Any Legal Eagles want to help me decipher a New York Statute on Issuing Pistol Permit

[golocx4]

Erie County NY Pistol Permit Office is taking between 12 to 18 months to issue a pistol permit.
The Statute is below my questions.

The way I read this is a pistol permit must be processed within six months.
Yes or NO
If it can't be issued in six months the applicant must be notified in writing.
Yes or No.
What does this mean?
In acting upon an application, the licensing officer shall either deny the application for reasons specifically and concisely stated in writing or grant the application and issue the license applied for.

Does it mean that if the applicant is not notified within six months, the license must be issued.

Here is the actual statute.

Section 400.00 of the NYS Penal Code, Paragraph 4-a

4-a. Processing of license applications. Applications for licenses
shall be accepted for processing by the licensing officer at the time of
presentment. Except upon written notice to the applicant specifically
stating the reasons for any delay, in each case the licensing officer
shall act upon any application for a license pursuant to this section
within six months of the date of presentment of such an application to
the appropriate authority. Such delay may only be for good cause and
with respect to the applicant. In acting upon an application, the
licensing officer shall either deny the application for reasons
specifically and concisely stated in writing or grant the application
and issue the license applied for.

Here are some other summaries of the wording.

, section 400.00(4). Except upon written notice to the applicant, applications must be processed within six months. Section 400.00(4-a).

Waiting Periods

Although there is no specific waiting period in New York, all handgun purchasers must obtain a license to possess or carry a handgun, and such licenses may take up to six months to process (or longer, upon written notice to the applicant). N.Y. Penal Law § 400.00(4-a).

 

[Prince Yamato]

You tell them that it's been six months, you were not provided with a letter, and they are in violation of state law.

 

[mgkdrgn]

You tell them that it's been six months, you were not provided with a letter, and they are in violation of state law.

... and they will care exactly _ much

 

[golocx4]

more....
This is a quote from their website at
http://www.erie.gov/depts/government/clerk/applications_permits_pistol.phtml
Step 3 Please read and follow the instructions on the application carefully to avoid any unnecessary delays in the process. Applicants must come to our office in person when submitting the completed application. The processing time to receive a permit is approximately 6-8 months.

Again, not to beat a dead horse but the Statute says:
Except upon written notice to the applicant specifically stating the reasons for any delay, in each case the licensing officer shall act upon any application for a license pursuant to this section within six months of the date of presentment of such an application to the appropriate authority.
Such delay may only be for good cause and with respect to the applicant. In acting upon an application, the licensing officer shall either deny the application for reasons specifically and concisely stated in writing or grant the application and issue the license applied for.

By their own admission on the web site they are in violation of the statute.

Not being a lawyer I don't see any wiggle room here. That is not to say that there isn't any.
I mean what does this mean to you?
Except upon written notice to the applicant specifically stating the reasons for any delay, in each case the licensing officer shall act upon any application for a license pursuant to this section within six months of the date of presentment of such an application to the appropriate authority.

and then there is this next sentence;
Such delay may only be for good cause and with respect to the applicant.
I mean this is saying that only when there is reason involving the actual applicant can a delay be legal.

And finally the last sentence;
In acting upon an application, the licensing officer shall either deny the application for reasons specifically and concisely stated in writing or grant the application and issue the license applied for.

To me this is saying that they must have cause and then state that cause to deny a permit. They cannot change the type of permit. If you applied for a permit to carry they can not change it to 'hunting and sporting" which is exactly what they are doing.

You know, the right to bear arms in not in the New York Constitution but rather in the Civil Rights Statutes, so I guess that leaves the FBI out as investigating a civil rights violation.
So the State Police will have to investigate a process they are directly involved with..............probably a lost cause.

All of you in other states had better not fall asleep like we did in New York.

 

[golocx4]

Ok so I went to the Attorney General of New York's web site. I mean if you find a civil right being violated you would assume they would be the ones to investigate right?
This is what is on the complaint form for civil rights -
The Civil Rights Bureau enforces laws protecting New Yorkers from
discrimination on the basis of race, creed, color, national origin, sex, religion, age, marital status, sexual orientation, predisposing genetic characteristics, military status or disability. The Bureau does not investigate or litigate cases on behalf of individuals, or against state agencies. The Bureau primarily seeks to change patterns, practices and policies of discrimination that affect groups of people.

So State Agencies are immune from prosecution. Wonderful!

 

[Frank Ettin]

Ok so I went to the Attorney General of New York's web site....The Bureau does not investigate or litigate cases on behalf of individuals, or against state agencies. ....So State Agencies are immune from prosecution. Wonderful!

An Attorney General is never your lawyer. He is the State's lawyer and represents the State.

If you have a legal beef with a governmental agency (or anyone else for that matter) and you want to pursue it beyond just filing an administrative complaint, you will need to hire a lawyer to act on your behalf (or file a lawsuit, in pro per, on your own behalf, but given the technicalities that might be involved you need to be prepared to do a bunch of learning).

 

[Prince Yamato]

... and they will care exactly _ much

Well, if you back it up with, "I'll make sure to get a lawyer on this", they'll care. They're violating state law. Period. I'd go to the office in person with a print-out of state law and tell them. If they blow you off, casually mention that there's a lot of people who would be interested in this violation of civil rights. Then, state that you will be very public about your disapproval and that you will name (publicly) who is responsible for this egregious violation of your rights. I bet you get your permit issued to you a whole lot quicker.

 

[Frank Ettin]

Well, if you back it up with, "I'll make sure to get a lawyer on this", they'll care. They're violating state law. Period. I'd go to the office in person with a print-out of state law and tell them. If they blow you off, casually mention that there's a lot of people who would be interested in this violation of civil rights. Then, state that you will be very public about your disapproval and that you will name (publicly) who is responsible for this egregious violation of your rights. I bet you get your permit issued to you a whole lot quicker.

They probably hear stuff like that all the time. What gets their attention is a well put together letter from a lawyer that convinces them that you intend to follow through. Chatter is chatter, and a lot of government agencies in a lot of state are used to it.

 

[NMPOPS]

You have to understand New York state. I am temporaily living upstate NY and last fall went through the process in Chenango County (it took 3 months), each county is different but acting under the same law, some counties are more gun friendly than others but the state just doen't care how long it takes. Look at our senators, THEY JUST DON'T CARE, New Yorkers have bent over and taken it for long they don't no how to stop. I'll be back in NM by October!

 

[Prince Yamato]

I'm a New Yorker by birth. I might be moving back that way in a couple years. If the situation is similar, you can bet your pre-ban magazine that I'm not going to put up with garbage like that.

 

[mgkdrgn]

Well, if you back it up with, "I'll make sure to get a lawyer on this",

And they will still care exactly _ much.

You may not "put up with that garbage" after you move back ... but the ONLY way you will escape it will be to move back OUT again. (former resident of NYS)

 

[wishin]

This is an entirely different situation, in a different state, but let me tell you how I dealt with a bureaucratic hurdle a few years back. I'll eliminate the unimportant background details.

After learning that one of my stolen handguns was being held by a local police department, I went there and identified it. I was then told it would be returned once the investigation was completed. The police kept putting me off everytime I called.

After several months of this, I contacted the mayor's office and voiced a complaint. Within the week, I was called by the police and told my revolver could be picked up. (I never talked to the mayor).

Give it a shot from that angle. Be firm, but polite and state the facts. It can't hurt.

 

[Prince Yamato]

And they will still care exactly _ much.

No, they don't care about my civil rights, but they do care about public embarrassment, public lawsuits, and bad publicity in general. Which is why throwing their violation of a legal statute in their face and threatening to act on it will usually get things done real quickly. The "civil rights violation bit" is basically the cherry atop the cake.

 

[toivo]

The statute leaves the state a lot of wiggle room. Basically, it only requires them to notify you in writing of reasons for the delay, and it specifies that the delay must have to do with you personally, not just that "we're busy and that's how long it takes." Pressing it vigorously may only result in the issuance of the required letter. My bet is that it would say something along the lines of "further investigation is necessary to determine xyz..."