Building an AR 10, BCG ???

sevt_chevelle

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So am building an AR 10, starting off with 308.

How important is having a high pressure bolt that uses a smaller diameter firing pin? So i close to buying a lantec enhanced, but they don't offer the high pressure bolt.

I know JP offers a hp bolt.
 
Armalite AR-10 pattern or DPMS AR308 pattern? IIRC, there's a slight difference between the two.

Toolcraft Diamond Like Carbon (DLC) coating BCG is is a good choice. It's on sale at Arm or Ally for $179.99.

I have two Toolcraft AR308 BCGs, one in NiB and one in DLC, and I've had zero problems with either.

Good luck!
 
Lantac Enhanced 308 is 30% off on their website with code 308BCG30 right now. The carrier may offer some enhanced accuracy benefits due to a more solid lockup in the upper.
 
In .308 it doesn't make that big of a difference. The HP bolts are more for cartridges like the 6.5CM.

Just a point of clarification for readers of this thread - JP was making High Pressure bolts long before the 6.5 Creedmoor came about, and also, the 6.5 creed and 308win share the same SAAMI maximum pressure standard. HP bolts have every bit of relevancy for 308win as they ever could for 6.5 creed.
 
Just a point of clarification for readers of this thread - JP was making High Pressure bolts long before the 6.5 Creedmoor came about, and also, the 6.5 creed and 308win share the same SAAMI maximum pressure standard. HP bolts have every bit of relevancy for 308win as they ever could for 6.5 creed.

Then why the insistence for an HP bolt with the 6.5CM? I am aware of the pressure specs... but hoary internet lore suggests the HP bolt for 6.5CM.
 
Then why the insistence for an HP bolt with the 6.5CM? I am aware of the pressure specs... but hoary internet lore suggests the HP bolt for 6.5CM.

There are a lot of folks online insisting the world is flat too…

I’m going to ask a straight question here because how you are choosing to respond doesn’t make sense to me:

What facts are you arguing? Can you offer ANYTHING factual which actually proves my claims to be wrong? Or are you just wanting to argue against me, personally?

Whether you just don’t like me personally, or you are dead set on buying internet hype, neither of those are factual, defensible rebuttals to either of my claims made above - BUT if you can offer FACTUAL counterpoints to the facts I provided, rather than just pointing out to unsubstantiated hype made on internet forums, I’m welcome to learn:

1) JP Enhanced HP bolts existed before the 6.5 creedmoor was invented.

2) 308win and 6.5 Creedmoor share the exact same SAAMI pressure standard of 62kpsi.

I’ll start you off on the second point - straight from the pages of the SAAMI Centerfire Rifle Standards:

IMG_6171.jpeg

IMG_6172.jpeg


Lots of folks buy into internet hype - so I can appreciate that you believed that the 6.5 Creedmoor is a “higher performing round” than 308, so it obviously must need a High Pressure bolt,” but real facts don’t support the internet hype. But both of the facts I offered are true - the JP HP bolts existed long before the 6.5 Creedmoor to meet demands of 308win/7.62 shooters, and there is NOT any difference in the SAAMI pressure standard for 308 or 6.5creed, so again, the HP bolts are just as relevant for either application. You can choose to learn something new, or choose to hold fast to your confirmation bias, but I REALLY can’t fathom why you’re arguing at all…
 
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but I REALLY can’t fathom why you’re arguing at all…

I'm not arguing... I simply asked a question. You seem to be familiar with the AR platform... I'm just asking a simple question.

Up until I built an AR-10 in 6.5CM, I had never heard of a HP (.308) bolt, and when I built an AR-10 in .308 (prior to the 6.5CM...) I didn't give it a second thought.

My initial thought was people were (are) hotrodding the 6.5... and blowing primers, hence the need for tighter tolerances on the firing pin hole, but I may be all wet on that.
 
My initial thought was people were (are) hotrodding the 6.5...

Folks can “hotrod” any round, and more folks have been asking the 308win for better performance for generations before the 6.5 creed arrived, so I wouldn’t believe this is a driving factor to recommend a design change - but pouring a little logic on the fire…

If you expect folks to “hotrod” a cartridge, wouldn’t it make more sense to offer the advice “don’t do stupid things like ‘hotrodding’ ammo for your AR-10,” instead of telling them to buy a HP bolt to enable it? This feels a bit like justifying advice to wear a helmet while walking down the road because the wearer willing runs their head into every mailbox they pass… seems like better advice to give advice to simply NOT headbutt the mailboxes.

Those of us familiar with these rifles have seen the same bad internet lore getting passed around like Moses brought it down the mountain, and most of it doesn’t make sense… guys like to talk about HP bolts being “necessary” for certain rounds, or talk about 6.5 Grendel breaking bolts left and right, or Type I bolts breaking and Type II being a stronger design (that one gets me every time - since it has MORE metal cut away), and we even get guys talking about not shooting 7.62x51mm ammo in 308win rifles because the mil spec ammo standard is higher pressure (backwards and null for this comparison, 223/5.56 paradigm not transferable)…

The only semi-logical defense in this discussion is the idea that some 6.5 creed brass is available with small rifle primer pockets, so a smaller diameter firing pin might make sense… but AR-10’s aren’t benchrest rifles running ridiculous pressures, and guys have shot small rifle primer ammo for generations without smaller pins both in bolt guns AND AR-10’s, myself as an example, as I used Lapua Palma brass for all of my 308 family cartridges like 260, 7-08, and 243win, and respective AI’s, and couldn’t even create problems for myself… but hey, if a guy wants to buy an HP bolt as a bandaid for not knowing what they are doing and building overgassed AR-10’s, and blowing primers (and stretching cases) because they unlock too early, then they blame it on the “higher pressure” of the 6.5 creed cartridge instead of fixing their actual problem, more power to them…

The JP Enhanced and HP bolts are awesome, and I’m not casting any shade on the quality or function of the project, but rather pointing to the bad advice which gets regurgitated by the unwitting and inexperienced online which wrongfully suggests unnecessary “solutions” as “necessary.” The HP bolts are less likely to pierce primers, but if this problem were as inundating as some folks suggest, no rifle would have had anything but .062” firing pins for generations already…
 
The HP bolts are less likely to pierce primers, but if this problem were as inundating as some folks suggest, no rifle would have had anything but .062” firing pins for generations already…

That was the answer I was asking for... I didn't really need the whole spiel, and the criticism.

Thinking about this while I was working today... I guess the real question is 'Why are there HP bolts in the first place?' if there is nothing wrong with standard bolts working all these years.
 
@Charlie98 - if something is less likely to happen than something which happens zero times in the life of a firearm, is extra expense to buy that “prevention” really warranted?

Spend your money how you like, but it remains false to say there is any difference dictating an HP bolt for 6.5 Creedmoor’s over 308win’s - which was your original claim. The true answer is that “in 308 [or 6.5 creedmoor] it doesn’t make that big of a difference.”
 
@Charlie98

If you feel like throwing some money at something better than your run-of-the-mill BCG, get an Enhanced LMT BCG: superior metallurgy and some design features that sets it apart from the "normal". But, honestly, any known brand BCG will work as intended with the 6.5 CM (Most are made by 3 or 4 companies, anyways).
 
@Charlie98 - if something is less likely to happen than something which happens zero times in the life of a firearm, is extra expense to buy that “prevention” really warranted?

Spend your money how you like, but it remains false to say there is any difference dictating an HP bolt for 6.5 Creedmoor’s over 308win’s - which was your original claim. The true answer is that “in 308 [or 6.5 creedmoor] it doesn’t make that big of a difference.”

What is it with you, anyway? Maybe come off that high horse of yours for a minute. I'm not spending any money.

OP asked about buying a bolt for a .308 AR, I suggested an HP bolt was not necessary for a .308. Period. When I was researching parts for a 6.5CM build I was working up...

This is what I read on JP's website in regards to the HP bolt...

  • Allows reliable AR functional with previously incompatible over-pressured loads such as 6.5mm or 6mm calibers
  • Virtually eliminates primer flow and pierced primers
  • Reduced firing pin mass improves lock time and ignition reliability with hard primers
  • Features same quality construction and advantages of other JP EnhancedBolts
  • Backwards compatible with standard .308 ejectors, extractors and gas rings
  • Lifetime bolt warranty
(My bold on the first point.)

The first 3 points made sense to me, it may have been snake oil, it may not have been... but because this was a build for a friend, I spec'ed out the HP bolt. At the time, being completely unfamiliar with the 6.5CM in an autoloader, it seemed prudent.
 
^^^^^

So what bolts do you recommend?

The lantec came up as a high quality bcg, with a few additional features.

Lantac is fine. The JP Enhanced bolts are great, but there’s no sense in wringing your hands over which to buy - the “difference” is largely inapplicable for 99.9% of users, and certainly isn’t dependent upon a choice between 308 and 6.5 creed. Aero, Toolcraft, nothing wrong with these either. My current personal LFAR uses a cheap Toolcraft, and I’m now 1600 rounds of 6 creed down the tube and on my second barrel. I put multiple barrels worth of powder through a few 308’s on the same bolt tens of thousands of rounds across it, and multiple barrels worth on a 243win and a 7-08 LFAR in the past after abandoning the 308win.

Personally, I’d much rather have 2 ejectors than a small firing pin.
 
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