California .50 Ban WE NEED HELP!!!

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50 Shooter

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Latest news that I just received today, the LACC will supposedly have public hearings on the .50 ban on the 29th of April. Here's the text of what I received. ***Even if you don't live in CA, please send a fax or letter***. I know this is long BUT I wanted to include all the info that I have.

LOS ANGELES CITY COUNCIL AGENDA
TUESDAY, APRIL 15, 2003
JOHN FERRARO COUNCIL CHAMBER, ROOM 340, CITY HALL - 10 AM

...

ITEM NO. (27) - Motion Required
03-0002 - S33

COMMUNICATION FROM CHAIR, RULES, ELECTIONS AND INTERGOVERNMENTAL
RELATIONS COMMITTEE relative to supporting Assembly Bill 50
(Koretz) and similar legislation to regulate .50 BMG rifles.

Recommendation for Council action, pursuant to Resolution
(Miscikowski - Weiss), SUBJECT TO THE CONCURRENCE OF THE MAYOR:

RESOLVE that the City include in its 2003-04 Legislative Program
SUPPORT of Assembly Bill (AB) 50 (Koretz), as well as federal
legislation, which requires the registration of .50 BMG rifles and
includes the .50 BMG rifle under the assault weapons law.

Fiscal Impact Statement: The Chief Legislative Analyst has not
completed a financial analysis of this report.

...


see http://lacity.org/clk/councilagendas/ND10154.pdf for complete agenda
==============================================


***** Not that this next part is any more amazing but the hearings in Sac. will be on the 29th ALSO!!! I'm sure they planned it this way, kind of like a divide and conquer. If you can make it to either one GO! Here's a link to the re-rewritten State ban for AB50 http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/pub/bill/asm/ab_0001-0050/ab_50_bill_20030410_amended_asm.html

Please send another fax or another letter to each, use the info that's been posted. Here's the Safety Committee's info also.

Assembly Public Safety Committee
P.O. Box 942849
Sacramento, Ca. 94249-0001

Fax # 916-319-3745

==============================================

Here are some pointers when writing a letter.
• The Fifty Caliber Target Rifle has been around in California for 20 years, and there has never been a single incident of anyone being killed with these rifles in Los Angeles, California, or any other state in America for that matter.

• The Fifty Caliber Target Rifle was designed for civilian competition, and since 1985 such competition has been governed by the Fifty Caliber Shooters Association (FCSA), which hosts matches and the National Championship for fifty caliber target shooting.

• The LA City Ban on .50 BMG seeks to prevent what doesn’t exist – There never has been a person who has used a 50 caliber target rifle as a sniper rifle to kill anyone in Los Angeles or California, but hundreds of competitive shooters will become ‘overnight felons’ and see their sport outlawed if LA City is allowed to ban the 50 BMG.

• The LA City Ban can make no claim to serve the needs of public safety, since there has never been a death related to the very firearms it seeks to ban – The ordinance seeks only to ban the lawful ownership of firearms used in shooting sports competitions.

• Residents of Los Angeles deserve real measures for public safety. Ask them what they would rather have their City Council doing – tracking down some of the tens of thousands of missing sex-offenders they have lost track of or banning a gun that has never killed a single person in California or all of America?

• The reason the fifty caliber target rifle has never been used to kill anyone in Los Angeles or elsewhere is that it is ridiculously unsuitable for crime:

1. The guns are large and impossible to conceal, at nearly five feet long, with the lightest weighing more than three times that of an average hunting rifle.

2. The Fifty Caliber Target Rifle is one of the most expensive firearms ever made. A criminal could buy over a dozen handguns for the price of just one fifty caliber target rifle.

3. The Fifty Caliber Target Rifle is accurate only in the hand of the world’s most trained shooters, and then most often only in the competitive setting where shooters take the time to measure wind, temperature, altitude and distance.

• The 50 Caliber Target Rifle is being attacked by one of America’s most radical and extremist anti-gun organizations. This ban on the 50 is promoted by the same group that wants to ban all handguns, end Olympic Competitive Shooting and shut down public shooting ranges. The Los Angeles City Ban represents the fringe of the extremist anti-gun agenda and is not a reasonable or credible effort to improve public safety.

==============================================

SAMPLE LETTER

Dear Council Member __________,

I am writing to express my opposition of your proposition to ban the
sale or
possession of the .50 caliber rifle and/or ammunition. I am sure you
have
already been made aware of the fact that the .50 caliber rifle has
NEVER been
used in a crime in California or the entire United States.
Furthermore, the
likelihood of these rifles ever being used in a crime is extremely
unlikely
considering their average weight is 25-35 pounds and overall length is
34-50
inches making them impossible to conceal and too cumbersome to carry
around.

The .50 caliber rifle was designed and is used for civilian
competition. A
decision to ban these rifles would not benefit society in any way. We
urge to
respect the rights of honest people and oppose the .50 caliber ban.

Sincerely,

Your Name
****************************************************

L.A. CITY COUNCIL MEMBER NAMES AND FAX NUMBERS

All 213 area code

District # tele# fax# Councilmember room #

1. 485 3451 485 8907 Ed Reyes 410

2. 485-3391 680 7895 Wendy Greuel 430

3. 485 3486 485 8988 Dennis Zine 405

4. 485-3337 624 7810 Tom Labonge 480

5. 485 5013 687 7406 Jack Weiss 440

6. 485-3357 847 0549 Ruth Galanter 475

7. 847 7777 847 0707 Alex Padilla 465

8. VACANT

9. 485 3351 473 5946 Jan Perry 420

10. 485 3323 485 9829 Nate Holden 455

11. 485 3811 473 6926 Cindy Miscikowski 415

12. 485 3343 473 6925 Hal Bernson 460

13. 485 3353 613 0819 Eric Garcetti 470

14. 485-3335 847 0680 Nick Pacheco 425

15 485 3347 626 5431 Janice Hahn 435
 
Here's another sample letter for ya.

I am writing to express my opposition of your proposed ban on sale or possession of the .50 caliber rifle and/or ammunition. I am sure you have already been made aware of the fact that:

-- There is no legitimate reason to ban it – no legitimate reason other than either hype or grossly misinformed or unethical propaganda,

-- The .50 caliber rifle is not different in any meaningful way from a whole series of other rifles that seem to enjoy your support, and more importantly, that are protected by the 2nd Amendment, as the courts increasingly find , e.g., 458 Winchester magnum, 460 Weatherby magnum, and many others. It is unethical at best, dishonest at worst, to claim otherwise. 50-caliber does have somewhat more energy than those other guns, but that is hardly an honest reason to ban it – unless one intends to gradually ban all rifles, for there will always be one rifle that carries more energy than the remaining ‘non-offending†rifles.

-- Though the cartridge itself remains in its early 20th century configuration, it is untrue to claim that 50 caliber is somehow a newcomer to the scene. Caliber 50 rifles, and larger powerful calibers, were used in the 1700’s by the Founders of the Republic and by their contemporaries, and 50 caliber rifles were used in the more modern versions in the late 1800’s by both the settlers and by the Indians to make mile-long shots, and they were used by Theodore Roosevelt in the early 1900’s in his hunting expeditions to Africa, as his letters attest. In short, 50 caliber has been around for a couple of centuries. Any surreptitious implication or an overt claim to the contrary is an egregious and shameless lie.

-- The reason why the military has exhibited interest in the military use of the 50 caliber rifle for sniping and for hard target interdiction, as in Iraq, is because of all the development work that has occurred in the CIVILIAN shooters’ community, both with respect to the rifles and specific precision, target ammunition. These facts are verifiable. Any claim to the contrary is an egregious lie.

-- This rifle does not meet any crime-control criteria earlier deployed: it is not small or concealable, it is not a junk-gun, it is not readily portable, it is not a ‘weapon of choice of criminals, it is not cheap, and typically it does not fire many rounds. Hence Senator Feinstein had listed a 50 caliber gun as being exempt from her 1994 Assault-weapons ban. Are we trying to fight crime or disarm the law-abiding?

-- Last but not least, the 50 caliber rifle has NEVER been used in a crime in California or the entire United States – not that criminal behavior should stake out the perimeter of laws that apply to the law-abiding. Furthermore, the likelihood of these rifles ever being used in a crime is extremely unlikely considering their average weight is 25-35 pounds and overall length is 34-50 inches making them impossible to conceal and too cumbersome to carry around.

The .50 caliber rifle was designed and is used for civilian competition. A decision to ban these rifles would not benefit society in any way. We urge to respect the rights of honest people and oppose the .50 caliber ban.

Honest politicians do not pass dishonest laws, and they don’t encourage the citizen to ignore them both.

Sincerely,
Your Name
 
I made a mistake, there is NO hearing on the 29th at L.A. City Hall. There WILL be a hearing on the 29th in Sacramento on AB50. L.A. CC is passing a resolution in support of AB50, if you sent letters don't worry. L.A. hasn't finalized their .50 ban yet.

Like I said, if you can make it GO! If your out of state you can still help, send a letter or fax.
 
the .50 caliber rifle has NEVER been used in a crime in California or the entire United States. Furthermore, the likelihood of these rifles ever being used in a crime is extremely unlikely considering their average weight is 25-35 pounds and overall length is 34-50 inches making them impossible to conceal and too cumbersome to carry around.
Click to expand...

You have your heart in the right place, but I think you are shooting gunowners in the feet with this argument. You have implied that it is OKAY to ban classes of guns which ARE used by criminals.

In essence, you have agreed to let the gun banners frame the terms of the debate.
 
The point being made is that .50's are to big to be used for anything other then target shooting. One of the points made by Mark Ridley Thomas on the L.A. CC was ".50's are the gangbangers weapon of choice"! Give me a break! Where do they stick it, down their pants?

Also, if they can say a .50 can do this or that, they can attach that to any other rifle, pistol... It doesn't matter which one your talking about, they want them ALL banned! When I went to the first hearing by Koretz, they had a .50 round, .30-06 and a .223. When we asked "where is it going to stop?", the guy said "We just just want the .50". When we asked him "what makes the .50 more evil?", he couldn't come up an answer! When Tom Diaz (who was there speaking) was asked "How many crimes have been commited in CA with a .50?", you should have seen him stumbling for an answer. Like I said, they don't care, they want them ALL!
 
Sorry I posted this information here, moderators feel free to pull the plug. Now I know why there are so many :cuss: gun laws, gun owners can't come together and help each other out!!!

Go ahead and tell me some more reasons why CA sucks!
 
Dude, since California doesn't care what Californians think, why do you think letters from people in other states would matter in the least?
Don't be mad at me, be mad at yourself and the rest of California for allowing that state to become the cess pool that it has become. ;)
 
Regardless of what you think, there are those of us that are fighting. Why would I be mad at myself? I know I'm doing something!!! There are alot of people here that are fighting also, should they be mad at themselves?

The reason for other people from out of state is like this, IF THEY PASS IT HERE, THEY WILL TRY FOR YOUR STATE NEXT!!!
 
50 Shooter; I'll do my best to get a letter out to each one of those council members tomorrow. Dunno if they'll listen to a guy from VA, but every voice we can raise counts.

BTW, here is a list of info for the council, including e-mail.

http://www.lacity.org/council.htm
 
Thanks NF,
To save you some time, skip the LACC for now. They are just passing a resolution supporting AB50, their .50 plans are still in the works.

The place to send letters or faxes is to the Public Safety Committee, use the ones supplied above. This is what they use to count the actual "pro" or "cons" for a bill.
 
I won't be writing a letter; I don't live in the state. Getting a bunch of letters from out-of-state folks will only convince the pols of an "evil" NRA-sponsored plot and not really be too effective anyway, since these folks aren't the ones voting for them.

California folks, writing to Kali pols are the only ones who matter, unless you are a celebrity (sad, I know). Still, even folks from outside a particular town or county won't do all that much, since, again, they didn't vote for the scum in that locality.

Might I suggest, unfortunately, that this is rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic? Writing to hostile politicians who make no secret of their anti-gun views, who count on a core liberal electorate that sympathizes with these views, does little. California gun owners need to stop writing letters to zealots and start organizing so they make an electoral impact. The ballot box is the one and only place to resolve the issue, for the short term. Letter writing can be effective only on the undecided or the wavering opposition/supporter.

Perhaps, instead of facts, should you still feel compelled to write, make a point that you will do everything possible to ensure that any pol voting for this crap doesn't get re-elected, starting with convincing family, friends, and co-workers, then moving on to social organizations that you belong to, like Boy Scouts, VFW, Elks, church, etc. Overall, employing "six degrees of separation" to grow numbers of people you have evangelized both for your point and against the pols who don't share your views.
 
Kalif .50 ban

50-shooter - Has the NRA expressed an interest in attending this hearing? I'd assume they're going to be represented there? Could someone who attends the hearing please post the results? or a pointer to where they're posted?

Something to keep in mind if you plan on attending this (or other) hearings. Wear a tie, sport coat and shirt.
 
Oh, sorry, my bad.
You seemed angry that no one was coming to your aid, obviously I am mistaken. :D

As for my state, we have already shot down the same laws that were allowed to pass in California.
We have open carry, shall issue CCW and just recently our state supreme court ruled that gun manufacturers and dealers are not responsible for the actions of the purchaser of the weapons they sell.
So the"Domino Theory" you are proposing is flawed, not all states are as lost as California, nor will they ever be.

Good luck with your fight, just don't rule out moving to another state as an option.
 
I do believe that California needs help.

It's just that you are so obviously beyond aid that the triage says that the resources are better expended on those who might live.

Sorry.
 
Hmm... but someone could use a .50CAL to rob a stop n rob.. :rolleyes: :barf:

I know that is the arguement made by Diane Frankestein, etc.. et al.. I'm just curious how someone who can afford a $5K rifle and like $2.00 a round, is doing robbing a liquor store.

Also, as there isn't any crimes I know of have been committed with a .50CAL..

That means, if there is a law passed in the PRK regarding the .50CAL, it should be that EVERY citizen should own one!! It reduces the crime rates!
 
Today is the last day, send a fax in if you haven't yet. Send it to the Public Safety Committee's # for it to be counted into public record. You don't need to write a long letter, just "please show this as my opposition to AB50" will do.
 
After reading posts like:
I do believe that California needs help.

It's just that you are so obviously beyond aid that the triage says that the resources are better expended on those who might live.
Click to expand...

and

Sorry Bro, there is no help for California, it is too far gone into communism.
Click to expand...

I wonder which is worse: our enemies' persistence and idiocy, or our friends' apathy.
 
Nic:

You're a medic, as of the military combat type, and you carry limited resources to care for your people.

You have two patients, neither of which can be evacuated.

One has a round through an arm or leg. He'll probably lose the limb, and it'll take all of your time and resources to save him, but it is possible.

You have one who's taken "n" rounds through the abdominal cavity, including the severing of the spinal cord. You can help him to be comfortable, but it'll take all of you time and resources, and, given that you can't get him out, you can't save him.

Everybody in the unit is your problem, you love them all, but what would you do?

I don't like it at all, but I'd save one rather than lose both.

That's about as graphic, if you can understand the context, as I can get. And, as I said, I really am sorry.


Given that things are that bad, though, when do you people start to shoot back?

And, if you don't, and if the PRK east movement is real, when will we have to?
 
Given that things are that bad, though, when do you people start to shoot back?
Click to expand...

I think he is trying!

You know,just a little help once in a while instead of
the usual comments would be nice.Everyone makes a big deal
about how this is The High Road and people are expected to act
accordingly,except apparently when it comes to Californians.
Its really beginning to sound like a broken record.
Do people really think that we Californians don't know what
to do and that being told to move a thousand times will
suddenly make us see the light?
Do you really think the people that hang out here vote for the
leftist politicians?
Come on now.
There may be a day when I do move,but I'll make that decision
thank you.

Sorry for the rant,I'm just tired of being treated like the redheaded stepchild.

QuickDraw

P.S.
I vote,write letters,make phone calls,send faxes,send e-mails,
talk pro-gun any chance I get,member NRA,CRPA,GOA.
 
Last edited:
QuickDraw-
Thank you. I feel the same way... I get sick and tired of hearing about how California sucks and how I should move.

benewton:
Given that things are that bad, though, when do you people start to shoot back?
Click to expand...
I'm confused, here. You say that we're not worth the time and effort to fight for because we're a lost cause, yet we should "shoot back"?
And like QuickDraw said, it seems to me that 50Shooter is already trying to "shoot back" by posting here and trying to gather support.
 
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