CCI Small Rifle Fail to Fire

[Nature Boy]

The rifle is a Savage 12 BVSS. I believe the picture is a bit deceiving. In person both primer strikes are the same, close to center and no different than all the others that went bang.

As far as not fully locking the bolt. I guess it's possible but not likely.

If both fire when I get back to the range I'll assume I didn't fully seat the primers when loading them. That seems like the most logical conclusion

 

[hdwhit]

...Review your primer storage and loading procedure.

There's a separate, active thread in which I report 100% realiablility of primers stored in garages (i.e. no climate control) in both northern Arkansas and North Texas for more than 30 years.

 

[hdwhit]

Curator wrote:

lubes like WD40 can penetrate into primer pockets and cause misfires.

This is why I don't use WD-40 (or similar penetrating oils) on my reloads or the firearms in which they are shot. This is also one of the reasons why I seal my primers with fingernail polish, as my father, with whom I share reloaded ammunition, does use penetrating oils including WD-40.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Curator wrote:


This is why I don't use WD-40 (or similar penetrating oils) on my reloads or the firearms in which they are shot. This is also one of the reasons why I seal my primers with fingernail polish, as my father, with whom I share reloaded ammunition, does use penetrating oils including WD-40.

Primers are more resilient than given credit. Oil will rarely kill a primer so don't count on that. I also see no reason to seal a primer with fingernail polish or anything else.

Of course you are free to do what you think is best but I would not spend the time or effort sealing primer or bullets.

 

[W.E.G.]

If the ammo specs to correct dimension, and you are consistently having light strikes, the failure has to be in the rifle: headspace, fouling of fire control, out of spec fire control, incomplete battery.

 

[hdwhit]

ArchAngelCD wrote:

Oil will rarely kill a primer so don't count on that.

Here's a link to a site where the OP intentionally exposed ammunition to WD-40 and experienced a 20% failure rate: https://forum.cartridgecollectors.org/t/wd40-killing-primers/10341

Strictly speaking, WD-40 is a solvent, not an "oil", but those technicalities aside, the point is that there is adequate reporting of exposure to WD-40, penetrating oils and other solvents affecting primers (sometimes only temporarily) that it makes sense to avoid exposure to such compounds and where exposure cannot be avoided to take such measures as are appropriate to shield the ammunition from their potential effects.

 

[shooter1]

ArchAngelCD wrote:



Here's a link to a site where the OP intentionally exposed ammunition to WD-40 and experienced a 20% failure rate: https://forum.cartridgecollectors.org/t/wd40-killing-primers/10341

Strictly speaking, WD-40 is a solvent, not an "oil", but those technicalities aside, the point is that there is adequate reporting of exposure to WD-40, penetrating oils and other solvents affecting primers (sometimes only temporarily) that it makes sense to avoid exposure to such compounds and where exposure cannot be avoided to take such measures as are appropriate to shield the ammunition from their potential effects.

Thanks for posting the link! As I mentioned in an earlier post, I soaked loaded ammo for 24 hrs in a penetrating oil (PB Blaster) for 24 hrs, without any sealer on primers or bullets after which they all fired. My conclusions were: Unless primer pockets are oversize, or there is insufficient neck tension, loaded/reloaded ammo is very reliable.
My sample size was three cartridges, which may have not been large enough to be representative. I'd encourage anyone having an interest, try the same test and report back here on results.
str1

 

[Nature Boy]

Does anyone use WD40 for case lube? There seems to be an active thread on "best case lube" running most of the time, and I don't recall anyone saying WD40 is their lube of choice

 

[ArchAngelCD]

ArchAngelCD wrote:



Here's a link to a site where the OP intentionally exposed ammunition to WD-40 and experienced a 20% failure rate: https://forum.cartridgecollectors.org/t/wd40-killing-primers/10341

Strictly speaking, WD-40 is a solvent, not an "oil", but those technicalities aside, the point is that there is adequate reporting of exposure to WD-40, penetrating oils and other solvents affecting primers (sometimes only temporarily) that it makes sense to avoid exposure to such compounds and where exposure cannot be avoided to take such measures as are appropriate to shield the ammunition from their potential effects.

I never said oil (or a solvent) would not cause problems with primers. I was warning about depending on an oil to kill a primer. Your own statement tells us only 1 in 5 fail which makes my point.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Does anyone use WD40 for case lube? There seems to be an active thread on "best case lube" running most of the time, and I don't recall anyone saying WD40 is their lube of choice

I don't know anyone who uses WD-40 as a case lube. I use Imperial Sizing Wax because it's not expensive, a 2oz tin lasts a very long time, is water soluble and most importantly it has never failed me. It just works.

https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item/0007607600/imperial-sizing-die-wax-2-oz

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/519525/imperial-case-sizing-wax-2-oz

 

[Nature Boy]

I don't know anyone who uses WD-40 as a case lube

Exactly. Since I mentioned on post #5 that I use Dillon lube I'm not sure how WD40 became such a prominent part of this discussion.

 

[RussellC]

I've had properly seated CCI primers in LPP fail. I have had Tula SPP fail. Failed 2nd and third strike as well....Haven't had a CCI failure in SRP or SPP. They seem to be a little larger than Winchester SPP, loose pockets with Winchester SPP are usually tight with CCI. I noticed the Tula share this characteristic as well.

Never had a Winchester fail, LPP, SPP, SMP, are all I have used, but I have used 1000's of them in those sizes.

Russellc

 

[RussellC]

I don't know anyone who uses WD-40 as a case lube. I use Imperial Sizing Wax because it's not expensive, a 2oz tin lasts a very long time, is water soluble and most importantly it has never failed me. It just works.

https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item/0007607600/imperial-sizing-die-wax-2-oz

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/519525/imperial-case-sizing-wax-2-oz

+1 on the Imperial sizing wax!!! Have same luck with Lee in a tube type lube, (I dont water it down with alcohol, just a dab out of the tube.) but the Imperial is easier to use, set the open tin close and touch it when necessary.

Russellc

 

[Nature Boy]

LOL! Let's go ahead and turn this into a "Favorite Lube" thread with a sub heading of "favorite polishing media". We could squeeze at least 3 more pages out of it.

 

[MondronT]

Last Saturday I had my very first primer failure ever. It just happened to be a cci BR4??? I tried three times to fire. I pulled that one after getting home (the other 49 of that batch where all fine. After putting on glasses and ear protection I took a hammer to it and BANG! Not sure what caussed the failure.

 

[Hondo 60]

Water - might or might not kill primers.

I once washed 3 rounds 3x and after 4 or 5 days went to the range.
All 3 fired just as if they were never washed.

I've reloaded well over 50,000 rounds.
Half of them were with CCI primers.
While I have had failures with Tula primers, never with CCI.

 

[RussellC]

@ Nature boy: What was said that does make it on topic were the comments about WD 40 possibly ruining primers, what wasn't said was that both Lee's lube and Imperial wax DO NOT ruin primers.

Russellc

 

[buck460XVR]

Shake them to see if you can hear powder inside. It's more likely that you loaded them without powder than having all these dud primers.

You could also weight the rounds and compare to others loaded. With rifle there is enough powder to detect if one is missing powder. Not so with pistol most of the time. With a rifle round, no powder, the bullet normally does not move like a small pistol round. So it's possible that they may not have any powder.

The only primer failure I had fail was missing a anvil, not counting Wolf SP.

Whether there is powder or not, the primer should still go off, if the primer is seated properly and used in a properly operating firearm. Primers have their own fuel, they do not need the powder in the case. Kinda how they work. A primer will still make noise when it goes off without powder in the case and many times, in a handgun, will push the bullet out of the case. Sometimes just a little, sometime actually into the barrel. One needs to seat primers deep enough to preload the primer anvil. One reason I prefer to prime my cases off the press is so I can feel the the primer bottoms out and I know the anvil is preloaded.

 

[RainDodger]

Not sure if anyone said this - it IS possible to crush a primer, especially if you're seating them with a press. You have a lot of leverage there. If you crush it enough, you will break the priming mixture apart. It won't fire, no matter how many times you hit it.

 

[RussellC]

Pulled one of the failures and the primers looks identical to an unfired primer with anvil in tact. That leads me to believe I had not seated them deep enough. I'll save the other two to try and refire them and if they ignite then it's mystery solved



W.E.G,

To answer your question, I measured an unfired M855 round compared to one of the FTF reloads using the Hornady Headspace "Comparator" (nice to have 2 spell checkers: one to get it wrong and you to correct me). Here's the results:



So without the condescending *sighs*, how about educating me and those that would benefit from the information, what does that have to do with this?

Nice contraption there...I need one of those "Comparator" Hornady devices.

Russellc

 

[Nature Boy]

Nice contraption there...I need one of those "Comparator" Hornady devices.

Russellc

They're handy Russell, espically when you're bump sizing the shoulders.

So I went back to the ranges, re-fired the remaining 2 Miss-fires and both fired. Looks like they weren't deep enough

 

[RussellC]

They're handy Russell, espically when you're bump sizing the shoulders.

So I went back to the ranges, re-fired the remaining 2 Miss-fires and both fired. Looks like they weren't deep enough

I have the Sheridan and LE Wilson gauges and thought I would get Wilson's depth gauge that goes with it, but your device looks just as good if not better, and cheaper as well.

Russellc