MD_Willington
Member
..Mine must be broken then, all they do is act a a platform for an encased projectile...which in turn puts holes in non living things, no wonder I got them cheap, they're defective.
"But guns were MADE for killing"
- Thread starter Drjones
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Derby FALs
Member In Memoriam
It gets innocents killed.
carterbeauford
member
damn right my 1911 was designed to kill, I don't carry it to start a friendly conversation on John M. Browning's merits as a gunmaker when someone tries to rape/rob/kill me.
Hairpin M'berg870
Member
uh....
While I cant argue that some guns aren't really that good for anything but killing, you have to keep in mind that a gun itself is not going to kill anyone. Somebodys gotta pull the trigger first. I saw on the news where a woman stabbed her husband to death with a spoon, but the brady bunch has yet to require a license to possess silverware. It's really more of a question of the gun's user whether a gun is "made" for killing. But if I could eat my cereal out of a hollowpoint I would!!!
"Gun's dont kill people. People kill people with guns."
While I cant argue that some guns aren't really that good for anything but killing, you have to keep in mind that a gun itself is not going to kill anyone. Somebodys gotta pull the trigger first. I saw on the news where a woman stabbed her husband to death with a spoon, but the brady bunch has yet to require a license to possess silverware. It's really more of a question of the gun's user whether a gun is "made" for killing. But if I could eat my cereal out of a hollowpoint I would!!!
"Gun's dont kill people. People kill people with guns."
bogie
Member
Tell ya what... You need to get rid of steak knives and ball-peen hammers too.
Why?
If you were ever trying a little field-expedient kitchen repair involving smacking the back of the steak knife with the ball peen hammer, while in an awkward, completely non-ergonomic position, you would know why.
But that was my own idiocy, and my own damn fault, altho I 'm sure that most of my neighbors heard the resultant cussing.
Now go pick up a heavy inanimate object, say a bowling ball, and drop it on your toe.
Did the bowling ball do it?
And your toe felt just fine until the last quarter inch or so, right?
Where does the fault lie? Could it be that you were STUPID when you paid attention to some moron on the internet who told you to drop a friggin' bowling ball on your toe?
Why?
If you were ever trying a little field-expedient kitchen repair involving smacking the back of the steak knife with the ball peen hammer, while in an awkward, completely non-ergonomic position, you would know why.
But that was my own idiocy, and my own damn fault, altho I 'm sure that most of my neighbors heard the resultant cussing.
Now go pick up a heavy inanimate object, say a bowling ball, and drop it on your toe.
Did the bowling ball do it?
And your toe felt just fine until the last quarter inch or so, right?
Where does the fault lie? Could it be that you were STUPID when you paid attention to some moron on the internet who told you to drop a friggin' bowling ball on your toe?
Hmmm.
Considering my life, I am surprised I wasn't killed by or shot others with a gun.
And some of my extended family grew up with guns all over the house.
Yet everyone is fine.
In my limited time on this earth and in the working world I have come to the realization that there are a great many grown up children out there who don't know how to handle frustration and anger. Maybe it is the way they were raised or just something is wrong with them. Underdeveloped frontal lobes?
Considering my life, I am surprised I wasn't killed by or shot others with a gun.
And some of my extended family grew up with guns all over the house.
Yet everyone is fine.
In my limited time on this earth and in the working world I have come to the realization that there are a great many grown up children out there who don't know how to handle frustration and anger. Maybe it is the way they were raised or just something is wrong with them. Underdeveloped frontal lobes?
rickomatic
Member
Answer: "And you sir/madam....are an idiot!"
But...seriously, the naivate of that statement simply begs for a rebuttel. You MUST make the person making that statement explain to you why they think that way. After they've let out enough rope......hang em with it.
Is a sander made to spin a disk of abrasive material or to sand? Is a saw made to spin a piece of steel with a fragmented edge, or to saw? A sander is made to spin that disk in order to sand and a saw is made to spin that steel in order to saw. You can change what you use that sander or saw for. Maybe you never cut or sand anything with it. You use it as a paperweight, or as a white noise generator. But you can never change the it's original intent of design. I think it's rather sad that so many of our own can't even come to terms with it and try to find abstract ways to deny the reality of what our guns were meant to do.
Sylvan-Forge
Member
Que,
It's cool that you have shown yourself to not be a troll.
I thought for sure you'd be gone. A pleasent surprise that you are not.
It's good to have participants from around the globe here.
Since you are not from the USA, and I indeed got the cart firmly before the horse, I redact the "contradiction" comment forthwith.
Not that I agree with what has and is happening with arms control
Que said:
....
....
It's cool that you have shown yourself to not be a troll.
I thought for sure you'd be gone. A pleasent surprise that you are not.
It's good to have participants from around the globe here.
Since you are not from the USA, and I indeed got the cart firmly before the horse, I redact the "contradiction" comment forthwith.
Not that I agree with what has and is happening with arms control
Que said:
I have some comments for this question after I get some more work done.
....
....
Deanimator
Member
Can you cite for me an instance in which this happened to someone other than a policeman attempting to subdue someone with less than lethal force?
If you can, you'll be the first in nearly thirty years of my asking.
I'm betting you can't.
Deanimator
Member
My god-sister was stabbed to death by her boyfriend.
To hear OSHA for Rapists (anti-gunners) tell it, she's not actually dead since she wasn't shot with a gun. My response: "But how come she never returns phonecalls?"
The truth is they'd rather she bleed to death than shoot the degenerate with the knife in his hand. None of them ever seems to volunteer to support her orphaned child either...
iamkris
Member
Que
Go forth and read this compilation of firearm facts. It will give you a well-documented set of facts to form your opinions...certainly better than the crap you are picking up at the Brady Campaign site.
http://www.gunfacts.info/
If you have more questions, then come back.
Go forth and read this compilation of firearm facts. It will give you a well-documented set of facts to form your opinions...certainly better than the crap you are picking up at the Brady Campaign site.
http://www.gunfacts.info/
If you have more questions, then come back.
Baba Louie
Member
- Joined
- Dec 26, 2002
- Messages
- 3,831
Que, let's say for a moment that you (or Sarah Brady) have godlike powers and can rid the world of ALL guns. (should you or she choose)
"POOF" it's done.
All guns gone. No one can use a gun, they don't exist. (Let's all hold hands and join in singing a few rounds of Kum-ba-yah)
I'm guess I'm gonna hafta break out my longbow, sword or tomahawk (I already carry a number of pocketknives), or I'm gonna grab my trusty "river-rock-wrapped-to-end-of-stick" warclub (or walking cane), or maybe a bullwhip I own and I'll go about my law abiding business... because you, with your godlike powers, only eliminated all guns, not all evil ner-do-wells; and while I'm getting all old and slow and don't really want to engage in close quarter combat with a younger, stronger, maybe drugged up miscreant to keep his evil self at bay (and I don't even want to think about the fate of weaker females) I guess I'll have to adapt. Or revert. Or devolve. Or suffer.
Maybe I'll just carry a rock or two and a leather sling. Worked for David when he faced Goliath (or so the story goes... with a little help from God). HEY! That sounds like a, a, a GUN! Smaller, weaker w/ weapon in hand, against bigger, badder distant foe (Bet it ruined the Philistine's plans that day).
Hmmm, maybe I can take a steel tube, mix some charcoal, sulphur and saltpeter, melt a little lead... maybe keep the bad guys a little farther away. Oops!
"POOF" it's done.
All guns gone. No one can use a gun, they don't exist. (Let's all hold hands and join in singing a few rounds of Kum-ba-yah)
I'm guess I'm gonna hafta break out my longbow, sword or tomahawk (I already carry a number of pocketknives), or I'm gonna grab my trusty "river-rock-wrapped-to-end-of-stick" warclub (or walking cane), or maybe a bullwhip I own and I'll go about my law abiding business... because you, with your godlike powers, only eliminated all guns, not all evil ner-do-wells; and while I'm getting all old and slow and don't really want to engage in close quarter combat with a younger, stronger, maybe drugged up miscreant to keep his evil self at bay (and I don't even want to think about the fate of weaker females) I guess I'll have to adapt. Or revert. Or devolve. Or suffer.
Maybe I'll just carry a rock or two and a leather sling. Worked for David when he faced Goliath (or so the story goes... with a little help from God). HEY! That sounds like a, a, a GUN! Smaller, weaker w/ weapon in hand, against bigger, badder distant foe (Bet it ruined the Philistine's plans that day).
Hmmm, maybe I can take a steel tube, mix some charcoal, sulphur and saltpeter, melt a little lead... maybe keep the bad guys a little farther away. Oops!
OK, I concur. Guns can, do, have and will KILL, if the person wielding them so chooses and knows human anatomy. But you know what?
I got mine. You got yours?
Que
Member
Baba
Please show me where I said that guns should be banned? I seriously do not think I said that at any time, anywhere! If you dont, then please go back and read what I wrote.
Please show me where I said that guns should be banned? I seriously do not think I said that at any time, anywhere! If you dont, then please go back and read what I wrote.
Baba Louie
Member
- Joined
- Dec 26, 2002
- Messages
- 3,831
Mea Culpa Que.
Que
Member
Deanimator
There are many children shot and killed by there parents weapons, but shot by another child... if a child can do it... how much more then, can an adult take the weapon and shot you?
There are many children shot and killed by there parents weapons, but shot by another child... if a child can do it... how much more then, can an adult take the weapon and shot you?
Que
Member
iamkris
Hmmm, I wont even comtemplate rebutting that reply... gunfacts.info... I am almost certain that this is the Brady Campaign site you were referring to...
Hmmm, I wont even comtemplate rebutting that reply... gunfacts.info... I am almost certain that this is the Brady Campaign site you were referring to...
Que
Member
2nd Amendment...
Please tell me, without going to check, what does your second amendment say? I am almost certain, some will misquote it... if they are honest, and didnt check it first.
Please tell me, without going to check, what does your second amendment say? I am almost certain, some will misquote it... if they are honest, and didnt check it first.
Gator
Member
Don't be silly, guns are made to save lives, and put food on the table.
Que
Member
Zero_DgZ
With statements like that, you just really show your intelligence... I didnt say ban weapons, nor did I moan about killing. You really do need to read with greater depth of understanding!
My interest in purely academic, and slanted to illegal trafficking. I am not interested in if you own a gun, or an armoury of guns.
However, if ONE of your weapons are stolen and a kid (or indeed, anyone) dies, I do expect you to be man enough to face the consequences thereof for not locking up your weapon, and for being negligent.
With statements like that, you just really show your intelligence... I didnt say ban weapons, nor did I moan about killing. You really do need to read with greater depth of understanding!
My interest in purely academic, and slanted to illegal trafficking. I am not interested in if you own a gun, or an armoury of guns.
However, if ONE of your weapons are stolen and a kid (or indeed, anyone) dies, I do expect you to be man enough to face the consequences thereof for not locking up your weapon, and for being negligent.
Que
Member
Gator
That is a good use too - but still requires killing...
I am not disputing if the killing is good or bad...
That is a good use too - but still requires killing...
I am not disputing if the killing is good or bad...
Yes, they are made for killing. They are also made for putting food on the table, busting clay birds, target shooting, and just killing a pleasant afternoon plinking cans.
I've owned guns, fed a growing family, won shooting matches, busted a lot of clay birds and tin cans over the last 6 decades, but never have harmed a single person.
Oh, I also have taken my flintlock to school by invitation, so that kids could learn how our forefathers stayed fed, stayed alive, and stayed free.
I've owned guns, fed a growing family, won shooting matches, busted a lot of clay birds and tin cans over the last 6 decades, but never have harmed a single person.
Oh, I also have taken my flintlock to school by invitation, so that kids could learn how our forefathers stayed fed, stayed alive, and stayed free.
HonorsDaddy
Member
Que
Most of us don't have to look up the 2nd Amendment to quote it verbatim:
A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.
27 simple words, written in 18th century English, which essentially distill to "Don't even think about it".
Few other things for you:
1) The gunfacts link you were given has nothing to do with the Brady Campaign, other than to really irritate them
2) Many people here likely assume you are anti-gun due to your first post. That one wasn't exactly designed to win friends on a pro-gun board.
3) While i cannot tell you what brought others to their beliefs on RKBA, personally i arrived at my decisions by objectively reviewing the data from both sides. In the process i learned a very interesting and telling fact: The anti-gun position uses few facts, a lot of self-generated statistics, implications, hyperbole, out-of-context quotes, and emotional pleading. The pro-gun side seems to just throw the facts out there and suggests you draw your own conclusions. It has been my experience that people who aren't afraid of the facts, are usually the ones in the right.
Most of us don't have to look up the 2nd Amendment to quote it verbatim:
A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.
27 simple words, written in 18th century English, which essentially distill to "Don't even think about it".
Few other things for you:
1) The gunfacts link you were given has nothing to do with the Brady Campaign, other than to really irritate them
2) Many people here likely assume you are anti-gun due to your first post. That one wasn't exactly designed to win friends on a pro-gun board.
3) While i cannot tell you what brought others to their beliefs on RKBA, personally i arrived at my decisions by objectively reviewing the data from both sides. In the process i learned a very interesting and telling fact: The anti-gun position uses few facts, a lot of self-generated statistics, implications, hyperbole, out-of-context quotes, and emotional pleading. The pro-gun side seems to just throw the facts out there and suggests you draw your own conclusions. It has been my experience that people who aren't afraid of the facts, are usually the ones in the right.
HonorsDaddy
Member
Que (part 2)
You said
Question: Why should one be held responsible for the negligent and/or criminal actions of another who used his stolen property?
Can you name a single other object you would hold to that standard? Can you name ANY object held to that standard by any government anywhere in the world at any time? I know i sure as hell cant.
If it is stolen from you, it is out of your control. By what possible logic do you conclude that the victim of a theft is somehow liable for misuse of his stolen property? I really would love to know how you wrap your brain around that. Before you respond - substitute "car" for "gun" and tell me if it would make sense.
You said
Question: Why should one be held responsible for the negligent and/or criminal actions of another who used his stolen property?
Can you name a single other object you would hold to that standard? Can you name ANY object held to that standard by any government anywhere in the world at any time? I know i sure as hell cant.
If it is stolen from you, it is out of your control. By what possible logic do you conclude that the victim of a theft is somehow liable for misuse of his stolen property? I really would love to know how you wrap your brain around that. Before you respond - substitute "car" for "gun" and tell me if it would make sense.
HonorsDaddy
Member
Que (part 3)
You said:
By mentioning it the way you did, the implication is you believe killing is a negative.
Perhaps this is merely a language differential, but in all honesty, i really do not believe so.
You said:
If you're not disputing it, why bring it up?
By mentioning it the way you did, the implication is you believe killing is a negative.
Perhaps this is merely a language differential, but in all honesty, i really do not believe so.
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