changing safety on 1911, need advice

[walking arsenal]

im changing out the safety on my springfield 1911 milsepc GI to a safety made by colt.

what steps do i need to follow to ensure proper operation and what kind of effort goes into such a project?

 

[HankL]

Which safety?

 

[walking arsenal]

the thumb safety

 

[Gunsnrovers]

There can often be some fitting and finishing work required, especially when you're dropping in components from other companies. I have been able to simply swap around safeties from gun to gun from the same company, but not from different brands. Remove too much material from the wrong area and the replacement safety is ruined.

First fit the safety without any frame parts to make sure it aligns with the frame holes. Then put the gun back together minus the grip safety and plunger so you can fit the safety and visually check engagement areas and points of interference. When removing material, just 1~2 hits with a file before trying again. It doesn't take much and it's a bit harder to put material back on then to remove it. Don't modify other parts except the safety. Limits any changes to one part and limits your $ liability should you screw up.

It, like a lot of 1911 parts, isn't hard to fit but it is easy to screw up and then you've wasted the part.

When you're done, the safety will prevent the sear from moving. If the sear can still move, it's a do over.

The real gunsmiths here should soon show up to point out my errors and shine light on the darkness.

 

[Bill Z]

Jeff has nailed it, there's very little to add. Here is a pic of where you want to remove the material off of the thumb safety.



You can look through the back of the frame with the grip safety removed and see the engagement of the safety and the sear. It won't even go in until enoguh material is removed.(remember to have your hammer back and everything else in the loewr installed sans the grip safety) I would also remove the plungers and spring from the plunger tube to ease the insertion and removal of the safety, you will be doing it a lot.

Once you get it to where it will go in, mark up the 'pad' with a permanent marker and work the safety a couple of times. It should be stiff. Remove the shiney spot that is rubbed off from the marker a little at a time, I like to use a stone for a smoother surface, until the safety moves easily but still doesn't allow any movement of the sear. A LITTLE goes a LONG way, so take your time, or as Jeff has stated, it's a do over. Peening thumb safeties to stretch the engagement surface is possible but certainly a poor way of doing things and I wouldn't bet my life or safety on it. Best to go slow.

 

[Ship A'Hoy]

After you fit the thumb safety, perform a thumb safety check
a.)Start the check by racking slide and engaging thumb safety.
b.)Pull trigger with thumb safety still engaged. Hammer should not fall.
c.)Now pull the hammer back with your fingers and listen carefukky for a clicking noise. If there is no noise, you’re good to go.
d.)If you hear a clicking sound that is the sear falling back into the hammer hooks. Start over fitting new thumb safety.

BTW the first time I fit a thumbsafety it took two different safeties. If you do a trigger job next and replace the hammer and sear, chances are the current safety won't operate correctly.

 

[walking arsenal]

ok, first somebody better explain in fine detail how to remove the thumb safety.

ive tried and cant seem to get it off.


ive got the main spring housing off and the other leaf spring thingy (technical term) out of the gun.

so far the only thing im sure of is that im doing somthing wrong.

help?

 

[Gunsnrovers]

No offense, but tearing into a pistol and changing safety parts when you don't have a good handle on mechanics just doesn't seem like a good idea to me.

Pick up the Kuhnhausen shop manual on the 1911. Get yourself a little mechanical education before you take a file to metal.

It's well worth having it around if you're going to have a 1911.

 

[walking arsenal]

who said i didnt have any mechanical know how?

i just wanted to know the procedure.

cant be too safe you know.

there may be some small detail im missing and i want to be sure.

 

[Gunsnrovers]

Uh, that would be the part where you said you can't remove the safety and needed some help.

 

[walking arsenal]

you said "you don't have a good handle on mechanics"

I said "says who?"

you said " Uh, that would be the part where you said you can't remove the safety and needed some help."

I say, alright, i'll admit it, i dont have a good grasp on the MECHANICS of the 1911 pattern pistol. Thats why i asked.

my HANDLE on mechanics is fine last i checked.

"what we have here is a failure to comunicate"

 

[Gunsnrovers]

Sorry. Let me rephrase, "tearing into the safety devices of a pistol with which you do not have specific mechanical knowledge may not be a good idea."

I'm pretty mechanically inclined too, but I didn't rebuild the brakes on my Rover without peeking at the manual first. Didn't tear open the tranny without reading up on it either. I know "how" to turn a wrench, but if I haven't done the job before a few minutes reading saves much frustration.

I will assume (and accept all the risk involved) that you are new and/or unfamiliar with the 1911 design. With that in mind, a decent shop manual will give you a good idea on what to do, why you do it, and how to make the changes you want to make.

To remove the safety, cock the hammer and move the safety into the up/engaged position. Then gently tug and wiggle it out of the frame. It goes in and out of the frame from the up/engaged position. The plunger provides resistance which is why you'll want it out of the plunger tube while you're fitting the new safety.

 

[BluesBear]

With the slide removed and the hammer cocked...

raise the safty as high as possible. it will move higher than normal without the slide.

Locate the thumb safety stem that protrudes through the other side of the frame.

Push firmly on the stem while working the safety up and down.

It should begin to move away from the frame.

NEVER and I mean NEVER pry the safety away from the frame.
If you don't break it you will probably bend it. If you are stupendiously lucky and do neither you'll leave a moron mark. (Not to be confused with the infamous 1911 idiot mark)

Bill Z gave good advice on fitting the new safety.

Once it's free you can remove the grip safety.

Pay attention to how the pins hold the guts in place.

Especially the sear/disconnector alignment.

The real secret is to pay attention and go slowly.

After all just look around at the numbnuts who claim to be experts.

Did I mention to NEVER pry it?






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[1911Tuner]

Thumb Safety

Good, detailed instructions on fittng a thumb safety.

While peening and refitting a thumb safety lug was/is an accepted method, it's probably best viewed as an expedient method with cast and MIM safeties,
and a new safety should be refitted as it can be arranged.

For a first attempt...follow the advice and go slow. After 4-5 times, you'll develop a certain "feel" for it and will be able to do the job faster with practice.

After you finish, be sure to run a test to make sure that it's correctly fitted.

Rack the slide briskly to cock the hammer and set the sear and disconnect.

Engage the safety and pull the trigger about twice as hard as normally required to fire the gun. hold the left side of the gun to your ear and slowly
pull the hammer past full-cock...but don't let it hit the grip safety. If you hear a light "click", the lug isn't blocking sear movement, and the safety will need refitting or replacement.

If you don't hear anything, repeat the test again, but listen for the click with
the thumb safety in the disengaged position. If you don't hear a click, you're set.

Luck!

 

[walking arsenal]

well gang i certainly apreciate the advice but murphys law has come down upon me once more.

i took the gun completly apart and found out that...............the safety has already been peened and doesnt fit........(sigh)figures............put the old one back in after oiling everything and the gun seems to work fine.

I will do a live fire test when it gets warmer over the weekend.

oh well, the experience isnt totaly wasted, i learned some new stuff.

one thing i noticed that i havent before, and it doesnt mean it hasnt always been this way, is that the hammer falls from half cock when i squeeze the trigger. cant remember if its sposed to do that or not. I should sleep more.

whats a good function test for a 1911, im only familiar with doing a function test on DAO pistols like the glock, springfield XD and steyr models etc etc.


still learning, im young.

WA

 

[AZ Jeff]

What model of M1911 do you have? On the newer Colt's, (and maybe others as well), the "half cock notch" in the hammer is not really a notch at all, but actually a "shelf". If the hammer has this shelf, one can pull the trigger and the hammer will fall to fully down. (And in theory not strike the firing pin with sufficient force as to ignite the primer.)

Older M1911's have a TRUE half-cock "notch", and the sear will NOT move out of the notch when the trigger is pulled.

 

[walking arsenal]

Its a 2004 springfield armory 1911-A1 GI MilSpec.