Cheapest 1/2 MOA .308

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IMHO, the best value for the fewest greenbacks would be a Savage 110 w/ a Burris Fullfield II 3x9. Is it .5 MOA? Luck of the draw, but it'll be ~ 1 MOA and that should be good enough to practice on until you know you can outshoot the gun. Of course, that'll take more $ in ammo than you put into the rig to begin with, but it's a place to start. Good luck.
 
Are we looking at .5 MOA at 100 yards or further out? My Savage FCPK with a Millet TRS-1 would drop put five shots into one little cloverleaf at 100Y with my handloads but it didn't seem to hold quite that tight the further out I went. Most of that was probably me but that Savage was way more accurate than I was. To shoot up to its potential further out was all about skill, not the rifle at that point and I think more expensive optics and a more stable shooting platform than my shoulder.
 
Cheapest doesn't mean you're going to do it cheaply. And, it ain't likely that you're ever gonna do it with a sporter-weight, off the shelf 500 dollar rifle. 1MOA? Sure. .5 MOA? Stars gotta align just right for that.

But, you can do it, if you're willing to put in a bit of effort, and some more money (just like racing cars). Put a lapped, match barrel on a Savage action - that's cheaper than putting the same barrel on any other action, since you can do it yourself instead of paying a gunsmith to true, install, and headspace it. Put that barreled action in a solid stock, like a McMillan or something. Put some solid mounts and rings on it. Put a good scope on it - this is the only place you MIGHT save some money, because you might be able to get away with something less expensive than a $300 SuperSniper, like a $150 Redfield or Nikon. No, none of those is a Zeiss Conquest, but we're talking about doing this w/o spending the kids' college money.

So, the Shilen (or pick your favorite) barrel = $345, chrome moly match
The McMillan stock = $500, fully inlet, add more money if you have to have a cheekpiece saddle or spacers.
If you already have a donor rifle for the action, then you just have to put it together. If you need to buy an action, or a donor rifle, then you have to add that in. A Stevens 200 rifle is about $300. If you want your rifle to have an Accutrigger, then you have to pay more.
Super Sniper scope is $300, Nikon or Redfield is about $150.
345+500+300+300=$1445 with the Super Sniper, $1295.

That rig will probably get you close to .5MOA, especially if you skim bed the action. That is, of course, assuming that you can shoot half-minute groups.

Not cheap, but definitely doable.

About $1500 bucks.
 
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c-grunt - you are aware there was a .5 moa gun that was built by RWDale here that was around 1k. Several thousand on a rifle may a little bit overkill.

I believe he was using
SSS recoil lug
stevens 200 action
custom bolt face (7.62x39)
Match barrel, don't remember the maker
choate stock with aluminum bedding block
forget the maker of the trigger

He posted pics of <.4 inch groups and I believe he was fairly consistent at <1 inch at 200y
 
Going to the gun shop.. 4 bucks (gas)
Pickup up a Remington SPS Tactical AAC ...700 dollars
Pickup 50 rounds of M118LR or SMK reloads... 20 bucks
Go to the range and pick up a coke at the bar... $3 gas. $1coke
Shooting between 1/4 and 1/2 MOA all day... priceless.

LOL
 
.5 MOA at 100 yards I did that free hand with my 1911 last week.:what:No I realy didn't but a savage 110 action with a aftermarket barrel is usualy the easiest and cheapest way to go.Most importantly is to shoot your gun until you can out shoot it.Then work your way up a good trigger, bedded barrel, good rest good scope, good stock, good barrel.I shoot a savage 110 270 win with a factory barrel had the action and barrel bedded with the factory stock and hopefully a nice nikon to replace my old redfield soon and have yet to out shoot the rifle.Only about 1200 invested in the gun so far on hard parts and about 4000 in ammo and handloading equipment.I can get 1 inch groups out to 200 yards consistantly but the rifle is capable of better and have yet to get a new barrel , or bolt.Most of your money will go into working up handloads not normaly in the rifle.
 
klutchless,
I agree for the most part but with the latest Rem SPS and Savage 110 tactical I find the triggers to be right on. Adjustable too. A bit rough action on the SPS but I don't care and in the end the results speak by themselves.
Everyone knows they both are great baselines and you are right about they are great for upgrades with huge aftermarket but as per these two I am going to leave the Savage untouched and the SPS above might only upgrade the stock. We'll see. That's it.
When the barrel is shot I might replace with the original or with a shilen or a LH/etc.. but I couldn't ask for more on that price range.
 
I have this feeling that if you need to ask that question the limiting factor in .5 moa will be you. And just so you don't think I'm picking on you, I can't do it either!

Otherwise, look at T/C. They seem to have some good value on their new bolt actions.
 
As already stated....every internet gun is a .5 moa gun. Digging though gun classifieds should net you a .5 gun easily....well at least that's what the ads all say.

Example...copied and pasted from another forum.....


Rem 700 22-250 cal. w/Swift 8-32x50 and Harris Bipod
OK, I have to sell my long range Remington 700, 22-250. This rifle is in like new condition, only 20 rounds shot through it while sighted in after being upgraded. She has a beautiful laminated monti carlo style stock, jeweled bolt, glassed action and bedded bull barrel, weaver mounts and rings, Swift 8-32x50 scope w/sunshade and lense caps, Harris bipod and black soft rifle case. All is included, ready to shoot. This rifle will shoot 1/2" to 1" groups at a 1/4 mile and is by far the most accurate rifle I have ever shot. I'm prior service Army, expert qualified and grew up Hunting and long range target shooting so, I know a little something about accuracy. This is an exceptional rifle and meant for taking out and using, not showing off to your buddies in your living room and putting back in the safe. I'm asking $1750.00 OBO (serious offers please) shipped to your FFL, I'll accept Money order, Pay Pal or Cashiers check. If you like, you can pick the FFL dealer in my area, send the payment and I will let him know it has arrived (and cleared) and he can send it out to your FFL dealer. No funny stuff with me, I protect myself and your protecting yourself. I'm working on photos now...
Thanks,
FISHBOY
PICTURES - Rem 700, 22-250
Last edited 08-20-2011 at 09:05 PM.
 
Bone stock Remington SPS Tactical in .308 at 100 yards.

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I feel that considering the technologies available to manufacturers these days, it isn't hard to get a rifle that shoots well. Although my present rifle doesn't have anything on it made by Remington except the receiver, I didn't build the custom rig for increased accuracy. I had it built because I wanted a tighter chamber for more velocity, a smoother bore so that I could shoot hundreds of rounds before I had to remove copper fouling, and I wanted the rifle to maintain its accuracy as the barrel got hot. A Krieger barrel and a good smith gave me these things; but if I got an increase in accuracy, I'm not a good enough shooter to see it.
 
Let us know when you find that $450 half-minute rig.
We won't even count the cost of the rings or the bases in the total cost.

100 yards
Two targets
5 shots each target
Each target fired one right after the other
5-shot groups must measure no more than half-inch, center-to-center

Yeah, I want to see that.
What about a 3 shot group as you described instead of 5. Would that count ? How much easier would it be to shoot .5 moa with only a 3 shot group ?
 
RickMD said:
Agreed. I've owned over one hundred bolt action rifles during my lifetime and the only two factory guns that shot .5 MOA were Remington 40X's. I spend a lot of time at the local club with some highly accomplished riflemen and never saw anyone constantly shoot .5" groups with any factory, sporting weight rifle. The greatest group shrinking device known to man seems to be a computer keyboard.

But, I doubt you'll find any sporting weight custom guns that do that "constantly" either, unless they're in the hands of an extremely accomplished shooter. The trigger puller makes a huge difference when we're talking about 1/2 moa accuracy, and even with a good shooter it is hard to claim that the gun will "constantly" do anything.

There are certainly factory guns that can shoot 0.5 MOA fairly consistently, but I think there is a lot more variation between guns in this pricing category (in other words, two identical guns of a given make/model may result in one that is barely 1 moa, and a second gun that can drive it to under 0.5 moa).

As I've mentioned in other posts, my Tikka T3 regularly (but NOT constantly) shoots half inch 3 or 5-shot groups at 100 yards when I do what I'm supposed to, and it was an $800 off the shelf gun. According to my log book I've recorded groups of this size at least 12 times since I got this rifle last year (mostly 5 shot groups), and the gun has only had about 225 rounds down the pipe total (a lot of which was either during load development, or while shooting at longer range steel without recording group sizes).

I've also known a number of folks who own Remington 700P models that shoot dimes at 100 yards all day long, and I have a friend with a Remington 700 SPS Tactical AAC that will also shoot half inch groups with much more surprising regularity than I would have expected from that "value priced" tactical gun. I know some strong supporters of Savage rifles, but haven't witnessed their performance firsthand.

There are a lot of factors that go into making an accurate shot, and I don't think the true accuracy potential of many guns ever truly gets realized. For example, the Tikka I mentioned above was shooting just under 1" groups with Gold Medal Match ammunition, which is obviously a very popular factory match load. But, when I started handloading that very same bullet I shrunk the group sizes dramatically, and most recently shot two back-to-back five shot groups at 100 yards that measured 0.305" and 0.334" CTC.

But, while my Tikka has been a great shooter, I doubt the company could guarantee that every rifle of the same model would perform as well as mine has (they do, however, guarantee 3-shots into 1" at 100 yards, which is still a nice statement about their rifles).
 
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The criteria used by the NRA in all of their rifle tests is five, five shot groups fired sequentially at 100 yards. Not one group here and another there and certainly not three shot groups.
 
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Thanks to all of you for your input. I think I have decided to wait a few months and save a few hundred more dollars. That said, I don't think I'm going custom or anything close, because I'm not sure the Indian can handle that bow.

Thanks,
Ben
 
The criteria of the NRA is one of many.
3 wholes in rapid fire and get out of there is another one. The most practical in the real world, even including hunting.
There are several reasons why to avoid more shots ...

Train as you fight.
 
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RickMD said:
The criteria used by the NRA in all of their rifle tests is five, five shot groups fired sequentially at 100 yards. Not one group here and another there and certainly not three shot groups.

Well, you bring up a valid point here, which is establishing a uniform set of standards for testing. The NRA may not have the same standard as another organization, or another shooter. If we aren't all on the same page, then it is easy to say that someone is exaggerating a claim that they aren't (incidentally, all of my groups have been witnessed by more than one other shooter, and the targets have been saved).

Personally, I can tell you that I haven't yet shot the 5 back-to-back five-shot groups you mentioned. But, I haven't tried to do that, either, since it just seems like dumping ammo at a project that didn't really have any meaning to me at the time. Maybe my gun could do it, and maybe it couldn't. Maybe I could do it, maybe I couldn't. I don't know, but I can say that in my instance my gun shoots groups of this size on a fairly regular basis, as I explained in detail in my last post (and, I do have the two back to back 5-shot groups in the 0.3's that I mentioned).

The point I was really trying to highlight, though, is that some guns are capable of class-leading accuracy, even if they were "cheap". But, the issue of finding a capable individual within a given model becomes harder. And, other issues such as ammo choice also play a significant role.
 
The criteria of the NRA is one of many.
3 wholes in rapid fire and get out of there is another one. The most practical in the real world, even including hunting.
There are several reasons why to avoid more shots ...

Train as you fight.

Group size has almost nothing to do with fighting...but, since you want to go that route. Benchrest shooting deals with group size and is pretty much the only "fight" that does. 5 shot groups are the benchrest standard. High-power requires an accurate rifle and calls for 10+ shot strings.

3 shots lacks statistical significance. The degree of confidence from a 3-shot group is very low. 7 shots is about the min to get a reasonable degree of confidence.
 
Since nobody has mentioned it yet I'll through my vote in for a Weatherby Vanguard Sub-MOA. They all ship with factory test targets (3 shot groups FWIW) Maybe you can shop around for the best test target. Mine came with a test target of exactly .5 inches and I have found the claim to be accurate. I get 1/2 inch groups at 100 yards somewhat regularly with Federal GMM and when I don't its not because of the rifle. I recently started a load workup with Varget and Sierra 175 matchkings and had some groups at just over a 1/4 inch. I couldn't be happier with the rifle. (Scope is a Leupold Mk 4 10x) In this price range I feel comfortable recommending the Weatherby. Savage would be a good choice as well. Personally I'd choose either of them over a Remington 700 these days. Remington Quality Control seems to be hit or miss the last few years.
 
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helotaxi said:
Group size has almost nothing to do with fighting...but, since you want to go that route. Benchrest shooting deals with group size and is pretty much the only "fight" that does. 5 shot groups are the benchrest standard. High-power requires an accurate rifle and calls for 10+ shot strings.

3 shots lacks statistical significance. The degree of confidence from a 3-shot group is very low. 7 shots is about the min to get a reasonable degree of confidence.

But, of course, nothing is ever set in stone when deciding how one chooses to gauge accuracy. A 3-shot group may provide less statistical confidence than a 7-shot group, but that doesn't mean that you aren't getting valuable information from those groups. If a gun can consistently shoot a .5 inch 3-shot group, group after group, I'd say we could be pretty confident in that rifle's ability to shoot 3-shots into that group size in the future.

In my mind benchrest competitors definitely have the most stringent definitions of accuracy, since their game really does push the limits of such things. In many other disciplines (particularly among recreational shooters who are asking for an accurate gun) a nice 3-shot group meets their definition of required accuracy.

For me, a 5-shot group will do, and for others it counts for nothing unless a 10-shot group is posted!
 
Savage 10 or 110 with some good handloads that the gun likes can probably get you fairly close. Heck, I shot under .5" groups at 100 yards with a stock Savage Model 10 .243 with handloads it liked and the Simmons scope that comes packaged on it from Walmart. Now, they might not all shoot that well, but everyone I've seen has shot well under 1" groups.

Let us know when you find that $450 half-minute rig.
We won't even count the cost of the rings or the bases in the total cost.

100 yards
Two targets
5 shots each target
Each target fired one right after the other
5-shot groups must measure no more than half-inch, center-to-center

Yeah, I want to see that.
The only part of this it would have had a problem with would be the 5 shot groups on each target one right after the other. The barrel seemed to heat up after 5 rounds to the point where you needed to let it cool or groups would start opening up. If you fired a 5 shot group and then let it cool before the next group, I have no doubt it could do this.


That being said, I'd upgrade the cheap scope they come with as soon as you can afford it, but they seem to get you by until you can afford something better.
 
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