Calico Rifles? Who? what?

[kd7nqb]

So I walked into a new gunshop that I just discovered about 2miles from my house and was mostly there to look around. The staff was super knowledgeable and new alot about what they had but they had a smaller than average selection. I saw they had a few Kel-Tec pistols so I asked "Hey do you have one of those Sub-2000 Carbines?" the owner said no but we have a carbine that will blow that kel-tec away and it comes with a 100round mag. At this point I was very happy 100rounds of 9mm could be a fun yet expensive adventure.

He hands me a Calico Liberty and began explaining this helical magazine. He also said they were made in Hillsboro Oregon, which sounded cool since its so close to me.

However I have never heard of this maker, never heard of a helical mag and from the sound of it, sounded like it could jam really easy.

1. Does anybody hear own one?
2. Do other manufactures use helical mags? If not why?
3. Any reason why this would "blow that Kel-tec away" other than the fact that cost 2x as much.

 

[wideym]

I had a Calico 9mm rifle in the 90s. It looked like some cool spacegun and the dealer went on and on about it being the future of weapons. The M900 had a retractable stock, 50 round mag, compensator, and k grip. The first 200 rounds fired great with good accuracy for a carbine in 9mm. Then the mag broke. Cost 189 dollars to fix. Then the firing pin broke. Cost 75 dollars to fix. Then the buttstock started to have problems extending. Then the mag broke again. Traded it to a guy for a Remington 700 during the Clinton gun ban. I hated it but he wanted it BAD. Probably because you could'nt get one anymore. Calico 9mm's remind me of TEC-9s in regard to dependability. As far as I know the company went out of buisness years ago during the ban.

 

[max popenker]

Looks like Calico LWS is back in business - check their new website here: http://www.calicolightweaponsystems.com/

 

[SDC]

I hope they've fixed the mag problems; the first versions were known for breaking the mag spring right where the spring took a 90-degree turn into the follower, leaving you with a mag that had no spring power. A good idea, but only if they can get a reliable mag for it.

 

[zoom6zoom]

They made a pretty neat little .22 based on the same design as well.

 

[4v50 Gary]

Wrote an article on it many years ago for a British magazine. The design was very clever, but the materials selected for the magazine could have been better. The plastic magazine could fall apart and break if dropped on a hard surface. This precluded it from any sort of military service.

The action is delayed blowback with locking rollers - just like the HK-91 or MP-5 smg. It's almost ambidextious and the bottom ejection makes it very comfortable for lefthanders. It field strips in seconds and reassembles quite easily.

I didn't care for the collaspable stock. It worked, but extruded aluminum isn't the most durable stuff around. I'd prefer a bullpup design for that gun.

Oh, the helical magazine was first used on the Evans rifle of the 19th Century. There's one or two at the National Firearms Museum in Fairfax, Virginia. That same magazine was then used on the F-86 Sabre. So, Calico was not the first but the latest application in small arms designs to utilize that type of magazine.

 

[Shipwreck]

Yes, they are back after the ban disappeared. I have a lot of polymer handguns, and a PS90, which is 1/2 polymer.

I have looked at the Calicos for years in pics, and always thought they were kewl. I picked one up a few weeks ago at the local shop - they feel SO, SO cheap. Blew away my interest I've had for years in wanting one.

 

[Justin]

I've handled them a couple of times, and thought the construction seemed chintzy.

 

[Father Knows Best]

There's a .22LR Calico for sale in the THR classifieds right now: http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=298618

 

[jerkface11]

The Russian Bizon AK-based subgun is the most recent use of the helical mag. I'm pretty sure it didn't catch on either.

 

[max popenker]

jerkface11, you right. In fact, Russian SpetsNaz requested it to be reworked back to box-mag feeding in the form of the Vityaz PP19-01
Also, there were few experimental subguns with helical mags, designed in 1960s, and neither caught up too.
Reason? The simpler the mag, the easier to make it reliable; and if the mag is unreliable - there's no point in entire gun, unless it is single-shot

 

[Redheadedstranger]

I had a Calico .22 back when they first came out. I was pretty young, but all I remember is sitting in the floor spending what seemed to be an eternity loading the mag (I think my dad liked the fact that it kept me occupied). We then would go out, fire 2-3 rounds, clear the stoppage, then fire 2-3 more, etc. I think the mag was designed so that it did take as long to unload as it did to load so you felt better about the ordeal. Kind of left a bad impression.

If they have improved the quality, it would be a pretty cool firearm. However, not something a would pay a chunk for.

 

[Oleg Volk]

One of my students made their new web site. In his defense, Calico folks picked the least nice of his designs. They are under new ownership, so quality may have improved.

I'll have a chance to check out .22 and 9x19 versions in a little while and post photos.

 

[Domino]

Calico's are an interesting design that deserves at least some merit. I wouldn't pay $600+ for any rifle in 9mm, it just seems silly when cheaper weapons will effectively do the same thing. When they do go back into production I'm guessing the market for them will be the same or less as it was before the Clinton Ban.

To be honest, I'd rather have my Kel-Tec. The expensive 50/100 round magazines don't really appeal to me when I can cheap 15/33 round magazines that work great and can be used in my Glock too. Plus my Kel-Tec is lighter, smaller and probably more accurate since it has better sights and a longer radius (mine shoots about 4moa.) Than kind of firepower is not really an advantage in a semi-auto carbine and "maybe" only a slight advantage in a SMG.

 

[MIL-DOT]

back in the mid 80's, an uncle of mine had the .22. we went ouit back i pulled the trigger till i got bored,handed it back still loaded and said "cool!!" seriously, felt like it would shoot all day,never a jam. of course, i never loaded a mag, or shot it again, but till this day i've had a good impression of them.

 

[M2Pilot]

I've shot several hundred rounds thru a .22 calico with no problems. Not a great gun but fun in my opinion.

 

[gtmerkley]

how good are these