Build your own AR vs. buying a new one out of the box

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I saw a complete lower for 180 yesterday, plus shipping, transfer, etc. Complete uppers are 200 or more then sights and BCG. Your looking at about 500 that way for a very basic but functional gun if you shop around and find good deals. You can buy essentially the same rifle from Anderson and other lower tier vendors for the same money.

If your looking at something particular that you want (certain stock or handguard, barrel) your better off building unless you find those exact parts included in a deal.
 
Buying a Colt gets you far more than just an engraving of a prancing pony. Colt uses quality springs. Springs make or break a self loading firearm. Colt uses an H buffer. Colt also uses the right diameter gas port.

Most other makers, whether you're talking about a kit or a complete rifle, use a carbine buffer (which is too light) cheap springs and overly large gas ports. Correcting these shortcomings means the added cost of replacing the carbine buffer, getting a good action spring and installing an adjustable gas block. At some point, you'll also need to replace the extractor spring and learn what the symptoms are of an extractor spring going bad.

There's nothing wrong with building your own rifle. It's an enjoyable pastime and educational as well. But if you fall victim to the thinking that all Colt offers is a pretty picture of a prancing pony, you'll never understand what truly makes up a solid, reliable AR and building your own will gain you nothing
 
Is it true that if you build your own AR it will cost less than an out of the box brand new fully assembled AR-15 Colt and a better quality accurate rifle?
The problem is I do not know how to put one of these together.
Suggestions?

File this in the FWIW category. I have a Colt LE marked AR that I am very please with in terms of quality. I have had three Bushmasters, one of which I ended up completely replacing the upper because of a range of problems. I pretty much upgraded that rifle so much the only piece that is original is the lower receiver. And by "upgrade" I mean putting in parts that worked reliabiy. So, reliability out of the box can definitely depend on the manufacturer.

The AR platform is so modular, you can start with a base rifle and "snap on" options as you may want/need. My wife calls it "Legos for grown ups".

Colt will likely always be a desirable brand for resale purposes. Building your own from, say, an Anderson receiver just for example. Probably not so much.
 
File this in the FWIW category. I have an older Colt LE marked AR-15 that I am very pleased with in terms of quality, reliability and accuracy. I have had three Bushmasters, one of which I ended up completely replacing the upper because of a range of problems. I pretty much upgraded that rifle so much the only piece that is original is the lower receiver. And by "upgrade" I mean putting in parts that would work reliably. So, reliability out of the box can definitely depend on the manufacturer.

The AR platform is so modular, you can start with a base rifle and "snap on" options as you may want/need. My wife calls it "Legos for grown ups".

Colt will likely always be a desirable brand for resale purposes. Building your own from, say, an Anderson receiver just for example. Probably not so much.
 
My Last AR Build was somewhat accidental.

Just before Christmas last year I saw that Midway had a special on Stoner-brand complete (w/BCG & Charging Handle) A3 Uppers ... $290, delivered.

I had not built one since 13Sep04 and figured, Why Not?

The Anderson Lower and parts kit cost another ~$100 ... I already had a collapsible stock assy (cost ~$20 ~15 years ago) in my kit ... so my Last AR cost me a bit more than $400. ;)
 
Is it true that if you build your own AR it will cost less than an out of the box brand new fully assembled AR-15 Colt and a better quality accurate rifle?
The problem is I do not know how to put one of these together.
Suggestions?
Sure, if you already have about $200 worth of tools and know exactly what parts to buy and what to avoid. If having a warranty is unimportant. If you are able to diagnose and correct the problems that might arise. I'd suggest dispensing with the idea of doing it to save money. It's best to approach it as a way to get exactly what you want without having to replace a bunch of factory parts.
 
I'd suggest dispensing with the idea of doing it to save money. It's best to approach it as a way to get exactly what you want without having to replace a bunch of factory parts.

Exactly my thoughts on the matter as well.

If I were looking for a new, plain AR, I'd go with a colt. They are very good guns and don't typically have the quality issues of other (lower priced) manufacturers. This would be for a defensive gun to be used in carbine courses though, if you just want a plinking gun to shoot at the range once a year, you can get pretty much anything.

The best benefit of building your own gun is that you can choose the exact parts/combination of parts that you want. For example, I am currently building a SPR type 18" upper for a spare AR lower that I had laying around. I sourced all of the parts and have exactly what I want including a nice adjustable gas block so that I can tune the gas system for shooting with a suppressor.

Here's the kicker, I wound up spending $100 more to build it than I would have paid to just buy a comparable upper pre-built (but without the adjustable gas block or the handguard that I wanted - if I'd used a normal gas block it would have been a wash except for my time), and to add insult to injury, I'm now on gas block number 4 (2 broken, one incorrectly sized gas block sent as a replacement, and one hopefully correct replacement for that one) and I've been working on this upper for 3 months.

This experience isn't normal (I've had other builds go perfectly), but unless you have the tools or just like the idea of toying around and building your own gun, I'd just buy one.
 
Exactly my thoughts on the matter as well.

If I were looking for a new, plain AR, I'd go with a colt. They are very good guns and don't typically have the quality issues of other (lower priced) manufacturers. This would be for a defensive gun to be used in carbine courses though, if you just want a plinking gun to shoot at the range once a year, you can get pretty much anything.

The best benefit of building your own gun is that you can choose the exact parts/combination of parts that you want. For example, I am currently building a SPR type 18" upper for a spare AR lower that I had laying around. I sourced all of the parts and have exactly what I want including a nice adjustable gas block so that I can tune the gas system for shooting with a suppressor.

Here's the kicker, I wound up spending $100 more to build it than I would have paid to just buy a comparable upper pre-built (but without the adjustable gas block or the handguard that I wanted - if I'd used a normal gas block it would have been a wash except for my time), and to add insult to injury, I'm now on gas block number 4 (2 broken, one incorrectly sized gas block sent as a replacement, and one hopefully correct replacement for that one) and I've been working on this upper for 3 months.

This experience isn't normal (I've had other builds go perfectly), but unless you have the tools or just like the idea of toying around and building your own gun, I'd just buy one.

At this point I would probably go with one already built from the factory from a reputable company like Colt. I may even consider that AR-10 by Colt (308 Winchester) if it doesn't cost a fortune.
 
Last Memorial Day, I put together a complete AR-15 from PSA for $510, out the door:

PSA classic blem lower = $139 shipped
PSA Freedom Melonite Upper = $189 shipped
Freedom BCG/Charging Handle = $104 shipped
Magpul MBUS rear sight = $50

Transfer and background fee on the lower = 25 bucks

Grand total = $510

Its been a totally reliable recreational shooter, I'm not going to war with the thing, totally happy with it.
 
Last Memorial Day, I put together a complete AR-15 from PSA for $510, out the door:

PSA classic blem lower = $139 shipped
PSA Freedom Melonite Upper = $189 shipped
Freedom BCG/Charging Handle = $104 shipped
Magpul MBUS rear sight = $50

Transfer and background fee on the lower = 25 bucks

Grand total = $510

Its been a totally reliable recreational shooter, I'm not going to war with the thing, totally happy with it.

So not good for personal protection?
Now is the one you put together as good and reliable like that low cost Smith & Wesson MP model?
 
At this point I would probably go with one already built from the factory from a reputable company like Colt. I may even consider that AR-10 by Colt (308 Winchester) if it doesn't cost a fortune.
With Colts still being under $1000, you will spend about the same if you build a rifle to match a 6920/6720 in component quality and general quality assurance.

There can be all the discussion in the world about whether or not you need mil-spec components or another set of hands building the rifle, but the fact is, if you put all identical components into your build, it's going to be right there with a brand new 6920/6720.
 
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I put together a PSA 16" middy kit and it was perfectly suitable for home defense once I replaced the extractor spring and installed an H buffer. After those changes, it functioned fine. I was lucky that the barrel had the right size gas port from the start
 
I also have an S&W M&P Sport 5.56 and the bolt failed after 2000 rounds, S&W took care of it, but it failed.

So yes, I would put the PSA up against the S&W in terms of quality, for $140 less money.
 
I would be curious to know if the PSA kits are matched with the proper buffer tube for their length (most of their kits and rifles are 16" barrel, and mid length gas system. not sure on the buffer) They have a few longer 18 , 20 and a couple 22 inch barrels, but those are out of stock a lot.
Anyone with more knowledge on that?

I know my 16" barrel kit with mid range gas block works very well, and has had no problems at all, still very new though, so time will tell. I have seen several videos of folks with over 3000 rounds through theirs and all was well.
 
Warranty issues are kind of a bunk excuse for not building your own. Any reputable parts manufacturer will warrant their parts just the same as the firearms manufacturers do, all you have to be able to do is determine what parts are out of spec - which is incredibly easy. The AR is a remarkably simple mechanism, it doesn't take much mechanical understanding to be able to ask the right questions for troubleshooting. If you ask the right questions, the rifle will tell you what is wrong.

I don't at all agree with the premise Colt uses better springs than other manufacturers. Plus, all springs in an AR (or any firearm, or any spring mechanism in general) need to be replaced multiple times within the service life of the barrel, let alone the service life of the rifle itself. If an owner buys a cheap replacement spring, it doesn't matter what's engraved on the side of the lower. There are far better springs on the market than colt offers, and frankly, an owner can choose the colt springs for their self build if they really believe having a pony on the label matters. There's nothing wrong with the Colts, and they are very high quality rifles, but there are far better rifles on the market in their price class, especially when you consider a self build. The Colts are accurate and reliable, but it's false to say they are "the most" accurate of most reliable, as there isn't a single model out there which can claim that, even among its price point peers.
 
I've seen a few extractor and action springs wear out. Not one has been a Colt extractor spring (yet) and the Colt action springs seem to go longer round counts. Also, the Colt extractor spring is designed to give the right amount of extractor tension. Not too much, not too little.

PSA is good about supplying carbine springs & buffers with carbine REs and rifle buffers & springs with rifle REs. However, they supply carbine weight buffers with their carbine kits when the buffer should be an H or H2
 
I looked at building but wanted Factory Good so I bought an FN-15 made in South Carolina by Americans at just under $900 at my membership range. It has 800+ rounds thru it and I took an Advanced Carbine course with it last Sunday and it performed flawlessly. Cant ask much better than that.
 
With Colts still being under $1000, you will spend about the same if you build a rifle to match a 6920/6720 in component quality and general quality assurance.

There can be all the discussion in the world about whether or not you need mil-spec components or another set of hands building the rifle, but the fact is, if you put all identical components into your build, it's going to be right there with a brand new 6920/6720.
Are AR Colts going for under $1,000? Here they are going for $1,700 - $1,900. Most certainly even If you can find an AR-15 Colt it's over $1,000 for sure.
 
Are AR Colts going for under $1,000? Here they are going for $1,700 - $1,900. Most certainly even If you can find an AR-15 Colt it's over $1,000 for sure.
I saw this posted just today;

http://defenderoutdoors.com/colt-le6920-223rem-556nato


And checking slickguns, they're out there. Certainly not locally, I'm sure.

ETA - whether or not the stock status is accurate across the sites listed on Slickguns, no idea. But it typically is.
 
I saw this posted just today;

http://defenderoutdoors.com/colt-le6920-223rem-556nato


And checking slickguns, they're out there. Certainly not locally, I'm sure.

ETA - whether or not the stock status is accurate across the sites listed on Slickguns, no idea. But it typically is.
Thank you for that info. Now this model does not have the traditional carry handle. Is that carry handle gone for a reason in that it gets in the way of adding other equipment (nowadays) or is it purely cosmetics or for easy carry?
This Colt model 6920 s better than that S & W MP model which cost less than Colt?
 
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Pro;s and cons about building your own. First up, tho, is the myth that a built gun to milspec is somehow better than garage built. That is not a given or guaranteed - milspec guns in service show that the extractor and bolt get replaced at 25,000 rounds, action springs after that, the barrel should be replaced due to gas erosion at the port near 100,000, and extensive full auto use will ruin the throat and accuracy very shortly making it an 8MOA gun when the armorer finally sends it to Depot for rebarreling.

That's a Colt or FN. Don't let the fanboys tell you different, guns in service are not indestructible.

Can you build one cheaper, no. Makers who buy parts in volume are getting the best volume discounts, retailers who sell you 1 lower, 1 upper etc at a time are marking it up. Volume buying lowers puts them in them under $25 each. We don't get those prices. Same for barrels - if you can get them for $45 each milspec we'd be busting even. Not happening when you buy retail. The fantasy you can build cheaper is exactly that -

Another issue is controlling dimensions on parts that must match to meet customer expectations, like the pin locations on lowers and uppers. We like them to go together with thumb pressure and no rattles, that is what the makers finesse selecting their machining tolerances and during assembly. Can we do that? Nope, not happening. We get a lower from one coast, and upper from the other side of the country, finish assembling and try to pin them together and we get what we get. My first build was so tight I literally used a small deadblow hammer to "assist" the pins and get them to fit. Now? Almost thumb pressure looser, things are breaking in. The second build I dropped the upper on the lower and it not only fit it was a tad loose. Like, a rifle that had seen a few cycles in Basic.

Your Mileage May Vary - no telling what you get assembling your own, but even the cheaper guns built off the rack do that pretty well.

As for what kind of AR - they just don't make them all. First gun I built was a A2 stocked 6.8 dissipator. Those are nearly impossible to find on the shelf. But, since I had put it together, I could change it. It went to a MFT Minimalist adjustable carbine stock with Apex Gator tube. And the leftover parts - the clamp on FSB - became a 10.5" pistol build with B5 handguard. Can't find that on the open market, either, much less OD green Magpul K grip, and cut down carry handle rear sight.

You build because the makers always play to the market and make the popular model. They don't make the niche guns or any retro models. You can't get an M16 a nothing. You build it.

As for tools, don't believe it for a second. The first build was assembled with vice grips, the barrel nut tightened with a large pair of channel lock pliers. "$200" worth of tools is not a requirement and the build it yourself sticky on the AR forum shows you exactly how. The builders ten years ago didn't have any special tools and didn't really need them. I now have two specialty tools for the AR and I've used them less than half a dozen times, one was a waste of money for the most part - a nose lapper - the other is the barrel nut wrench which is also nearly useless. One quick way to know the poster hasn't got a true grasp of the mechanics is when they start on using a torque wrench, which is entirely unnecessary. If you are experienced about threaded fasteners, you know you can go too far, all the torque wrench does is keep you from doing it. You do NOT use it to torque a nut to a specific tightness, it's an indicator that prevents you going too far. It's doing the exact opposite of what most think it does. It's just there to stop you from stripping the threads - it's not a lug nut application and the barrel won't fall off.

As for pricing you get what you pay for, however, when you specify a particular roll mark you are also buying provenance. If you want Colt over S&W expect higher resale and some slight differences in fit and finish. Chain them both to the bumper of your truck and drag them down a dirt road and that goes away. Then it's a matter of reliability, and for the most part even if a full milspec gun, you are right back to changing out the extractor and bolt somewhere around 25,000 rounds, the action spring sometime after, and then the barrel depending on how quickly you abuse it with mag dumps. That is going to happen regardless and no rollmark can prevent it.

Buy if you want, build if you need. Best way I can put it.
 
Unlike the intimidating list posted somewhere above, I completed my first Stag lower with a hammer, set of pliers, bronze punch set, and a few strips of masking tape and didn't break anything or mar the finish. No blocks, no roll pin punches, none of that crap. And I have little mechanical ability or tool experience. Read up, follow directions, and be ye not afraid.
 
Thank you for that info. Now this model does not have the traditional carry handle. Is that carry handle gone for a reason in that it gets in the way of adding other equipment (nowadays) or is it purely cosmetics or for easy carry?
This Colt model 6920 s better than that S & W MP model which cost less than Colt?
The carry handle has been gone for awhile, at least on every 6920 I've seen in person. I'd assume they ditched it for $$ savings while simultaneously suiting the majority of users who'll mount an optic.

The 6920 is a rifle with no corners cut with regards to what is mil-spec. You're buying what is essentially an M4, vs. a carbine without all those little details that Smith saves money on (6061 RE's, not proofing/testing barrels, using largely 4140 barrel steel across their lines, not proofing every bolt, lazy castle nut staking [though that's a leg up on those who don't stake them at all], an overgassed barrel and carbine buffer in their carbine-length guns, a potentially lesser quality LPK, etc.). Do those things matter to you? That's your decision.

I'll say this, though. The M&P Sport is the best value rifle Smith and Wesson produces. And at $600, it's a great range gun. I have one that's been reliable enough in about 2k rounds, but a Colt it is not. And it's not a rifle I would want as my only rifle that I intend on depending on without making some changes to it out of the gate. So, I won't tell you what's right for you, but know what you're buying either way.

ETA - Verified in stock;
http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=6920
 
I've been building AR's ever since aftermarket receivers became available, around 1980. It's not as complicated as some people make it out to be. And you don't really need a lot of specialized tools. Mostly, they just make the job easier.

I have to say that the quality of stripped lowers has improved considerably over the years. In the early days, it was common to find out-of-spec receivers. Not any more.
 
I have found that it usually cost more money than an off the shelf rifle, at least for me. Well, maybe not. The rifle I build is cheaper than a comparative rifle with the same specs. I tend to build it to what I want, not what is cheapest. Though it can be done.
 
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