6.8 SPC 6.5 Grendal

[Newtosavage]

I didn’t know the OP’s sole purpose for this new caliber was 1,000 yard shooting? Cause that’s what the last page has been about. Here I thought it was judging the whole merits of the two cartridges. But 1,000 yard shooting is all the rage these days.

It’s a foregone conclusion that the 6.5 Grendel will stay transonic longer than the 6.8, I don’t think anyone disputes that.

And I have little doubt that @Varminterror knows what he’s talking about, I’ve listened to his posts in the past and he’s a wealth of knowledge.

I often wonder how many people who post about shooting 1000 yards even have access to a 1000 yard range. LOL

 

[brutus51]

What about magazines? Do standard 5.56 mags work or is it advisable to get 6.8 mags?

 

[mavracer]

I often wonder how many people who post about shooting 1000 yards even have access to a 1000 yard range. LOL

Conway Lead Distributors is about 25 min from my house, it goes to 960. Spearpoint ranch is a couple hours away.
And I guess I should add ROFLMAO ???

What about magazines? Do standard 5.56 mags work or is it advisable to get 6.8 mags?

Yes if you want to shoot 6.8, Valkyrie or 22/24 Nosler you need 6.8 mags if you want it to run right.

 

[CoalTrain49]

Conway Lead Distributors is about 25 min from my house, it goes to 960. Spearpoint ranch is a couple hours away.
And I guess I should add ROFLMAO ???

Ever get out of Kansas?

 

[brutus51]

What's different about the 6.8 mags as they have to fit in the stock AR15 magazine well? Is it just a different follower?

 

[jmorris]

North of Wichita spearpoint ranch (Barnard, KS) goes out to at least 1400.

Ft Riley (Madison, KS), I have heard Range 4 has steel out to 1100 and Range 9 even further than that.

 

[<*(((><]

What's different about the 6.8 mags as they have to fit in the stock AR15 magazine well? Is it just a different follower?

Currently the only mag to avoid with a standard AR15 lower (because it takes a special lower) is the Magpul Six8 Pmag, all others currently will fit standard lowers. I like CProducts and ASC for affordability, there are some premium magazines like Barrett and Precision Reflex Inc. (or PRI as commonly known).

 

[mavracer]

Ever get out of Kansas?

What and try to read a light breeze that's blowing just one direction, I wouldn't know how to act.
No, I'm lucky to have a weekend open to shoot a local match, but it's great to have such a nice facility practically in my back yard.

 

[Varminterror]

What about magazines? Do standard 5.56 mags work or is it advisable to get 6.8 mags?

Get 6.8 mags.

6.8 mags have different depth of stiffening ribs, at different positions than 5.56 mags.

 

[brutus51]

Interesting article
https://www.gunworld.com/ammo/bullet-battle-6-5-grendel-vs-6-8-remington-spc

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Good article, brutus51. Thanks for sharing!

 

[mavracer]

Have you seen the 24 Nosler, a 103 ELDX at 2600fps would be a pretty sweet deer gun. Wouldn't necessarily be better than 6.5 or 6.8.

 

[Chuck R.]

North of Wichita spearpoint ranch (Barnard, KS) goes out to at least 1400.

Ft Riley (Madison, KS), I have heard Range 4 has steel out to 1100 and Range 9 even further than that.

Spearpoint has one range 300-1400 with tgts every 100 and a 100 yard zero tgt and a 1 mile target. They also have an ELR that goes to 2200.

Don't know about Ft. Riley, have shot there since I PCS'd. I'm not a huge fan of the post weapon registration deal. I work on Ft. Leavenworth and it's a PITA to keep up with what I've registered as it is.

 

[Varminterror]

Twin Peaks Rifle Club, Medicine Lodge, KS
Spearpoint Range, Barnard, KS
Ringneck Ranch, Tipton, KS
Cedarvale Quarry, Cedarvale, KS
Conway Lead Distributors, Conway Springs, KS
Mill Creek Range, Desoto, KS
Drussel Precision Rifle Range, Garden City, KS

Here’s a shot during lunch at one of the matches last season at Conway Lead, with his flag flying in the background:



And one of the stages at Ringneck Ranch back in September:



A shot of a TYL stage at Twin Peaks Rifle Club:





While it isn’t Kansas, I rarely get photos taken, and here’s a set from the Jurassic Classic this fall at Lone Star Armory outside of Kopperl, TX, reaching out past 1100yrds in the rain on the first day, while Day 2 was much nicer weather:





And of course - lots of wide open spaces in Kansas on private property...

 

[Varminterror]

Have you seen the 24 Nosler, a 103 ELDX at 2600fps would be a pretty sweet deer gun. Wouldn't necessarily be better than 6.5 or 6.8.

The 6mm’s are really intriguing. I just got my hands on a 243 LBC barrel (6mm Grendel variant, straight neckdown). I really want to get a 6mm’s FatRat, but I didn’t want to be beholden to a single source for barrels and dies - and it’s none-too-disappointing to forego fireforming. I built a 6-6.8 for another shooter last year as well, big down side was cartridge length. But between the 6-6.8, 243LBC, 24 Nosler, 6mm AR, 6 Turbo40, 6Rat, 6FatRat, there are a lot of pretty cool options for (relatively) big case 6mm AR’s for long range shooting.

The data I have for the 243LBC is looking like 103/105/108 class bullets should top 2700 out of a 24” tube with ease, and 2800 should be very possible. I’ll most likely run 103 ELD’s, saving my stash of 105 Hybrids for creed and Dasher loads, but I have a few hundred 108’s I could try as well - I think they’re going to be too long for the mags, however.

 

[SharpDog]

I went 6.5G based on slightly better ballistics and the availability of incredibly cheap Wolf ammo. Note that the Wolf ammo is very corrosive on bores so you will need to rebarrel.

 

[SharpDog]

I want to thank all you folks for your input, this has been a very interesting topic. I've been scouring a bunch of forums trying to get educated on AR's in general. Since I just bought this new one I think I've become a little carried away with it. After researching reloading manuals, and reading all the opinions of different folks the one thing that really struck a chord with me was this fellow who posted an inquiry about sub-zero cold weather performance and lubricants required to keep an AR running. This really turned on a light bulb as just about all my 50 years of hunting has been in Michigan's U.P. I've hunted in 20 below weather with bolt action or lever rifles and never had a problem.
On one occasion I remember sitting in a Duck blind with temperatures in the low single digits. One fellow in our group had a really high end
semi-auto shotgun, think it was a Benelli, When the ducks came in his shotgun cycled so slowly it was pretty much a single shot. Really appreciated my old Remington pump that day.
Anyway considering a 6.8 SPC upper would cost 1K I could get a bolt gun in 6.5 Creedmoor for about the same money and be able to get better performance in addition to feeding my reloading addiction. Part of the deal is that in my old age my 30/06 is starting to hammer my shoulder.
Sigh getting old sucks.

Yeah, it wasn't a Benelli, have a bunch. I can easily empty a mag such that is sounds like a single shot.

 

[brutus51]

I'm pretty sure it was a Benelli but I didn't know the fellow very well, could be the lube he was using. Point was this kind of thing never happens with a SxS, Over & under, or pump shotgun. At least not in my experience.

 

[labnoti]

Interesting article
https://www.gunworld.com/ammo/bullet-battle-6-5-grendel-vs-6-8-remington-spc

Good article. Before I read that, I was all-Grendel all the way. But one of the things I hadn't considered is how performance changes with short barrels. I use the Grendel in a 24" barrel, where it really outshines the 6.8 SPC in every way at all ranges. The article points out that the 6.8 SPC doesn't gain nearly as much when using a longer barrel. And more people than not will be shooting either of these in a short carbine-length barrel on an MSR. Shorten the barrel to 16.5" and I think the Grendel's advantages at shorter ranges (maybe under 300 yards) become meaningless. Indeed, it may be an inferior cartridge with the short barrel at the short range, at least on paper.

But "horses for courses." If I was looking for a short-range gun, I would be comparing 6.8 SPC to .300 Blackout or even better .450 Bushmaster.

 

[mavracer]

The 6mm’s are really intriguing. I just got my hands on a 243 LBC barrel (6mm Grendel variant, straight neckdown). I really want to get a 6mm’s FatRat, but I didn’t want to be beholden to a single source for barrels and dies - and it’s none-too-disappointing to forego fireforming. I built a 6-6.8 for another shooter last year as well, big down side was cartridge length. But between the 6-6.8, 243LBC, 24 Nosler, 6mm AR, 6 Turbo40, 6Rat, 6FatRat, there are a lot of pretty cool options for (relatively) big case 6mm AR’s for long range shooting.

The data I have for the 243LBC is looking like 103/105/108 class bullets should top 2700 out of a 24” tube with ease, and 2800 should be very possible. I’ll most likely run 103 ELD’s, saving my stash of 105 Hybrids for creed and Dasher loads, but I have a few hundred 108’s I could try as well - I think they’re going to be too long for the mags, however.

Always been a fan every since I shot my first deer with a Interarms Mk X 243 some 37 years ago (holy crap). I looked at 6mm hard for my last AR15 project but I fell for the Valkyrie.

 

[Varminterror]

Always been a fan every since I shot my first deer with a Interarms Mk X 243 some 37 years ago (holy crap). I looked at 6mm hard for my last AR15 project but I fell for the Valkyrie.

I had a DPMS LR-243win, then bought a dtech 243wssm, but just didn’t love either combination of rifle and round. I’m putting together a 6 creed LFAR and this 243LBC - really finding a happy place in 105 ish bullets at 2800-3000 for the things I do.

 

[mavracer]

I had a DPMS LR-243win, then bought a dtech 243wssm, but just didn’t love either combination of rifle and round. I’m putting together a 6 creed LFAR and this 243LBC - really finding a happy place in 105 ish bullets at 2800-3000 for the things I do.

I built my 1 in 7 twist 243 AR thinking I'd use 115 dtacs turns out it likes good old 107 SMKs well enough I haven't even tried anything else.

 

[brutus51]

For me the article only complicated matters. Now I'm thinking that for the price of a 6.8 upper I could buy a 6.5 Creed bolt gun with some old world wood stocks. That way I can put my 4.5 X 14 variable on it which is kind of overkill on the 6.8.

 

[Varminterror]

For me the article only complicated matters. Now I'm thinking that for the price of a 6.8 upper I could buy a 6.5 Creed bolt gun with some old world wood stocks. That way I can put my 4.5 X 14 variable on it which is kind of overkill on the 6.8.

I’m a firm believer the optic is for the shooter, meant for the application, not for the rifle... A 4.5-14x or 4-16x is my bread and butter hunting scope, sort of my bare minimum optic for any rifle I mean to take into the field. Even my 10.5” 6.8 SPC SBR-15 has a Sig Tango4 4-16x on top, as it’s built to be a suppressed deer and coyote hunting rifle for 0-400yrds. I have a 4.5-14x on a 45-70, as I find 2-7x and 3-9x insufficient for how small I want to be able to aim (aka pick my point of aim) at 250-300yrds if and when the shot presents itself.

It IS fair to say you can expect to spend a bit on a quality upper - I think $1,000 for an upper is pretty steep, but it’s pretty easy to spend that if you have refined tastes. I’m sure there’s a $500 6.8spc upper out there somewhere, but I’m also sure I don’t want to own it for what I expect from my rifles.

It’s your money, so do with it what you will, but comparing the price of a 6.8 SPC upper to a 6.5 creed stick shift is kinda like comparing the price of a minivan to a pickup truck.

 

[mpd61]

Hell,
There are plenty of 6.5 Grendel bolt guns being made for you now with nice long barrels (or medium) and wood stocks.
CZ 527's and Howa and Ruger come to mind. You don't need to jump on that Creedmoor wagon.....