I'm not too knowledgeable when it comes to the Cetme and FAL .308s, but I've read a lot of good things about both and am thinking about buying one. So thumbing through Shotgun News, I see ads for Cetmes, Cetme G-3 types, and Cetme G-3s (are these all the same thing?) for $290 to $360. Then, there is an FAL L1A1 Sporter for $450, and an FAL R1A1 Sporter for $530. I'm just kinda lost, and would appreciate any information about which is best, and what's the best value. Thanks.
.308 semis: Cetme vs. FAL
- Thread starter SteelyDan
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It's sort of scary how at any given time half the people on THR are mulling over the same gun purchases I am. Get out of my head!
I'm still educating myself on the two rifles, but big points of what I'm hearing are: CETME's only like milsurp ammo, commercial .308 may or may not swell and jam in the fluted chamber, whereupon the extractor yanks the casehead off, and then you cycle another .308 into the ripped off casing, blah blah hell on earth. I'm not interested in doing that at all.
FAL builds that just randomly show up at the local hook & bullet may not have the requisite 7 crucial US made parts, which causes Federal Agents to come through the bedroom windows in the middle of the night, shoot your dog, fondle your wife, and steal your bible. I'm not into that either.
I guess basically, if you have time and a credit card, even if you get a turd with either one you can eventually get it running, but FALs seem to be a favorite for build it yourself types, and are apparently easier to deal with except for where the barrel meets the upper. Probably the CETME has more horror stories associated with it, and truly strange things can happen to it if you get a Century with a ground bolt, like negative headspace.
If you have a lot of time for internet research, you'll eventually discover that there is no retailer anywhere who dosen't have someone claiming that they're a bastard who pokes old ladies in the eye with a sharp stick, so it's hard to feel confident on this. Still, at the moment I'm leaning towards the Imbel FAL. If I knew a FFL who'd do reasonable transfers, I'd go Ohio Rapid Fire FAL, since they're the exception to the old lady/sharp stick thing.
I'm still educating myself on the two rifles, but big points of what I'm hearing are: CETME's only like milsurp ammo, commercial .308 may or may not swell and jam in the fluted chamber, whereupon the extractor yanks the casehead off, and then you cycle another .308 into the ripped off casing, blah blah hell on earth. I'm not interested in doing that at all.
FAL builds that just randomly show up at the local hook & bullet may not have the requisite 7 crucial US made parts, which causes Federal Agents to come through the bedroom windows in the middle of the night, shoot your dog, fondle your wife, and steal your bible. I'm not into that either.
I guess basically, if you have time and a credit card, even if you get a turd with either one you can eventually get it running, but FALs seem to be a favorite for build it yourself types, and are apparently easier to deal with except for where the barrel meets the upper. Probably the CETME has more horror stories associated with it, and truly strange things can happen to it if you get a Century with a ground bolt, like negative headspace.
If you have a lot of time for internet research, you'll eventually discover that there is no retailer anywhere who dosen't have someone claiming that they're a bastard who pokes old ladies in the eye with a sharp stick, so it's hard to feel confident on this. Still, at the moment I'm leaning towards the Imbel FAL. If I knew a FFL who'd do reasonable transfers, I'd go Ohio Rapid Fire FAL, since they're the exception to the old lady/sharp stick thing.
iamkris
Member
A quick primer and my own personal experiences:
CETME
CETME's, CETME G3-types and CETME G-3's are all the same thing...CETMEs. Frankly, tacking on the "G3" to the CETME is a bit misleading if you ask me and not completely ethical. The CETME parts at Century are running out (especially decent wood stocks) and they are slapping on the same crappy plastic furniture and calling them "G3-types". The word is that Century is doing a much better job on the workmanship of the CETME's right now...a year ago I opted for spending $100 more for a Century C91 (a true rebuilt G3) because of their shoddy workmanship and lack of replacement parts. Still, at ~$300 that isn't a bad way to get into a 308 MBR.
L1A1 and R1A1
These are Century's designations for their inch pattern and inch/metric mixed pattern rifles (someody correct me if I go that wrong). I have a buddy who has a Century-built L1A1 with some STG parts mixed in on an Imbel receiver. He paid $600 which was about $300 too much...biggest piece of crap I've ever seen (sights loose, selector won't stay in position, horrible finish). The ads for these new rifles say "best quality we've ever seen from Century"...buyer beware
My Own Opinion on G3 vs FAL
I own a DSA STG58A and the above mentioned G3. Everyone has a preference but the FAL wins hands down in my opinion.
STG
** Better ergonomics on selector and mag release
** More "solid" feeling
** Bolt hold open
** Better positioned charging handle
** Easier to clean and maintain (with action breaks open easily, not a gooey mess like G3 chamber)
** Easier to adjust sights (but still atrocious)
G3
** More "handy" size than full-size FAL
** Slightly better trigger once you have it cleaned up
** Better sight picture (in my opinion)
YMMV.
CETME
CETME's, CETME G3-types and CETME G-3's are all the same thing...CETMEs. Frankly, tacking on the "G3" to the CETME is a bit misleading if you ask me and not completely ethical. The CETME parts at Century are running out (especially decent wood stocks) and they are slapping on the same crappy plastic furniture and calling them "G3-types". The word is that Century is doing a much better job on the workmanship of the CETME's right now...a year ago I opted for spending $100 more for a Century C91 (a true rebuilt G3) because of their shoddy workmanship and lack of replacement parts. Still, at ~$300 that isn't a bad way to get into a 308 MBR.
L1A1 and R1A1
These are Century's designations for their inch pattern and inch/metric mixed pattern rifles (someody correct me if I go that wrong). I have a buddy who has a Century-built L1A1 with some STG parts mixed in on an Imbel receiver. He paid $600 which was about $300 too much...biggest piece of crap I've ever seen (sights loose, selector won't stay in position, horrible finish). The ads for these new rifles say "best quality we've ever seen from Century"...buyer beware
My Own Opinion on G3 vs FAL
I own a DSA STG58A and the above mentioned G3. Everyone has a preference but the FAL wins hands down in my opinion.
STG
** Better ergonomics on selector and mag release
** More "solid" feeling
** Bolt hold open
** Better positioned charging handle
** Easier to clean and maintain (with action breaks open easily, not a gooey mess like G3 chamber)
** Easier to adjust sights (but still atrocious)
G3
** More "handy" size than full-size FAL
** Slightly better trigger once you have it cleaned up
** Better sight picture (in my opinion)
YMMV.
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Sylvilagus Aquaticus
Member
I've got a FAL STG58 that is very pleasing, both asthetically and ergonomically. I prefer the FAL sights over the HK style. It is more pleasant to shoot for longer periods of time than any of the HK/CETME's I've owned/fired and I would daresay I'd buy another over a HK variant again.
Mine was built from an excellent parts kit and uses a DSA receiver. My accuracy has been exemplary for all intents and purposes.
I'd suggest finding someone who owns a CETME and someone who owns a FAL and arrange to shoot them at the same session. See which one works best for you. They make ice cream in different flavors. I happen to prefer chocolate, but you might like butter pecan.
Regards,
Rabbit.
Mine was built from an excellent parts kit and uses a DSA receiver. My accuracy has been exemplary for all intents and purposes.
I'd suggest finding someone who owns a CETME and someone who owns a FAL and arrange to shoot them at the same session. See which one works best for you. They make ice cream in different flavors. I happen to prefer chocolate, but you might like butter pecan.
Regards,
Rabbit.
Swamprabbit
Member
I have never fired the G3/CETME types but I used to own the G3's smaller brother - the HK-93 (.223). I only wish I still had the HK only because they are selling for over $2,000 now! I didn't like the way the rifle felt, the ergonomics, or the sights.
As for the FAL, I am the proud owner of an IMBEL FAL sold, in the late 80's, by Springfield Armory as the SAR-48. I love that rifle and it has had many rounds through it.
The bad things about FALs now is that there are so many "builds" on the market today. You will hear more bad than good about the Century products. Like the others have said above, I have heard a lot of good things about the Stg58s from DS Arms.
As for the FAL, I am the proud owner of an IMBEL FAL sold, in the late 80's, by Springfield Armory as the SAR-48. I love that rifle and it has had many rounds through it.
The bad things about FALs now is that there are so many "builds" on the market today. You will hear more bad than good about the Century products. Like the others have said above, I have heard a lot of good things about the Stg58s from DS Arms.
Charles S
Member
Great questions,
I am thinking along the same lines myself. I just can't decide which MBR to get.
I am really leaning toward the FAL, but I just have not decided yet.
Charles
I am thinking along the same lines myself. I just can't decide which MBR to get.
I am really leaning toward the FAL, but I just have not decided yet.
Charles
RepublicanMan
member
Just a minor point of interest...the German G3 is nothing more than a better built Cetme....the original design of the G3 IS the Cetme that you see for sale everywhere, just made much better. (not all stamped and better QC)
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If you have the means, go with the DSA, if you want an inxpensive, entry level .308 battle rifle, buy a Cetme that you have had time to look over closely.
There's another thread out here in one of the gunboards I visit that I am waiting for a reply on how to check the headspace and what else to look for in a Cetme.......If I hear anything back on it I'll gladly let you know.
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If you have the means, go with the DSA, if you want an inxpensive, entry level .308 battle rifle, buy a Cetme that you have had time to look over closely.
There's another thread out here in one of the gunboards I visit that I am waiting for a reply on how to check the headspace and what else to look for in a Cetme.......If I hear anything back on it I'll gladly let you know.
SaLted_peanUTs
Member
I almost bought a Century Arms Cetme yesterday, but after reading some of the problems I've read about and not really sure what to look for, I didn't. I'll either go with a PTR-91 or I'll bild my own HK-91 G3 using a parts kit from Florida Gunworks or somewhere else if someone can point me to a better deal and an aluminum reciever with a pictinny rail from guns-n-stuff.
The Century CETMEs don`t have the same build quality as say a DSA FAL but for $350 or less nobody should expect them to. Research them well,look at a LOT of them before you buy. After you buy,strip it and clean it REALLY WELL,lube and shoot. I suspect the same rules apply equally for sub $400 FALs. To my understanding Century is using the same US built G-3 pattern furniture and US built recievers for both their G-3s and CETMEs so their CETMEs are technically CETME/G-3 hybrids. In any case,who cares? It`s a solid,7.62NATO battle rifle for cheap that takes $3 hi caps! 
Given an unlimited budget I`d certainly choose a DSA FAL over my CETME but after looking at lots of low buck FALs I felt the CETME was a better buy and I`m very happy with it. Marcus
Given an unlimited budget I`d certainly choose a DSA FAL over my CETME but after looking at lots of low buck FALs I felt the CETME was a better buy and I`m very happy with it. MarcusRepublicanMan
member
Alrighty then Marcus.....when I get ready to head down to Surplus City I'll drag you down there with me so you can make sure I don't get a lemon.
pdt203
Member
I have the CETME from CAI and an FAL built on an IMBEL receiver. Love them both.
Johnny in Huntsville
Johnny in Huntsville
standingbear
Member
I got an ohio rapid fire fal carbine for 475.00..its the first fal that I didnt have to pay someone 150 bucks to get it running.go to their website..sometimes they have special internet sales.the gas adjustment actually works and they put a dsa piston in there.I HAD a g3 clone..it was junk.the receiver was poorly welded together and the parts were all worn out.I didnt even test fire it.
Feanaro
Member
No one can really tell you which is better(Apart from some the QC problems Century has) because it comes down to your body build and personal preference. I strongly favor the CETME/G3(A good G3 rebuild would be a better option than a CETME IMO but it costs more) because they fit me very well. A lot(read: a helluva lot) of people like the FAL though. Try before you buy is my advice.
I shopped CETME vs. FAL pretty extensively. Chose CETME because I liked the feel (wood) and balance better, and knew that FAL has more aftermarket and 'smith support, but CETME has a satisfactory amount.
Have not regretted my decision. My CETME shoots very well. CETME's have very low recoil for a .308, too.
Have not regretted my decision. My CETME shoots very well. CETME's have very low recoil for a .308, too.
G3's are "technically" better, because the parts are more readily available, both new and surplus. Many parts are interchangeable between the G3 and the CETME, but they are mostly the cosmetic parts: stocks and such. Certain working parts like recoil springs and trigger packs are also interchangeable, but the parts that really wear, like bolts and locking pieces are not.
All of the .308 CETME's have been built with used parts... some are very worn. New parts can be obtained, but only with some effort. At this moment, I wish I had saved up a bit more and bought a G3. But for what I spent, I'm very pleased with "El Chopo."
All of the .308 CETME's have been built with used parts... some are very worn. New parts can be obtained, but only with some effort. At this moment, I wish I had saved up a bit more and bought a G3. But for what I spent, I'm very pleased with "El Chopo."
I got one of those "crap" Century FAL's and with the money I saved ($300) by not buying a DSA FAL (I was careful and knew what to look for) I purchased a Russian made SKS. Buying a gun is like buying a car, you need to know what to look for. Great buys are available for those that know what to look for. I'll put my "crap" FAL against any out there and not walk away ashamed. This observation is based on 1st hand experience not my "buddy's".
stiletto raggio
Member
I would only get a Cetme or a no-name FAL if I wanted it for cheap fun. I have shot both, and they are pretty fun (the Cetme has basically no kick), but if you want something quality, either save for a quality DSA FAL or (like me) get and M1A.
armoredman
Member
http://www.ohiorapidfire.com/fal.htm
Had a CETME - POS. DSA great, but very expensive. Evan Marshall has ORF FAL, so do at least three other guys on his board - all love them. If I had the $550 I'd buy one too. ORF is temp out of stock, but more coming in.
BTW, I am so broke I am going to buy a yugo SKS, and call it my Poor Mans' HDR....
Had a CETME - POS. DSA great, but very expensive. Evan Marshall has ORF FAL, so do at least three other guys on his board - all love them. If I had the $550 I'd buy one too. ORF is temp out of stock, but more coming in.
BTW, I am so broke I am going to buy a yugo SKS, and call it my Poor Mans' HDR....
I, too, am in the hunt for a semi-auto .308, though I'm looking at pretty much every make & model.
I keep seeing posts that say that the CETMEs & G3s have light recoil. I had always been under the impression that they were among the harder kicking .308s. I have shot a G3 and didn't think that it kicked bad, but I have no experience any other semi-auto .308s.
I agree with a lot of the posts above about checking out Ohio Rapid Fire. I've checked out many of Todd's guns and have even had him do some work on a MAK-90. Everything I've ever seen from his shop has been excellent quality.
I keep seeing posts that say that the CETMEs & G3s have light recoil. I had always been under the impression that they were among the harder kicking .308s. I have shot a G3 and didn't think that it kicked bad, but I have no experience any other semi-auto .308s.
I agree with a lot of the posts above about checking out Ohio Rapid Fire. I've checked out many of Todd's guns and have even had him do some work on a MAK-90. Everything I've ever seen from his shop has been excellent quality.
varoadking
Member
*****I happen to prefer chocolate, but you might like butter pecan.*****
Personally, I'm a chocolate chip kinda guy.
I have an M1A and a Garand chambered in .308. I also have 2 FAL's with a third on the way. Looking forward to getting a DSA .223 FAL carbine as well...
Don't know anything about the CETME except the ones I've seen at the range throw the brass a mile - well, 35 feet at least.
If I coud have only one .308, it'd be an FAL carbine.
Thank goodness I don't have to choose...
Personally, I'm a chocolate chip kinda guy.
I have an M1A and a Garand chambered in .308. I also have 2 FAL's with a third on the way. Looking forward to getting a DSA .223 FAL carbine as well...
Don't know anything about the CETME except the ones I've seen at the range throw the brass a mile - well, 35 feet at least.
If I coud have only one .308, it'd be an FAL carbine.
Thank goodness I don't have to choose...
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