25-06 is the whole reason I got into reloading. I enjoy this caliber more than any other -06 cartridge I have. As for the cost, you can in fact spent $5-600 as you thought on reloading equipment. But its definitely not necessary. I started out with second hand presses from a friend that was upgrading and bought mostly Lee and Frankford Arsenal equipment/accessories. For both of my presses (1 single stage and 1 progressive) and everything needed to successfully create rounds, including powder and dies I'd say I had around $200 into it. Ive since added more, but I wanted to start out cheap in case I didn't stick with it.
I can't speak from experience on deer because I am not a deer hunter. However, I use projectiles on the lighter side like 85 to 100 grains on coyote around here when my AR wont reach them, or more like when i'm not comfortable taking the shot... The 85 gr silvertips running right under 3500 fps will make a mess of a yote. However, I have no doubts that a well constructed bullet like a 120 gr Nosler Partition would take any whitetail you come across, without the explosive effects.
I can't speak from experience on deer because I am not a deer hunter. However, I use projectiles on the lighter side like 85 to 100 grains on coyote around here when my AR wont reach them, or more like when i'm not comfortable taking the shot... The 85 gr silvertips running right under 3500 fps will make a mess of a yote. However, I have no doubts that a well constructed bullet like a 120 gr Nosler Partition would take any whitetail you come across, without the explosive effects.
I've always been a 6.5mm or 7mm fan in moderate recoiling cartridges (ie 260, 6.5x55, 6.5-06, 7mm-08 and 280). However, I met a hunting buddy a few years ago who uses 100 grainers exclusively in his 25-06. I've witnessed some of his kills on deer and hogs both near and far. Schitt dies emphatically when hit with that combo. Impressive cartridge....flat shooting, hard hitting. It's next on my bucket list!
Of course, I must qualify my previous post. There's nothing magical about any reasonable big game cartridge. The order of importance of any successful big game harvest is:
1. Bullet placement
2. Bullet construction for the task at hand
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3. Cartridge Headstamp
1. Bullet placement
2. Bullet construction for the task at hand
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3. Cartridge Headstamp
Kachok
Member
The super quick kills of the 25-06 are no mystery, it is just a good combonation of very high speed, SD, frontal area, and energy. It takes that rapid shock effect of a 243 and amps it up a notch with about 20% more bullet mass and energy. One day I will have a quarterbore of my own to play with, but in the meen time I load my 6.5 with 120BTs at 3,000fps, that copies the external and terminal ballistics of the factory 115gr 25-06 to a tee, and yes it kills with remarkable authority. The last deer jumped on impact and by time he hit the ground he was limp, liquid lungs and took out two ribs on the exit wound. You simply could not ask for better on game performance, especialy from a sissy kicker. BTW The most gruesome exit wound I have ever seen on a deer was not from a 338 ultra mag or 50 BMG it was the result of a 115gr 25-06, I would describe it for you but words fail me, half of the far side ribs where hanging out like someone had fired an antitank RPG through him, I have studied terminal ballistics my entire adult life and I still have no idea how that little bullet did that.
We used to see effects like that from 165grn balistics in the .30-06 and .300s that were popular with my hunting buddies. Not every time, and not always from the same placement. The only thing that seemed to be consistent was the fact that the bullet contacted bone at the point of penetration, rib, shoulder, spine, skull LOL. Seems to me that the bone splinters badly and if there is enough energy/velocity comes along for the ride.
.453-.466 isnt all that shabby either way. My favorite loads for the .30-06 are 165 balistics with a bc of .475, at around 2950. So either the .25-06 or the .257 would shoot flater then what im loading in the 06 as far as most of us should be shooting, and kick less also.
Kachok
Member
I got some 168gr ballistic tips loaded for my 30-06 (@3,000fps!) that I cannot wait to try out on my next hunt. If the damage that my little sweed does at that speed is any clue I am expecting dramatic results, mabey a little too much so for southern whitetail, but they will be perfect if a big hog shows up I shoot everything from SSTs to Game Kings, Partitions, Core-lokts and Accubonds but Ballistic Tips have always been my fav for deer sized game, as long as you are not pushing them to heavy magnum speeds they hold together just fine, and do MASSIVE damage going through the vitals. Game Kings have always shot really well for me, just wish they would destroy the entire chest cavity like my Noslers do, mind you still very effective just not as dramatic. I really want to get some Berger VLDs for my 6.5x55 but the only Berger dealer within 200 miles does not carry them
I shoot everything from SSTs to Game Kings, Partitions, Core-lokts and Accubonds but Ballistic Tips have always been my fav for deer sized game, as long as you are not pushing them to heavy magnum speeds they hold together just fine, and do MASSIVE damage going through the vitals. Game Kings have always shot really well for me, just wish they would destroy the entire chest cavity like my Noslers do, mind you still very effective just not as dramatic. I really want to get some Berger VLDs for my 6.5x55 but the only Berger dealer within 200 miles does not carry them Those CT balistics should be pretty devastating, My best friends father used those in a .300 almost exclusively. They both took Nice Elk with one shot apiece using that rifle and load.
Ive used the bergers in my 7mm and the affects were about like they say they should be, pass thru the ribs, then splat. Ive only shot two animals so far tho one doe at about 10yds, and a big buck at 250ish.
Ive used the bergers in my 7mm and the affects were about like they say they should be, pass thru the ribs, then splat. Ive only shot two animals so far tho one doe at about 10yds, and a big buck at 250ish.
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