Best books on war?

[Ganjiro]

Samurai - by Sakai, Saburo

Hagekure - by Lord Yamamoto Tsunetomo

Book of 5 Rings - By Miyamoto Musashi

The Art of War - by Sun Tzu

Marine Sniper 93 Confirmed Kills - Charles Henderson

 

[Gator]

Some excellent suggestions here!

I had a real problem with Culbertson's "13 Cent Killers", anyone who would denigrate other snipers, especially Carlos Hathcock, the way he does.....

A word of caution about the Military Book Club: It is good for getting books you just want to read. Many of their editions are specially printed for them and are of very poor quality, if you want books you can enjoy reading AND be proud to have on your shelf you may want to look elsewhere.

 

[Detritus]

I had a real problem with Culbertson's "13 Cent Killers", anyone who would denigrate other snipers, especially Carlos Hathcock, the way he does.....

So did I. I have not yet finished 13cent killers (it's been on teh shelf adn partially read for about a year now, i don't know when or if i will pick it up again)

his first two books were of a totally different tone (at least in my mind). adn that's the form i thought that "13.C.K" would continue. but instead he started in on a trip about how "only those who went through the OFFICAL coures have ANY right to be called a sniper" and so on and so forth. all boiled down to him trying to make himself seem better than a Marine corps Legend.

For those who don't know, even though he's acknowledged as one of the founding members of the current USMC school for it, Hathcock never went THROUGH the course to become a scout/sniper.
his marksmanship and fieldcraft were already at a point, through his time on the Marine shooting team and innate skill, that it would have been wasteful to NOT simply say "ok Sgt, here's a rifle, what else do you need?".

Culbertson probably also holds a grudge b/c the book that "made hathcock famous" Marine Sniper: 93 Kills "fudges" the truth in places as to who did what, and makes it seem as if Hathcock was a superman, or some sort of "sniper god".
I could go on and on on the subject so i'll shut up now before i get TOTALLY obsessed with it... (maybe my wife is right and i am OCD)

regardless of the reasonings behind his dismissal of Hathcock and others as "not REAL snipers". culbertson really messed up by giving into the temptation to spout off on the subject. what COULD have been a truly enlightening book turned to a belittlement session.

 

[Colt46]

Here's a few

that you should look out for. Don't know if any are still in print. Guy Sajer's"the forgotten soldier", Martin Middlebrook's "Convoy", Clay Blair's two volume "Hitler's U-boat war". A real favorite of mine is a novel based on the Sepoy Mutiny of 1857. Look for JG Farrell's "The Siege of Krishnapur". Good luck!

 

[GunWares]

I'll second (or third) "Flags of Our Fathers". It was first rate.

Another book that I believe has not been mentioned is "Prisoners of the Japanese" by Gavan Daws. It documents the treatment of Allied POWs by the Japanese during WW II. A sometimes difficult read (because of subject matter).

"Ghost Soldiers" by Hampton Sides is another must-read.

One of the most boring and worthless books I've read is Wesley Clark's "Waging Modern War". That's $20 and 20 hours of my life I wish I had back.

Another good one: "Vietnam" by Stanley Karnow. Emphasis more on political aspect of war, but a very good read.

 

[Khornet]

Lot of 'em

"Clear The Bridge", war partol diary of USS TANG, attack sub WWII
"American Caesar", William Manchester--Bio of MacArthur, superb
"Goodbye Darkness", Marine combat in the Pacific, William Manchester
"One Bugle, No Drums", Chosin Reservoir
"Breakout", Martin Russ, Chosin Reservoir
"Incredible Victory", Walter Lord, Midway
"With The Old Breed at Tarawa and Peleiu", Sledge
"Storm Over The Gilberts" ?Russ
"Line of Departure", Russ, Tarawa
"Ghost Soldiers", Hampton Sides, Rescue of GI prisoners from Japanese prison camp
"1000 Destroyed", P47/P51 pilots e.g. Gentile, Blakeslee
"Zemke's Wolfpack", highest scoring P47 outfit

On and on...

 

[wingnutx]

"The Corps" series by W.E.B. Griffin, also his "Brotherhood of War" series

"Blackhawk Down" by Mark Bowden.

"Chicken Hawk" by Robert C. Mason

"Starship Troopers" by Robert Heinlein (yes I am serious. It's on the Marine Corps suggested reading list)

 

[fix]

Force Recon Diary 1969 and Force Recon Diary 1970 - If you liked Alex Lee's book, you'll love these. Written by a corpsman turned Marine who served in Lee's unit. Plenty of first hand reports of field actions.

Ground Attack Vietnam - Good book on Marine CAS in it's early years.

 

[Hutch]

"With the Old Breed at Pelleliu and Okinawa" by Eugene Sledge. An enlisted Marine's account of those ghastly battles. Very authoritative.

 

[Sean Smith]

The Art of War - Sun Tzu
On War - Clausewitz

A comment here: having read both, I have to say that The Art of War has superior insight to Clausewitz, even though it is much older. On War is also written in a needlessly complex style, and many who have read it (including Clausewitz's critics) actually misunderstand Clausewitz's major points. However, On War is still worth a read.

The Book of Five Rings - Miyamoto Musashi

This book is more concerned with individual training and mindset to kill and win in combat than higher-level "strategy." An excellent little book.

The Price of Glory - Alistair Horne
An Army At Dawn - Rick Atkinson
We Were Soldiers Once... And Young - Moore & Galloway
Black Hawk Down - Mark Bowden

Books about battles and campaigns - at Verdun, North Africa, Vietnam and Somalia.

 

[Balog]

Wow, great suggestions. Thanks every one.

About Culbertson and 13 Cent Killers: I read that book once, but I don't remember any tirades against Gunny Hathcock. Of course I read it in one session that started at about 2am so I could have missed it. I'll have to go back and reread it.

 

[moa]

I will second "Death Traps" by Cooper.

Also, the very first military history I ever read is "The First To The Last" by General Adolph Galland, German fighter ace during WWII and rose to become chief of the Luftwaffe Fighter Arm. Served from 1939 to 1945. Had over 100 confirmed kills. IIRC, became Commander of the first jet fighter (ME 262) squadron.

Over 100 kills seems like a lot by American standards. But the Germans had pilots with hundreds of confirmed kills. I think it was Eric Molders who had something like 350 confirmed kills. German kill confirmation process was quite strict.

Some time after the war, Galland became a favorite vistor to the Pentagon Air Force staffers. Interesting is Galland was of French descent.

Which reminds me that Hitler was defended in his last days in Berlin by the French SS Division Charlemagne. The divison started off 10,000 strong and only 150 survived the war. The Soviets lost 100,000 men killed taking Berlin.

 

[4v50 Gary]

Eric Hartman had 352 to his credit & Eric Molders had less than 150. He got his ground assignment and that kinda stopped his combat missions.

Our guys got less because we rotated our guys home to teach the fledglings. The Germans, like the RAF, kept them in until they either died or were disabled.

Civil War reading

John Worsham's One of Jackson's Foot Cavalry - that's the book that got me hooked on the Civil War.
John Billings Hardtack and Coffee - describes the life of the Civil War Soldier. Billings served in the 10th Mass Light Artillery
Alvah Hunter A Year on a Monitor and the Destruction of Fort Sumter - 15 year old A. Hunter joins the US Navy and like any kid, wanders all over his strange new ship. He describes his monitor and life aboard it.

WW I

Herbert McBride's A Rifleman Went to War - as if you've never read this classic account of sniping in WW I before.
Lawrence's Seven Pillars of Wisdom. Col. Lawrence's classic account of the Arab revolt. Try to find a hardback in a 2nd handshop. Cheaper than the newer paperback if you're lucky.
Lowell Thomas - Count Luckner - The Sea Devil biography of a German count who runs away at age 14 to become a merchant sailor. As the only German officer who served aboard sailing ships, he is given the coveted raider, Seeadler (Sea Eagle). BTW, having been a very poor student and having grown up aboard sailors, von Luckner did not master proper German until he attended the Naval Academy. He spoke "sailor" and could cuss with the best of them. Luckily for him his uncle was the Commandant of the academy and he required Luckner to go to his home for tutelage by his cousin. Sorry but I forget the title (and can't find my copy) but there's a book by Julius Lauterbach. Lauterbach was a merchant sailor who served aboard the famous Emden as a prize captain. He was captured but escaped from the British (Malaya) where he fled to Japan (British Allies) and met a Japanese detective who boasted that he was going to capture that fat German sailor. Lauterbach complimented him on his detective skills and predicted he would have no trouble catching that German (him). Lauterbach then snuck across the Pacific into the U.S. (neutral) where, despite being watched, he got to New York and back to Germany. Quite an adventure.

 

[Balog]

4v50Gary: since you seem to be extremely knowledgeable about the War Between the States, I'm curious about your opinion of the works of Michael and Jeffrey Shaara. I very much enjoyed The Killer Angels, but I'd love to hear an opinion of the historical accuracy from someone who has read the prime material.

 

[4v50 Gary]

Like I admitted to Matt Guest, I've never even read the Red Badge of Courage. Ditto for Killer Angels. I can recommend Glen Tucker's High Tide at Gettysburg. It tends to support the Longstreet perspective (as portrayed in the movie).

I did buy & read one historical novel this year. It was OK but what motivated me was that the appendix reprinted all the letters that the novel were based on. The contents of those letters were what I sought.

 

[Sean Smith]

Well, I'm not 4v50 Gary, but I actually did read the Killer Angels, and majored in History back at Woo Poo U. Phi Alpha Theta and all that. Which proves nothing, except that the military not allowing you a personal life will help you get better grades.

ANYway, my take on it is that it does a pretty good job of presenting the "conventional wisdom" historical view of the battle. Alot of the details of conversations and so forth are, of course, completely made up, which is why it is a novel and not a history book. But the major events portrayed are pretty accurate. And although many of his contemporaries hated his guts for criticizing Lee, it is hard to argue that Longstreet was wrong and Lee was right about that particluar battle.

That reminds me: Gettysburg: A Testing of Courage by Noah Andre Trudeau is a good recent account of that battle.

Also add "The Secret War for the Union : The Untold Story of Military Intelligence in the Civil War" by Edwin C. Fishel. Not exactly light reading, however.

 

[roo_ster]

Lots of Good Military History Book Listed So Far

Howdy:
--
I double-majored in Physics & History and read quite a few history books at the time and continued my education by reading good books ever since. I'm not an expert, just an enthusiastic reader.
--
*John Keegan*
IMO, Keegan is the best military history writer alive. Writes to the educated/interested layman.
Keegan books I have read:
* A History of War
A very interesting take on warfare and how different peoples developed it over time. Good general primer & great place to start one's education in military history.
* Face of Battle
Examination of several battles throughout history from the perspective of the individual warriors who fought them. Agincourt, Waterloo, Somme, & another two or three. A classic.
* Mask of Command
Examination of different kinds of leadership and those who practiced them: heroic, aheroic, false-heroic, etc.
* Price of Admiralty
Face of Battle on the high seas. Describes in detail what occurred in a sea battle at different points in history.
--
*Jerry Pournell*
Military fiction/science fiction. A good read. His "Go Tell the Spartans" and "Prince of Sparta" books are terrific primers on terrorist/insurgencies & counter-insurgency. Think of a civilization separated into "Citizens" who spend their lives on welfare, "Taxpayers" who get to pay for it all, and the consequences thereof.
* Go Tell the Spartans
* Prince of Sparta
* Falkenberg's Legion
* Mercenary
* Prince of Mercenaries
--
*Victor David Hanson*
* Carnage & Culture
Why has western civilization dominated the world and defeated the armies of asia & africa?
--

 

[Balog]

Think of a civilization separated into "Citizens" who spend their lives on welfare, "Taxpayers" who get to pay for it all, and the consequences thereof.

That's different from the US how, exactly?

BTW, Thomas Sowell is awesome!

 

[Sean Smith]

Got to say that I think Keegan is overrated, not the least because it is clear from his critiques of Clausewitz in A History of Warfare and elsewhere that Keegan either: doesn't comprehend On War, never actually read it, or is simply dishonest.

 

[Detritus]

About Culbertson and 13 Cent Killers: I read that book once, but I don't remember any tirades against Gunny Hathcock.

I do not beleive he ever DIRECTLY attacks Hathcock (if he does then i never got that far). what he DOES do is make comments about how, only those who went through the stateside or in-country Sniper schools are "snipers" that MPs adn others who went out with a bolt rifle without ever having been through the school were NOT snipers!

he also attacks one of the "legends of Hathcock" directly, never uses hathcock's name though. he rips into the story told in "Marine Sniper" of the hunting of a NVA/VC general by hathcock and hathcock alone. can't remember but culbertson may have even come out and called the tale complete BS. on the grounds that "a lone caucasian in a country filled with Armed and high pissed off asians, goes out into the boonies to hit a high mucketty-muck asian. this 'lone white boy' supposedly works his way into a high security enemy area, kills said high muckity-muck, then preceeds to get out of dodge without a scratch....... hmmm me thinks THIS smells like old fish"

and granted i think Culbertsons grudge maybe against the IMAGE of hatcock produced by "Marine Sniper", but he goes about it wrong if that's the case. Plus that book was NOT an appropriate forum for that type of attack (esp since Hathcock is now deceased)

 

[Balog]

Hmmm, I remember Culbertson talking about the public misperception that a sniper is a guy wandering around in the bush by himself. I thought this was more a comment on how a sniper actually operates vs the Hollywood perception of them.

As to whether or not Hatchcock went to a sniper school, I found this in Marine Sniper:

"It was 1960, and in that year the first scout/sniper school commenced under Land's and Terry's direction. The course lasted two weeks-one week of marksmanship skills and a second week of field crafts and land navigation training. Hathcock graduated in 1961, from the second class that Land taught."

Are you saying this info is a lie?

 

[dodge]

You might also try :

"Acceptable Loss" by Kregg P.J. Jorgenson
"Tank Sargent" by Ralph Zumbro
"Dear Mom A Sniper's Vietnam" by Joseph Ward and
"Guns Up" by Johnnie Clark

These books pertain to Vietnam and were true life experiences which I think make for some pretty good reading.

 

[Detritus]

Are you saying this info is a lie?

(first off it's been a few years since i last read the Henderson book,)

no, but it's not truly indictative of what Land and Hathcock, said happened either. every other account i've seen, where Land and/or Hathcock spoke of hathcock processing through the school, seem to infer that it was a formality so that land could get Carlos reassigned to sniper duty, and that hathcock was utilized as a secondary instructor during this period.

he did NOT go through the same course curriculum as people like Culbertson did. again, THAT would have been a waste of hathcock's and the Marine Corps time.


BTW Charles henderson came out a few years back and admitted that "Marine Sniper" as it exists now if not only not what he set ot to write, but b/c of the editing and compression of the material, etc. that it borders on fiction in WAY too many places. it's a good book and what's in it is an account of true events, problem is that HATHCOCK did NOT do everything atributed to him (long story adn the fault lies with the original publisher/editorial staff)

 

[Detritus]

"Tank Sargent" by Ralph Zumbro

just a heads up, Tank Sergent is now out of print

great book, deals with just about ALL aspects of life in the 69th armor.


and you GOTTA love the reason why he decided NOT to take an extension.... (the coconut as a "sign from god)

 

[L-Frame]

Many of the books already listed are true classics. Here's my take on some and I'll add one:

Citizens Soldiers- Ambrose's best book IMHO
Guns of August- awsome book about the opening of WWI.
Face of Battle- fascinating study of battle
An Army at Dawn- great details about the opening of our North Africa campaign in WWII.

Flags of our fathers- great story of Iwo Jima but drags later, explaining the men's lives after WWII.

Blackhawk Down- very interesting story of Somalia, especially dealing with the Delta's but again, I think drags because some much of the action is the same as the book goes on.

With the Old Breed at Pelilieu and Okinawa- MAYBE THE BEST ACCOUNT OF WHAT BATTLE IS REALLY LIKE EVER WRITTEN. Brutal and sickening.

And, the one I haven't seen mentioned yet:

About Face by David Hackworth- about his military exploits in both Korea and Vietnam (he's the most decorated living U.S. soldier) and his disillusion with the war in the later years. THE SECOND BEST BATTLE BOOK EVER WRITTEN. (IMHO)