Cali rumor. True?

[lawson4]

I was told by someone that should know, that "there is an new law in California that any handgun proposed to be sold in
that state must have a unique feature.

The gun must have an identifier as to whether or not it is loaded. This
feature must tell the casual observer (not necessarily a gun person) from a
distance of 2 ft the status of the gun in terms of loaded or unloaded.

Any truth to it? I haven't seen anything.

lawson4

 

[General Geoff]

All guns are loaded, no question about it. I don't know what California is thinking, but any loaded chamber indicators or other features that tell you if it's loaded can and will fail, and result in someone's death due to negligence.

You can always tell from a distance of two feet the status of a gun. It's loaded, always.

 

[DDrake]

I can see it now....


Police: Sir do you have a weapon
Criminal: Ah in my pocket, let me slowly pull it out
Police: Oh, I see the handle is blue, its unloaded ....
Criminal: Yep its unloaded,

::Bang Bang::

Criminal: Oh, I am sooo good
Anti-Gun Liberal: I don't understand, how could an uneducated criminal bypass a security device .... this is impossible ... criminals aren't able to make rational decisions on how to kill. We need more gun control.
Another Liberal: But first we must give the criminal a hug, because his acts are socities fault and therefore he shouldn't be placed in prison.
Anti-Gun Liberal: Yea I know, if people didn't have guns ... they wouldn't kill each other...... like the good-old-days when war, violence, rape, murder, and robberies didn't exist.
Another Liberal: Lets smoke some pot

 

[pax]

Yes.

California laws now require either a loaded chamber indicator, or a magazine disconnect, on all new handguns sold in the state. As of next year (year after next?), the law will require both a loaded chamber indicator and a magazine disconnect.

All you non-Californians reading this and getting ready to say, "I'll never live in California! That doesn't affect me!!!" -- I want you to realize that this is one very obvious instance of California's laws affecting the rest of us. Gun manufacturers are designing their firearms around state laws, especially laws from populous states like California. You might not vote for those laws, but they do affect what is available for you to purchase, too.

pax

 

[RTFM]

Yup PAX.. also see the crazyness in Mass. also.

 

[Jorg Nysgerrig]

It's not exactly a new law, it passed 4 years ago. It is just coming into full effect now.

Here are the requirements for the loaded chamber indicator:
http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/regs/final_text.pdf?PHPSESSID=299013924939d929440f7f88476ac725

(c)(1) Commencing May 22, 2006, the DOJ-Certified Laboratory shall conduct the required testing of a center-fire semiautomatic pistol only after ascertaining the firearm has a functioning chamber load indicator or a functioning magazine disconnect mechanism.
(2)
Commencing January 1, 2007, the DOJ-Certified Laboratory shall conduct the required testing of a center-fire semiautomatic pistol which accepts a detachable magazine only after ascertaining the firearm has both a functioning chamber load indicator and a functioning magazine disconnect mechanism.
(3)
Commencing May 22, 2006, the DOJ-Certified Laboratory shall conduct the required testing of a rim-fire semiautomatic pistol which accepts a detachable magazine only after ascertaining the firearm has a functioning magazine disconnect mechanism.
(d)(1) A functioning chamber load indicator must meet all of the following conditions:
(A)
Explanatory text and/or graphics either incorporated within the chamber load indicator or adjacent to the chamber load indicator is/are permanently displayed by engraving, stamping, etching, molding, casting, or other means of permanent marking.
(B) Each letter of explanatory text must have a minimum height of 1/16 inch.
(C)
The explanatory text and/or graphics shall be of a distinct visual contrast to that of the firearm.
(D)
The “loaded” indication, that portion of the chamber load indicator that visually indicates there is a round in the chamber, shall be of a distinct color contrast to the firearm.
(E)
Only when there is a round in the chamber, the “loaded” indication is visible on the firearm from a distance of at least twenty-four inches. When there is no round in the chamber, the “loaded” indication must not be visible.
(F)
The text and/or graphics and the “loaded” indication together inform a reasonably foreseeable adult user of the pistol, that a round is in the chamber, without requiring the user to refer to a user’s manual or any other resource other than the pistol itself.

You can always tell from a distance of two feet the status of a gun. It's loaded, always.

So, how do you clean that always loaded gun of yours? How about dry-fire practice? You certainly can't do that with and always loaded gun.

 

[mljdeckard]

I'm going to CA for 1 year on orders, and I'm not taking my guns with me. This is a good example of WHY.

 

[orionengnr]

Just one case in point:
New Ruger MkIIIs come with both a loaded chamber indicator and a mag disconnector. Care to guess why?

 

[ugaarguy]

All you non-Californians reading this and getting ready to say, "I'll never live in California! That doesn't affect me!!!" -- I want you to realize that this is one very obvious instance of California's laws affecting the rest of us. Gun manufacturers are designing their firearms around state laws, especially laws from populous states like California. You might not vote for those laws, but they do affect what is available for you to purchase, too.

pax

Pax, you're dead on. It's the same situation for cars. Auto makers have been forced to spend untold sums of R&D money to make cars that pass California emissions. The R&D costs get spread over the entire model line so all consumers pay more because of California's requirements.

So now it starts with guns.

 

[CWL]

I don't remember what year the stats were from but I had previously posted where 1/3 of all handgun sales went to CA.

Because of this, y'all better believe that major gun manufacturers are taking this seriously. CA accounts for a serious % of revenue.

Fortunately, the easiest way to adhere to this law is to drill an 'indicator' hole at the chamber of the barrel so a brass cartridge would be clearly visible. Too bad the necessary graphic/text will FUGLY-up the pistol.

 

[lawson4]

Thanks for all of the replies. I wasn't sure my friend had it right.
lawson4

 

[torpid]

Y'all outside of CA are missing that feeling of absolute safety we get when we look at our "list approved" oh-so-safe handguns.

So very safe.
Ahhhhh...



Except you fellow "safe & sane" folks in Mass.

 

[Titan6]

Thank goodness they are finnally doing something for the 'I am so stupid I don't know when the gun is loaded' gun owner. This will prevent untold numbers of deaths of people who did not know the gun was loaded. And now people will have another reason to sue gun makers when they can swear up and down the gun indicated it was not loaded and that is why someone is dead. I tell you those Californian's think of everything.

 

[10-Ring]

yes - loaded chamber indicator & magazine disconnect

 

[Old Fuff]

In the highly unlikely event that I visit California can I have these required accessories fitted to My Smith & Wesson pre-Model 10??? :banghead:

 

[Mandirigma]

Y'all outside of CA are missing that feeling of absolute safety we get when we look at our "list approved" oh-so-safe handguns.
So very safe.
Ahhhhh...
Except you fellow "safe & sane" folks in Mass.

Nuh-uh I escaped way back when and don't intend to go back!

Actually it was more because cost of living, got tired of working two jobs to pay rent (found out the hard way why some apts were so cheap) and bills, then having to pick up sidejobs for play money.

 

[Whirlwind06]

So does that mean there is/will be a 1911 style pistol with a mag disconnect and a loaded chamber indicator?

 

[TexasRifleman]

So does that mean there is/will be a 1911 style pistol with a mag disconnect and a loaded chamber indicator?

Well contrary to Pax's statement above, there have been a good many firearms makers that have told California to take a big leap into the deep.

I suspect that will continue. Some will cave in, some will hold out.

For the smaller makers especially, it costs more to re-tool a factory than they would lose in sales to California.

As far as 1911's you might see a Sig or S&W change them, but I doubt it.

 

[SaxonPig]

AFAIK this law* only applies to semi-auto pistols. We might see a resurgence of interest in revolvers as many auto designs (like the 1911) join the long list of guns prohibited in CA.

The only manufacturer I know of who ever told CA to stuff it was Thompson-Contender who refused to submit their guns for testing in the drop test extortion plot run by Sacramento. I guess it's hard for a manufacturer to write off a market that is 10% of the country's population. We'll see if this latest bit of un-Constitutional crap from the CA Gun Gestapo runs off any gun makers.

*I prefer to think of them as "Infringements" rather than laws.

 

[glockman19]

It's my understanding that if it's on the approved list now it will stay there. they're only talking about new models not older ones for example the Colts, Kimbers and Springfields that are now approved for sale in CA will continue to be available until the date they come up for reapproval then they will have to qualify under new rules.

 

[hksw]

Yeah, I hear they want them to eventually be like this.

 

[torpid]

Yeah, I hear they want them to eventually be like this.

Very funny, except I can count at least 3 hypothetically future bannable features in that pic if things really went that way.

 

[GunNut]

So i'm guessing that the folks in Cali will be limited to only 1911's with external extractors that can easily have a loaded chamber indicator added to them?

No more Baers, Wilson Combat or other high end custom 1911's?

Sucks for you guys..... and the rest of us since our prices will go up with less demand.:banghead:


Steve

 

[jojosdad]

The only manufacturer I know of who ever told CA to stuff it was Thompson-Contender

Ronnie Barrett has also refused to deal with CA because of the ban on .50 cal rifles. The LAPD uses his .50 as a sniper rifle; they tried to send some back to him for maintenance and he told them to forget it.
Yup - I feel ever so much safer here - everyone knows that the 11th round in the magazine is the one that's lethal. :banghead:

 

[Kruzr]

There is so much misinformation about these laws that it's almost frightening. Reading this thread is not much different than reading that blood will flow in the gutters once the AWB expired.

You can buy the same new guns today and next year in California that you could three years ago. This silly law only applies to brand new guns submitted for testing. Once a gun goes through the testing, it is on the list and the maker pays $300 a year to keep it on the list.............the same way it was initally put on the list.

When a maker wants to sell a new model or add a model to the list, then it must undergo testing (if it isn't just a cosmetic change to an model on the list.) If it's a cosmetic change, then it's just the fee required to get it listed.

California legislators did not invent FP blocks, LCI's, or mag disconnects. These were all invented and put into production by various gun makers who must have thought they were needed long before there were any laws addressing them. The ignorant Calif. legislators simply looked at what was on some guns and thinking they are like catalytic converters for cars, just passed a law saying......add these on from now on.