AR or 9mm?

[Bullz]

Hi All...

Looking to buy two new gun and I'm fishing for some insights...

Option 1) AR platform, preferably in 300 AAC Blackout. Primary purpose is home defense, possibly hunting/survival, and SHTF scenario. It would see range time but not much more than would be necessary to become perfectly proficient... in other words, I wont be shooting this gun for fun. I have limited interest or practical application for centerfire rifles.... but I do want to add a high capacity, medium power, semi-auto rifle to my armory. Ammo cost is not an issue.

Option 2) Small pistol, preferably in 9mm. Primary purpose is for deep CCW use. 9mm is necessary to maintain common ammunition. Looking for something in DA/SA but would like it to be similar in size to a Kahr K9 (I prefer hammer guns but striker is tolerable).

Any suggestions/opinions on specific models that would meet the above? Any opinions on which I should buy first? I don't *need* either so I'm kind of hanging on what to do. Which ever I get in the near future, the second will be acquired around this time next year. Thoughts?

 

[mortablunt]

I don't really like either option that much. I've never really been an AR fan, but I'm not a pistol fan either. If forced to pick one, I'd say AR, because a longarm handing and power advantages.

 

[wally]

Seems to be you are commited to two guns, a rifle and a CCW pistol.

I'd get the CCW pistol first, since I don't hunt, rifles are pretty much just range toys unless TEOTWAWKI happens.

I'd rate the odds of actuing needing a CCW pistol as way higher than needing a SHTF rifle in the next year, although the odds on either are low -- like the odds of me needing the fire extinguisher we keep in the kitchen by the stove. Comfort in having it.

 

[firesky101]

Dang it wally now I have that song in my head... "It's the end of the world as we know it..."

 

[rcmodel]

I'd say a .223 AR-15.
And a .22 rimfire pistol or revolver.

Because you might be able to buy affordable ammo somewhere locally, like Wallyworld.
In order to shoot/practice with them enough to become semi-proficient with them.

Or stockpile ammo for your imaginary SHIF EOTWAWKI scenario.

A 300 AAC Blackout sounds good in video games.
But not so much when you have to reload and find every $1 a pop case the gun throws in the weeds.
Or special order ammo months ahead of when the SHTF.

rc

 

[Zane]

300 AAC Blackout is lots of fun to shoot, especially subsonic. Right now, you need to be able to load for it as ammo availability for the common bullet weights is hit or miss. Frankly, "perfectly proficiency" requires frequent perfect practice.

As for the handgun, if you want to stay in the Kahr size, I think Kel-tec is their main competitor although Ruger has a nice offering in 9mm in that size. None of those are SA/DA. Sig and HK offer SA/DA compact 9mm pistol, but I don't believe they are as small as the 1st 3. The Springfield EMP is small and hammer fired, but is SA only.

 

[Zane]

But not so much when you have to reload and find every $1 a pop case the gun throws in the weeds.

Under 25 cents per for new, annealed, primed brass. I'm also collecting all the .223 stuff I find for when I start to reform the brass.

 

[wlewisiii]

Glock 26.

 

[HD Fboy]

For Home Defense - 12ga auto load shotgun. (Rem 1100 is a good choice) You can load it with slugs and deer hunt and with shot shells hunt dove. It is the best HD weapon out there.
For an AR-15, stick with 223. Ammo is very available. 300BLK while very cool, ammo is difficult.
Unless you are trained and skilled with semi auto pistol get a 357 Mag revolver. Point, pull trigger.

 

[rcmodel]

Under 25 cents per for new, annealed, primed brass

Whatever.

The OP didn't sound like he is quite ready to take up reloading & reforming cases yet.

He probably should learn to shoot handguns and rifles real well before he does that.
Using affordable ammo he can buy locally.

rc

 

[Redlg155]

you worry about keeping commonality with the 9mm but choose a specialty caliber for the rifle?

Specialty calibers are great for a "special" purpose, but your goose is cooked once you exhaust your supply of ammo. No quick stop at Wallyworld for a resupply.

It could be somewhat acceptable to have a dedicated long range bolt rifle in a specialty caliber since efficiency is measured by the old on shot
...one "hit" rule as less ammo is required to complete a mission.

In addition, unless you are flush with cash, ammo cost is always an issue.

 

[Bullz]

The advantage of 300 BLK is efficacy with sound suppression. 5.56 is useless with a supressor. The 300 BLK (loaded like a 300 whisper) under suppression offers similar performance to a standard .45 ACP with minimal report. The Walmart ammunition savings simply do not make up for that operational advantage. If you ever get a chance to use one, you'll understand.

Please no more pitching the .223/5.56... there is no economy to that round as far as I'm concerned. Like I said, ammunition cost is not an issue.

 

[Centaur 1]

Ever think about getting a 9mm AR-15? If we truely get into a shtf scenario you'll need the gun for self defense, no reason for a long range gun. The 9mm cartridge is a very effective caliber and ammo is relatively cheap. When you eventually buy a handgun it will use the same ammo, eliminating the need to stock up on two calibers.

 

[Bullz]

centaur - I have actually been thinking about an AR in 9mm... I have a substantial investment in my full sized operational pistols. Most are 9mm and a couple are .45 ACP.

Have you used one? I imagine the ballistic performance would get pretty sad past 100 yards. The 300 BLK at supersonic levels will reach out to 400 yards.

I'd like to hear your input if you've been using one.

 

[Redlg155]

If you ever get a chance to use one, you'll understand

Uncle Sam used to buy my rifle and ammo. Now I have to buy my own, so I don't understand anymore.

I forgot to add, If you went supersonic you just negated some of the advantages of the supressor.

 

[HD Fboy]

You need to look at the bullet drop on the 300BLK at 400 yards. I don't remember the specifics but I want to say it exceeds 30 inches or so. RSilvers of AAC will tell you the 300BLk is good inside 300 yards. For me, the number is more like 200 yards due to ballistics.

300BLK is a very nice round. I plan to own an AR that shoots 300BLK. It is comparable to a 30-30. Great inside 100 yards. Really great as a subsonic round out of a suppressed SBR. That is the 300BLK niche.

A 9MM AR is a nifty platform inside 75 yards or so. 9MM out of a 16 inch barrel is scooting. 9MM has been the choice for subguns for a very long time. I would say a 9mm AR is a better choice for you than the 300BLK.

There are good reasons NATO has gone to the 556 ammo. One is the round is flat shooting. It is an effective out to around 400-450 yards. Personally anything beyond 300 yards I will be engaging with a 308, but that's me.

 

[Bullz]

HD Fboy - I agree with you. My 308 will run anything past 200 yards. I only wanted the 300 BLK for 50 to 200 yards. I'm not sure a 9mm will reach out that far.

 

[snakeman]

get whichever one you will actually use. I don't buy guns I won't use and that has saved me a lot of money

 

[rjrivero]

HD Fboy - I agree with you. My 308 will run anything past 200 yards. I only wanted the 300 BLK for 50 to 200 yards. I'm not sure a 9mm will reach out that far.

I run a 9mm AR from time to time. Using subsonic 147gr bullets, it rings 6" poppers out at 100 yards without any difficulty. How much oomph you have at that range is open for debate. But the bullets are on target at least to 100 yards.

For a home defense gun, 9mm carbine is a descent choice. With the heavy 147gr bullets, it suppresses better than just about anything other than .22LR.

Consider most LEO's engagement rules are out to 70 yards or so with a .223 carbine. I'm not saying you won't ever have a need for Personal protection out to 200 yards, I'm just saying it isn't likely.

If you have a 308 already, consider using it for anything past 100 yards, and use a 9mm Carbine for zero to 100.

Here's a picture of my 9mm AR in SBR trim. Fine rifle.

 

[Centaur 1]

centaur - I have actually been thinking about an AR in 9mm... I have a substantial investment in my full sized operational pistols. Most are 9mm and a couple are .45 ACP.

Have you used one? I imagine the ballistic performance would get pretty sad past 100 yards. The 300 BLK at supersonic levels will reach out to 400 yards.

I'd like to hear your input if you've been using one.

I built one from parts with my son. He was wanting to buy a Beretta cx storm 9mm carbine. A close friend of mine who runs the local indoor range, talked him out of the carbine and into the AR. The rifle is so reliable that it makes the AR a great choice. It doesn't shoot like a rifle caliber. My son has a target that he shot the center out of with a 32 round magazine at 25 yards, the hole was the size of a quarter. Fifty yard groups are the size of a softball, and at 100 yards it will hit a man, but won't win any tounaments. It's more than good enough to protect your home, there won't be a need for a 400 yard gun to stop looters.

 

[rcmodel]

5.56 is useless with a supressor.

Try and tell that to S.E.A.L. Team 6!
Or Osama. Now wait, you can't tell him.

rc

 

[Bullz]

rjrivero - I love the gun. Is that a custom build? Do you have recommendations for uppers/lowers? Also, it looks like you're feeding it with glock mags? Am I seeing that correctly?

Centaur - thanks for the input. I'm liking the 9mm in the AR platform. It sounds like a good alternative for what I want it to do. I imagine there's virtually no recoil on these guns, correct?

 

[gripper]

If you forget the .300BLK option(too expensive and special order)you could get a ised to mew 9mm compact/service size AND an intermediate rifle in a caliber you don't have to cross your fingers and hope you have enough of(5.45,5.56,7.62x39)....and get enough ammo to practice AND cache.

 

[-eaux-]

I promise I'm not trying to hijack... but...
Carbine length rifle+affordability+reliability+.30WCF ballistics+ease of obtaining ammo=Avtomat Kilashnikova (or a good ol' Marlin 336)
Just sayin'

 

[Lex Luthier]

They go as a pair. You will need both.