Black Dragon VS New Gun Legislation

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I wasn't sure where else to post this rant on this site, so I decided to stick it here.

Before anything I think it's best I introduce myself. I call myself whatever variant of 'Black Dragon' you can think of everywhere else, and I came here after reading about this site in a book called 'Gun Guys'. I'm not really a gun enthusiast, I come from a (short) lineage of gun enthusiasts, but I see myself more as a martial artist. I enjoy swords, spears and other traditional weapons. But, I do understand the usefulness and importance of gun ownership.

To me, this is more than the right to bear arms; it's a right to personal protection

The following are my thoughts on the matter of gun control based on what I've read and researched about the topic. I'm sure much of this will be nothing new, but it will be included in one of the first videos posted in a future youtube channel. I'm posting some of here as a means of organizing my thoughts, getting feedback and so on. Do keep in mind this is not everything I'll discuss in the video, just the basics.

Since August well into November 2012, we've seen a string of public shootings ending with the infamous Sandy Hook Massacre, which has seemed to serve as a last straw. Just about everything and everyone imaginable has come together to plead Congress to place stricter gun control laws with the hope that making it more difficult for citizens to get their hands on firearms, that it would somehow deter incidents like this from happening in the future.

Which is complete bullocks (I don't know if this counts as a curse word, if so I'll replace it).

And there are several reasons for this;

1. The media is completely biased against anything gun-related.

And we see this all the time, every other news report is about somebody being murdered, accidently shot; either by someone else, or by themselves. Every other liberal talking head and celebrity supporter gets on the camera and goes on about how the world would be a nicer place if only guns weren't around to kill people.

But, they're always careful to leave out every bit of good people have done with a gun. Hundreds, to thousands, to a few million defensive gun uses (I.E. A citizen using a gun in a clear-cut case of self-defense) happen every year. But, most mainstream news don't consider a criminal or psycho being shot newsworthy, so their often swept under the rug. And the few times a case of defensive gun use is actually portrayed, the reporters often screw with the facts.

2. The 'Gun Show Loophole' is utter nonsense. I don't understand where people get the idea that gunshows are the only place people buy weapons from. Gun Shows all require some form of background check in order to legally sell firearms and it has been shown that such a small percent of crimes (of any form) commited with a firearm purchased at one of these events is so miniscule (0.7% but I cite this from a book written in 2003, so it needs updating), it's bearly worth mentioning.

3. Citizens don't need concealed weapons or assault weapons. I may concede the latter of this, but most machine guns (I'm talking AR-15 and AK-47's) have a 'select fire' feature that would allow the user to choose between semi-automatic (firing as fast as you can pull the trigger) and full auto (holding the trigger causes continuous firing), which means that the user doesn't have to spray bullets all over the place if they don't want to. Beyond that, a full-auto spray is hardly used since this causes the kick to rise, making it more difficult to aim.

4. The ammo limit is also nonsense. It can be said that putting a limit on the amount of bullets a gun can hold is ineffective when we take into account the military tactic of tapping two magazines together, allowing the user to switch one out for the other in quick succession. Beyond this, high-capacity mags can-and often are-smuggled from other places, or they could be made from scratch.

5. Less guns in the hands of citizens=/= less crime. Please keep in mind that most lawmakers who make such legislation do so with the expectation that everyone and their mother will say "Oh, they made it illegal, I guess I can't do that then." It's also illegal to shoot up a movie theater or a school but there's people that do it anyway. Lots of states that use stricter gun-laws seem to have more violent crime than places that don't or at least have right-to-carry laws.

If we take a look at Isreal, we also see a right-to-carry law that has allowed citizens to put down terrorist attacks by shooting the would-be bomber or attacker before they're able to cause any (further) damage. Making citizens more dependent on police/military force that can't be everywhere at once only makes them more vulnerable to attack.

And 6. The proposed banned has more going on than one thinks. There is a long list of weapons that are banned and aren't actually assault weapons. The proposed ban also prohibits any rifle/shotgun that has a pistol-grip, a bayonet mount and/or a folding stock, and pistols whose clip is visible. None of these have any baring on the firing capabilities on the firearm or the bullet's capabilities, just how it looks and how one is able to carry it.

Remember; You can't protect someone by taking away from their ability to protect themselves.
 
Many good points. Welcome to The High Road.
It certainly helps to contact your representatives often and tell them you expect them to OPPOSE any further gun control.
 
Welcome to THR! May I suggest you become part of us by attending an indoor range of your choice, renting a few handguns or rifles and decide if you'd like to join the club?

There really is a lot to like with the community!

Then, if you do decide to join us, maybe you would consider joining the NRA, GOA, or any group representing the sport? Heck, you could join the NRA now and get their rag either in digital or hardcopy.

Again, welcome. Whatever you decide, great first post, and if you already own a gun, well, good on ya'!
 
Welcome to THR!

You short dissertation pretty much summarizes our message.

Having said that, a minor correction:

3. Citizens don't need concealed weapons or assault weapons. I may concede the latter of this, but most machine guns (I'm talking AR-15 and AK-47's) have a 'select fire' feature that would allow the user to choose between semi-automatic (firing as fast as you can pull the trigger) and full auto (holding the trigger causes continuous firing), which means that the user doesn't have to spray bullets all over the place if they don't want to. Beyond that, a full-auto spray is hardly used since this causes the kick to rise, making it more difficult to aim.

Don't confuse the real, quantifiable definition of assault rifle with the made-up assault weapon. The former is what you describe; a rifle chambered for an intermediate cartridge with full auto or burst capability. Real assault rifles have been heavily regulated for 80 years, and are prohibitively expensive (think $15k-$20k for an M-16). The latter is a term coined by anti-gun congresscritters to describe whatever standard title I firearm they wish to categorize as evil, usually a semi-automatic rifle that looks similar to an assault rifle.

I believe it was Josh Sugarman who said something along the lines of it being a real accomplishment to "fool the American people into believing the (1994) ban was about regulating machine guns".
 
We all appreciate support of gun rights but i think it important that facts be correct when debating gun control or one can do more harm than good.

But, they're always careful to leave out every bit of good people have done with a gun. Hundreds, to thousands, to a few million defensive gun uses (I.E. A citizen using a gun in a clear-cut case of self-defense) happen every year. But, most mainstream news don't consider a criminal or psycho being shot newsworthy, so their often swept under the rug. And the few times a case of defensive gun use is actually portrayed, the reporters often screw with the facts.

Millions every year? Where did you come up with this number? That is likey a dramatic over estimation. Unless a case is somehow unique or sensational, local use of a firearm in self defense will not likely get national media attention just as the vast majority of individual murders don't.

2. The 'Gun Show Loophole' is utter nonsense. I don't understand where people get the idea that gunshows are the only place people buy weapons from. Gun Shows all require some form of background check in order to legally sell firearms and it has been shown that such a small percent of crimes (of any form) commited with a firearm purchased at one of these events is so miniscule (0.7% but I cite this from a book written in 2003, so it needs updating), it's bearly worth mentioning.

I have never once been to a gun show that required any form of background check for private sellers. I'm not arguing that they should but your facts are wrong. FFL dealers operating at gun shows are of course required to perform background checks but in states that allow private sells i would bet that the vast majority of gun shows do not require checks be done by private sellers.

3. Citizens don't need concealed weapons or assault weapons. I may concede the latter of this, but most machine guns (I'm talking AR-15 and AK-47's) have a 'select fire' feature that would allow the user to choose between semi-automatic (firing as fast as you can pull the trigger) and full auto (holding the trigger causes continuous firing), which means that the user doesn't have to spray bullets all over the place if they don't want to. Beyond that, a full-auto spray is hardly used since this causes the kick to rise, making it more difficult to aim.

Are you not aware that full auto AR's and AK's are extremely expensive and rare? The vast majority of AR's and AK's in the USA are semiautomatic only. No new full auto weapons have been allowed to enter the civilian market since 1986. Uncontrollable full auto is not a relevant issue.

All other issues aside i would say that the right to carry a concealed firearm is the most important of all gun related issues. At the end of the day statistics don't matter to me when it comes to my right to own and carry a gun for self defense. No amount of irresponsible and criminal use by others negates any law abiding individual's right to self defense. While i don't support banning AR's, high cap mags or requiring universal background checks those issues are far less important than the right to concealed carry. It can actually mean the difference between a person surviving an attack or a woman being raped.

5. Less guns in the hands of citizens=/= less crime. Please keep in mind that most lawmakers who make such legislation do so with the expectation that everyone and their mother will say "Oh, they made it illegal, I guess I can't do that then." It's also illegal to shoot up a movie theater or a school but there's people that do it anyway. Lots of states that use stricter gun-laws seem to have more violent crime than places that don't or at least have right-to-carry laws.

Unfortunately there is just as much evidence to contradict the notion that more guns equals less crime as there is to the counter. It is a delusion that criminals are deterred by guns or else gang violence would by its nature eliminate itself. The causes of crime in a society are very complex and just increasing the numbers of guns in circulation can not be said to decrease it. There are countries and regions with extremely draconian gun laws with extremely low crime just as there are areas with extreme gun laws that have very high crime.

And 6. The proposed banned has more going on than one thinks. There is a long list of weapons that are banned and aren't actually assault weapons. The proposed ban also prohibits any rifle/shotgun that has a pistol-grip, a bayonet mount and/or a folding stock, and pistols whose clip is visible. None of these have any baring on the firing capabilities on the firearm or the bullet's capabilities, just how it looks and how one is able to carry it.

The "proposed ban" is currently DOA. The only viable legislation currently up for consideration is the implementation of universal background checks.
 
From where do you cite all this information, Justin? Perhaps I could look at it myself?

You are asking me to cite information over a wide range of topics. Can you please specify which specifically?

What i would suggest is that you take the time to read from both sides of the debate and as many neutral sources as possible. Both sides have a very bad habit of cherry picking data, skewing results and mixing correlation with causation in order to support their agenda.
 
The 'facts' are that many states have face-to-face sales without background checks or the 4473 form.
I'm in Ohio. Face-to-Face sales are legal here. Both parties must be Ohio residents and the buyer must be legally able to own firearms.
I've purchased many guns over the years without a background check at shows and in private transactions. Perfectly legal.
I have also purchased many guns over the years from FFLs, where I filled out a 4473 and got the background check.
My 'loophole' guns are no more violent than my 'checked' guns. ;)
 
I'd like to start with the facts on the gun shows you got.

How exactly would you like for me to cite my own experiences? I've been to numerous gun shows in TX and one outside and none required background checks for private sells. I've read numerous articles debating this issue as well. I have no doubt private sells occur in other states. In fact i don't recall ever once hearing about a gun show requiring background checks beyond what is required by law. Nobody knowledgeable on the topic is arguing that there are not sells occurring at gun shows without background checks. The debate is whether or not it should continue to be allowed. That, in addition to sells through the internet, newspaper and friends/family is exactly what is being debated right now in the Senate. This is common knowledge in no more need of citatation than 'rivers contain water'.
 
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In Washington, the Washington Arms Collectors (WAC) runs one of the biggest shows in western washington. Only members can buy or sell, and to become a member you need to show a concealed pistol license. I don't know if they have an alternative way to check your background if you don't have a CPL. So you could say all private sales at the WAC shows have been background checked. But that is just their rule. There is no state or federal rule mandating this, and I"m sure there a other gun shows which allow private sales with no background check.

Also, what is a "gun show"? Is a flea market with a few people selling guns a gun show? How about a garage or estate sale with 50 guns from one house?
 
Well, it would seem I have a good amount of revision to do with my video script. I want to keep a neutral argument, considering, so posting this and listening to the arguments allowed me to see where I was going with everything.

Thank you all for your input.
 
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