CCW ammo choice- 9mm Luger

[Lennyjoe]

I’m an HST 147gr when I choose to carry a 9mm.

Same here

 

[BoBo522]

Federal HST 124 +P for me. Before the Craziness I was able to get this in bulk for $0.37/round - normally double that but Target Sports would have a 50% off event three or four times a year.

 

[golden]

I carry FEDERAL HST 124 grain jhp and is it my first choice among 9m.m. ammo for self defense. I also have several hundred rounds of the +P version, but I prefer the standard pressure due to the lower FLASH, NOISE and MUZZLE BLAST. My agency now issues the WINCHESTER 127 grain ammo, but I would not use it if I had a choice. OH WELL!

Funny thing, I was looking for some more .40 S&W FEDERAL 180 grain HST and found it at $70.00 a box of 50. Well, I checked to see if they had any 9m.m. HST and it was $110.00 a box of 50!!!!
I know it is great stuff, but this is ridiculous.
It seems that now that .40 S&W is falling out of favor, you can get better prices on it, than on 9m.m. Since most of my .40 calibers pistols are the same size as my 9m.m. pistols, I may start carrying the .40 cal. again.

OH, AND MERRY CHRISTMAS TO ALL!

Jim

 

[USAdystopia]

Underwood (Lehigh Defense ) Xtreme Defender 90gr@1475fps.

Federal HST 124+P and 147gr HST.

Speer Gold Dot 124+P and 147gr Gold Dot.

Ranger T-Series RA9T 147 gr.

 

[USAdystopia]

The Underwood Xtreme Defender is great in .380, 9mm and 45ACP.

Golden, with the heavy weight clothing normally worn by perps in the colder months, would recommend the +P versions for assured penetration.

 

[Timeless]

Of course, perfect shots would require very little energy to stop someone. Unfortunately, few defensive situations allow for 'perfect' shot placement, and an attacker may be difficult to land multiple hits on. The question, then, isn't whether a caliber can stop an attack with an ideal placement and multiple rounds, but whether it can do it with imperfect placement and however many rounds you're able to land in the circumstances.

Lots of livestock, from what I've heard, are dispatched with a .22LR held up to the proper spot on the head; that's not the same as going hunting an 1,100# animal with a .22LR.

Larry

So I go back to my original reply. Can you provide proof of any self defense 9mm ammo that is not capable in your scenario? Are you arguing against 9mm? Not quite sure where you are going with this.

 

[Buzznrose]

I am curious why some of you shoot up your SD ammo, especially when you are not sure when you’ll be able to replenish it.

I buy and load 147’s (mainly) or 124’s (when I get a great deal on them) in all my 9MM’s, typically Fed HST’s but I have some Golden Sabers and Gold Dots too.

I also used to carry Hornady Critical Duty (135’s) but I passed them on to my daughter. They were good rounds.

My SD ammo lasts me a long time. Every so often, I’ll shoot the round I’ve kept in the chamber of my carry gun, and that one round is replaced. But the few hundred rounds of quality 9MM JHP rarely gets shot.

If I ever ran through or if all my JHPs were stolen (slim chance but still...), I’d load my mags with Speer Lawman 147gr FN FMJ and press on.

 

[Kleanbore]

I cannot imagine any ammo for self defense is going to fail at doing its job.

There have been many such examples.

Have yet to see a video of someone laughing off 9mm rounds.

Thats a rather silly observation.

Of course, perfect shots would require very little energy to stop someone.

How would you define "perfect shots"?

How might the concept impinge upon an energy requirement?

 

[sisyphus]

I use these for sd rounds in 9mm, 45acp and 357

 

[DR505]

I would be fine using any of your ammo choices. I usually carry Critical Duty as that was my service ammo when I retired.

 

[Flatbush Harry]

I have posted this elsewhere here but, when I moved to CO, I called both my local PD and Sheriffs Dept. and asked what they issued to their officers. Both informed me that they used Federal Hydra-Shock and now HST ammo. I use HST in all calibers I carry (9mm 124gr, .40S&W 180gr, .45ACP 230gr). I do use SigSauer JHP in 10mm and in .357 Sig. I use Federal JHP in both .44 Mag and .357 Mag. I try to use either WW White Box or Federal American Eagle for range work.

My logic non the Federal HST in carry guns is that if local LEOs use it to protect their officers and the public, it is a safe choice for me to rely on for my safety and those around me. I have also followed compare studies of personal defense ammo and Fed HST is right up at or near the top.

 

[DT Guy]

How would you define "perfect shots"?

How might the concept impinge upon an energy requirement?

As given in my example, livestock weighing half a ton are dispatched with brain shots from a 22LR; the slaughterhouse has the opportunity to consistently make CNS penetration because of the animals being controlled by fencing and other physical barriers. There are (perhaps true, perhaps apocryphal) stories of Mossad preferring a 22LR for close-up assassination's, targeting the base of the brain.

It takes energy to create penetration, and penetration to strike vital areas. Rounds with little energy can stop someone if they can reach the CNS without having to first transit or deflect bone or muscle, the ultimate example being a shot through the eye socket; it would take little energy, and little penetration to be lethal, but would require surgical precision in placement-a 'perfect' shot.

Those are extreme examples, but it holds true across a range of anatomical points; a shot through the neck into the spinal column takes less energy to create a lethal wound that a lateral shot through an arm, muscle and ribs to reach the heart. Of course, we can't count on 'perfect shots' in the real world of self-defense, so need to choose ammo with sufficient energy to create enough penetration and tissue disruption to be reliable stoppers with less-than-perfect placement.

Larry

 

[orionengnr]

I have a number of 9mm rounds that I carry (or would carry)...currently carrying the Winchester Ranger 127 +p.
Recently bought a bunch of 147 gr HSTs, and as soon as I can run a bunch of them through my Kahr PM9, I will carry them.
That might not happen as long as the current ammo shortages persist...I can shoot my handloads at the range and carry the Rangers with confidence...the HSTs aren't going anywhere.
And I have some Rem GS, CorBon, PBLE, and a few others in reserve.

"If you are accosted and produce a handgun, 93% of the time your assailant will flee."

I'd like to see the sourcing for this quote.
Sounds like it was pulled from thin air, or Joe Biden's a-hole.

 

[Spats McGee]

For years, I've used 124 grain Remington Golden Sabers. With Remington's recent troubles, I will likely be moving to 124 grain Gold Dots.

 

[FL-NC]

No opinion. They will all function in your pistol just fine. Now load one up and move on. In the mean time, try to find some ball to practice with.

 

[Old Dog]

Eh, I have no real preference -- I'm issued both Gold Dots or Fed HST in 124 gr +P; but for personal pistols I've got a huge stock of those as well as Rem Golden Saber BJHP 124 gr +P, Hornady Critical Duty 135 gr +P JHP, and a few cases of Fed Hi-Shok 115 gr JHP as well as the 9BPLE 115 gr +P... All of these are reliable and effective ammo. Heck, even the WWB 115 gr JHPs offer pretty decent performance. There's just some great factory pistol ammo out there these days.

I bought up several 500 and 1000 round cases of Gold Dot and Golden Saber before the last two elections, so I'm probably good for life.

I think the Critical Duty gives me a smidge better accuracy out of my full size SIGs, but the S&W M&Ps like the HST.

Gold Dots to the right, Golden Saber below... oh, and looky there: pre-pandemic pricing...

 

[DR505]

"If you are accosted and produce a handgun, 93% of the time your assailant will flee."

I'd like to see the sourcing for this quote.
Sounds like it was pulled from thin air, or Joe Biden's a-hole.

It has been shown in studies that 80% of the time, 50% of statistics are made up on the spot.

 

[Timeless]

Thats a rather silly observation.

Might be silly but true. No one is shrugging off being shot that's not on some major drug.

And still I wait for evidence of any 9mm self defense ammo not doing its job compared to others. I'm basically skeptical any 9mm SD ammo is THAT much better than another 9mm SD ammo.

 

[Kleanbore]

No one is shrugging off being shot that's not on some major drug.

Not being stopped immediately by gunfire does not mean "shrugging off" being shot..

And still I wait for evidence of any 9mm self defense ammo not doing its job compared to others.

Think about it. For some time, some years ago, 9mm handgun ammunition was considered suboptimal. Today's best loads exceed performance requirements that the older loads could not meet.

I'm basically skeptical any 9mm SD ammo is THAT much better than another 9mm SD ammo.

The performance data are available for your perusal.

 

[Buckeye63]

Im well aware that im not under armed with any quality JHP carry ammunition in my EDC. Whether one of these choices performs better than another in a Gel test, I believe will have little to no noticeable difference in the real world if I do my part. That is because 99.9% of the battle is dependant on quality hits, accurate hits, and quick follow up hits if needed. The other .01% might sway one way or another depending on the type of quality JHP ammunition I choose.

Lets look over my current ammunition options, and see if anybody has any opinions on them.
My EDC is a Glock 19 Gen4 in standard config.

Federal HI-Shok +P+ (9BPLE). 115gr. JHP

Federal HI-Shok (9BP) 115 gr. JHP

Remington Golden Saber Bonded +P 124 gr JHP

Winchester Ranger Service Bonded +P 147gr JHP

The Remington Golden Sabers I carry currently.

I lean toward 40 S&W .. But I do have a few 9mm pistols... in my Shield & Taurus G3 , I picked 124gr HST standard pressure ...
In my Glock 19 & S&W SD9VE Winchester 124gr +P PDX1
But I carry Revolvers 80% of the time maybe 90%
But I have a revolver in 40 S&W

9X19 is amazing round... all these years since its birth .. and still its the “ go to round” for most of the masses

 

[Phaedrus/69]

I carry Federal 147gr +P HST most of the time. Occasionally I'll get ready to get another batch and only be able to find the standard pressure version so I'll get that. Once when that was out of stock I bought the 124gr +P HST. You ask for our choice but really it's just opinion. Quite a few agencies use HST and it seems to have a pretty good track record. I like the fact that it's nickel and it seems to be extraordinarily consistent. It's about the most accurate ammo I have found for my particular sidearms. All modern handgun duty ammo is designed to the same standards although probably not all companies are as successful. I'm under no illusions that any "magic bullet" exists and probably there are lots of loads out there that will do the job about as well, but it works well in my CCW firearms.

 

[Alte Schule]

Remember the mystique surrounding these:

Last I checked a box of 20 was going for $100. About thirty years ago I bought three boxes for my Ruger P89 DC 9 mm. Have a box plus ten left.

 

[Meeks36]

Taking my new ruger lc9 to the range tomorrow and trying out underwood penetrators in it. Dont have enough to give it a proper workout. But enough to make sure it will function in it. 10 boxs of 20. Will burn through at least half. Failing those then federal HSTs 124 grain. Have a few box's laying around. If those fail then speer gold Dot's. If those fail to run properly then ill send it to Ruger.

 

[Obturation]

I don't like golden saber , take this for what it's worth and realize everyone's experience will vary.

Shooting golden sabers (loaded by remington) in 45 acp showed extreme velocity variation from a 5" barreled gun. Like 120 fps difference - that's a lot for such a slow cartridge .
When I tested them in wet newspaper (not ideal, I know) most didn't expand and beyond that they didn't even smash. WW fmj in the same test produced some deformation. I would have thought that if the bullet failed to expand it at least would have smooshed a little, but no.
This doesn't represent anything scientific but it brought me to the conclusion that golden saber is kind of a bottom of the barrel loading from a not so great company. I have had the worst juju from remington ammuntion, including a box of umc that had some of the bullets loaded backwards and some that barely clear the barrel - you could see them flying to the target .

Maybe they're ok if loaded by someone who cares a little bit but ANY ammo with the remington name on it would be about the last thing I'd trust.

Fwiw I like gold dots. I know HST is really popular and is a great bullet but I'm stuck in my ways and use what I know.

Of your available options I'd pick the winchester ranger - that's a good proven bullet.

 

[JeffG]

Im well aware that im not under armed with any quality JHP carry ammunition in my EDC. Whether one of these choices performs better than another in a Gel test, I believe will have little to no noticeable difference in the real world if I do my part. That is because 99.9% of the battle is dependant on quality hits, accurate hits, and quick follow up hits if needed. The other .01% might sway one way or another depending on the type of quality JHP ammunition I choose.

Lets look over my current ammunition options, and see if anybody has any opinions on them.
My EDC is a Glock 19 Gen4 in standard config.

Federal HI-Shok +P+ (9BPLE). 115gr. JHP

Federal HI-Shok (9BP) 115 gr. JHP

Remington Golden Saber Bonded +P 124 gr JHP

Winchester Ranger Service Bonded +P 147gr JHP

The Remington Golden Sabers I carry currently.

I use Winchester Train and Defend Exclusively in my Glock 43.