a VEXING 1911 problem/malfunction...suggestions?

[richyoung]

The pistol is a Dan Wesson Pointman Major 1911 in .45 ACP, serial number in the low 1000's, purchased used for $540 plus tax. Before its first trip to the range, it absolutely refused to feed hollowpoints, (or anything else for that matter), from the factory magazine, or any other one I had on hand. First trip to the pistol smith, and $120 later, I have a throated barrel, polished feed ramp, new sear, trigger job, re-tensioned extractor, and the edges smoothed on the slide and barrel locking lugs, along with a strong recommendation to use ONLY Chip McCormick Power Mags in the arm. $100 to Midway, and I'm ready for my first trip to the range. Numerous malfuntions, including once with the firing pin stop dropping down & locking up the pistol. Most common problem was rounds going straight into the feed ramp, stopping dead level and blocking the slide partially open, but mixed in with some failure to extracts and some real wildly variable ejection. Empy cases showed evidence of firing pin drag, and there were a couple of rounds that went "click" instead of "bang". Plus it didn't shoot groups - it shot PATTERNS! Upon disassembly, also disovered that the barrel bushing was very loose in the slide - only the tension of the recoil system had created the illusion of tight lockup. Also, the extractor had been rotating in its tunnel, to the point that it had left marks on the back of the slide stop. Back to the smith... :banghead: $170 later, I have a new Ed Brown stainless steel barrel bushing so tight, you can barely turn it with the nylon wrench, a new Ed Brown "Hard Core" bar stock tool steel extractor, a fitted EGW (Or Briley, I can't remember...) firing pin stop so tight you have to drive it out of the slot with a brass drift), polished firing pin, a heavier main spring, "tweaked" magazine springs, and a pronouncement that "there's nothing left to fix" on it. He blames the feedramp hangups on a slightly oversize magazine well, and a slightly low mag catch. He also says that my method of charging the gun is wrong - I pull the slide back with the original (rear) serrations all the way, and then let go. He says I should recharge the pistol by tripping the slide latch, or that I should put my hand over the top of the front of the slide, (grasping the front serrations), and "pop" the slide back and forth very rapidly. My questions for you experts out there are:

1. I am very uncomfortable with the idea of putting my fingers that close to the muzzle of a pistol I am attempting to charge with live rounds - should I just "get over it"? I've never had a 1911 before that you couldn't load by just pulling back on the slide and letting go - since this is intended to be a carry gun, I am quite concerned.

2. Any deas on how to fix this, short of frame replacement? Who makes Dan Wesson's stainless steel frames?

3. Has anyone had any experience with Dan Wesson customer service? Is there even a CHANCE that they might cut me a break on a replacement frame, seeeing as how it's a manufacturing defect, even though I'm not the original purchaser?

Needless to say, I'm not real happy - I thought DW was a quality manufacturer....

 

[Bobby Lee]

Dan Wesson builds a good 1911 most of the time. Your experience is not normal with Dan Wesson.

They have very good customer service and I am sure they will do anything it takes to make it right.

 

[richyoung]

Thanks - I will try to call customer service for them - will pass on what they tell me...

 

[richyoung]

The gunsmith at Dan Wesson says he can proably take a Dremel and alter the feedramp area to eliminate the problem - will cost me $35 + $25 return shipping + shipping there - I will probably send the pistol to them next week. He talked as if he had run into this particular problem before, and he sounded pretty confident he could fix it.

 

[TexasRifleman]

I would recommend you find another local guy to do your work also. Sounds like he's just selling you parts.

 

[crucible]

My Dan Wesson Dave Pruitt came new with some of the same problems; mine included an extractor with zero tension to boot. If you ask, Dan Wesson will tell you that their 1911's were not made to do HP's at all(!), but that they were fixing them anyway (I hope they've changed that policy since mine was made).

I also had to send mine back to them after my first range trip because of those issues, and not only did they fix that issue, but also changed out my barrell link and slide stopas they were causing issues I wasn't even aware of yet.

The pistol was returned quickly, along with a good explanation of what was done, and how it was test fired using several HP ammo combinations to ensure it was fixed.

Despite those issues (frustrating as they were) , the good experience with their service made up for it; my DWDP still represents a remakable bargain, and I trust it enough to use it as my CCW weapon (almost 1K rounds later).

Chris

 

[Sean Smith]

The "pistol smith" who worked on your gun was a moron and/or dirtbag who ripped you off. You should have just contacted Dan Wesson's service department when you first realized it didn't work; if you had, they most likely would have eaten the cost to make it work... and they would have actually fixed the problem. Now that you had some slack-jawed gun plumber cut it up, you get to eat the cost. I've done the same thing myself, and it is a colossal waste of time and money.

When in doubt, always assume the local yokel in the strip mall is too stupid to touch your weapons unless you get VERY convincing evidence to the contrary.

He also says that my method of charging the gun is wrong - I pull the slide back with the original (rear) serrations all the way, and then let go. He says I should recharge the pistol by tripping the slide latch, or that I should put my hand over the top of the front of the slide, (grasping the front serrations), and "pop" the slide back and forth very rapidly.

The guy is a shaved ape. His method is bat dookie insane. Either sling-shot it (your method), or just drop the slide release to chamber a round. Don't let the slide slam forward if you aren't chambering a round, however.

 

[raz-0]

should have called dan wesson first. His advice on charging the gun is stupid. your hand blocks the ejection port that way, and it is possible if you have an extended ejector to strike the primer and have the round go off outside the chamber if things go wrong. Usually seen more with things like .38 super. When using the front serrations to cycle the action, the safer way to do it is to reach from under the gun rather than over. But that is hard to do without a lightened recoil and main spring in the gun.

 

[BluesBear]

You haven't been going to a gunsmith.
You have been going to a charlatan.
And you have been ripped off.

 

[richyoung]

To be fair to the gunsmith, he did try to talk me out of the firing pin stop, but after seeing the marks the old extractor had made "clocking" on it, and after the one action tie-up, I went ahead with the fitted firing pin stop. replacing the barrel bushing was my idea, and was needed...with the recoil assembly in, it seemed tight, but it actually had about 5 thousands of play in it - I'm sure that under recoil, the whole thing was wobbling around and not resetting to the same position, contributing to the accuracy problem. I also had some "extras" done, like having the new extractor made flush with the back of the slide, and re-blued. He does good work - the last "Frankenstien" parts gun he helped me build (colt slide, caspian frame, colt NM barrel & bushing, Colt Micro sights) would feed anything, including empty cases, from any kind of cheap gun-show special magazine, and shoot 1.5 inch groups at 25 yards from sandbags, with pawn-shop reload wadcutters. Alas, it was stolen, and the DW is it's replacement - I'm just in a lot deeper that I thought I would be - BUT - 'twil be nice when its done. Chris, thanks for the info - I was feeling really down until I read that. If you don't mind, how much was shipping, and how long a turn-around was it?

 

[crucible]

First, use FedEx-the brown turd won't accept your weapon and/or it may get stolen after the employee has a hissy fit about you even being there with one. I think I paid $25-$30 for overnight, insured shipping for Fedex from here in Virginia to DW in New York (why all these good gunmakers still insist on locating in states that are patently unfriendly to thier very existance I don't understand). That was the first time I ever shipped a weapon that I was planning on keeping; the peace of mind for insured and trackable overnight was well worth it (and the FedEx employee didn't skip a beat either).

I had my weapon back less than two weeks later-a good turn around (they paid for shipping back....my repairs were made under warranty though), and the in-house gunsmith is knowledgeable and honest.

If you cant get past this, I think you'll come to really like your DW. Also, I recommend you check out the Dan Wesson section of the 1911 forum-very knowledgeable folks there, and DW's president still posts actively (won't find that from many manufacturers). http://forums.1911forum.com/

Chris

 

[Archangel]

The firing pin stop dropping out and firing pin drag marks on primers are both signs of a weak firing pin spring. You didn't mention whether or not that had been replaced, but if not, you should go ahead and do so.

Also, if you have a shock buff in the gun, I'd take it out until you get the malfunctions cleared up. I was having similar problem with rounds stalling on the feed ramp. They went away when I took out the shock buff.

 

[Seraph]

...the edges smoothed on the slide and barrel locking lugs...

I hope that means he deburred the locking lugs, and not that he rounded them off. He might be right about the mag catch, though. It would probably contribute to some of the problems you describe. I've read that some aftermarket mag catches are made with a modified geometry to raise the position of the mag, so that the top round is more in line with the chamber. I think that's what your gunsmith is trying to convey. I'm not disposed to presume he's a charlatan, because I haven't met him, nor have I seen your pistol. However, I would go along with the others who have suggested you send your weapon back to Dan Wesson for therapy.

 

[richyoung]

About the firing pin spring, it was checked while we had the gun torn down - he said it was as good or better than any of the new ones he had - he did polish the existing firing pin - I think he was getting tired of selling me parts!
Chris, thanks for the info - I will make arrangements to ship it next week, (and I'll ask them to check the firing pin spring, too...)

 

[richyoung]

She is on the way to Keith at Dan Wesson - yowzers, the shipping and insurance was high! And what a goat-rope at the FedEx - only one person there & she didn't know what to do. They made me take the gun apart, (lucky I had tools) even tho their own 800 number told me it was unnecessary...

 

[richyoung]

The pistol arrived yesterday at 10:06 Am or so FedEx says -

 

[richyoung]

Update:

After two shooting sessions - was still having it hang up on hollowpoints occasionally - but less and less as time went by. While disassembled for cleaning after the 4th of July shutzenfest, I noticed the "polished" feed ramp wasn't as smooth as I would have liked - I also noticed a slight lip along the righ side of the top of the magwell opening. I broke out the needle files, and removed the lip, & smoothed the casting in the magwell back to even with the slide stop opening on both sides. I then used a round white ceramic "stone" originally used in a knife sharpener to polish the feedramp AND the sides of the magwell, again, bask to the slide stop opening. (I also filed slight bevels on the extractor hook opening) My theory is that this frame, with it's slightly over-size magwell, was allowing the shorter hollowpoints to twist just enough in the feedlips for the edge of the case mouth to drag on the casting texture and the lip on the right side. When re-assembled, the PointMan hand-cycled the problem rounds without a hitch - will have to wait until I can go shoot it for real, but I think I've finally solved a problem that has stumped two gunsmiths and the factory. I'm starting to like this piece....