Here is a handy recoil table for you. These are common loadings for each chambering.
http://www.chuckhawks.com/recoil_table.htm
http://www.chuckhawks.com/recoil_table.htm
Deer Rifle for a 11-12 year old
- Thread starter lwolford
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For what it is worth, if you handload, you can make just about anything you want.
I have come up with safe published loads for a Mosin-Nagant that range from the recoil of a 22 LR, to the recoil of a .223, to full power.
It's pretty funny when someone pulls the trigger of a Mosin-Nagant, loaded with 12 grains of Trail boss, and can barely hear it go crack.
I have a 20 gauge shotgun, and shooting slugs is one heck of a punch. I wouldn't recommend it for a 10-year-old.
Since I can't stand recall either, I went with 7 mm 08, but commercial ammunition is fairly expensive. The 243 is also a nice rifle. And cheaper ammo.
I have come up with safe published loads for a Mosin-Nagant that range from the recoil of a 22 LR, to the recoil of a .223, to full power.
It's pretty funny when someone pulls the trigger of a Mosin-Nagant, loaded with 12 grains of Trail boss, and can barely hear it go crack.
I have a 20 gauge shotgun, and shooting slugs is one heck of a punch. I wouldn't recommend it for a 10-year-old.
Since I can't stand recall either, I went with 7 mm 08, but commercial ammunition is fairly expensive. The 243 is also a nice rifle. And cheaper ammo.
I'd recommend the good ol 30-30. I think that it is a current trend to try to make the smallest caliber possible work for young kids who want to hunt. When I was that age I would have scoffed at my dad trying to get me to use anything other than what he used which was a Marlin 30-30.
Nowadays no one wants their kid's shoulder to hurt slightly from recoil, or to shiver in the cold on deer stand. Those things are rights of passage IMO. How many kids down through the years grew up to be good shots and good hunters by using the only rifle available, Dad's old hunting rifle?
Nowadays no one wants their kid's shoulder to hurt slightly from recoil, or to shiver in the cold on deer stand. Those things are rights of passage IMO. How many kids down through the years grew up to be good shots and good hunters by using the only rifle available, Dad's old hunting rifle?
Remember that lighter rifles will increase felt recoil, so don't be so concerned about a "short handy" rifle. Also, being a kid, don't underestimate the cool factor. Does a cowboy lever gun tickle his fancy? Is a bolt too old fashioned? Something he takes pride in owning will make him want to practice more. I'm of the mindset of bigger bullet and slower speed, especially with short range. .357Mag, .30-30 and even .44special are all good.
Unfortunately for you, as this thread is indicating, there is a lot more to choose from than caliber!
Unfortunately for you, as this thread is indicating, there is a lot more to choose from than caliber!
sixgunner455
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My son likes the AR, so he got to hunt this year with a 6.8SPC chambered AR. My daughter likes my .243, so that's what she used.
Salmoneye
Member
I started hunting at the age of 9 with a Stevens bolt action 20ga for waterfowl, and a Marlin 336RC in .35 Remington for deer...
Most other kids I know started on .30-30...
Most other kids I know started on .30-30...
rugerman
Member
When my son was 7 he killed his first deer with my Ruger #1 .270, at 8 he used a7 mm mag to kill his first buck. Its been my observation that if there is hair in the scope the gun don't kick!
Have you considered the Handi in 300 BLK? I used an AR in that clambering this year I wouldn't hesitate to reach out to 250 with it after seeing the damage it makes on the 2 deer I saw taken with it. It's becoming a very popular round and over the shelf ammo is more and more available. Think of it as a managed recoil 308 win.
Torian
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Already heard some great recommendations. I echo the following:
1. Lever action .357 (will easily drop deer within 100 yards, easy to handle).
2. If you are set on a bolt gun, go with a .243 (still light on the recoil, but you can use larger rounds that you just won't get with the .223 or 22-250).
1. Lever action .357 (will easily drop deer within 100 yards, easy to handle).
2. If you are set on a bolt gun, go with a .243 (still light on the recoil, but you can use larger rounds that you just won't get with the .223 or 22-250).
Nite Ryder
Member
I wouldn't get him a 30-30 Winchester because of the recoil. But a Handi rifle is the last kind of gun I would buy anyone I wanted to teach about hunting or shooting in general. I would much prefer something with more quality that didn't look and feel like a club. Thompson Contender's and Encore's are single shoot guns and are made very well and something any kid would be proud to own. They can be purchased in just about any caliber you can think of, from a 17 caliber to a fifty caliber muzzle loader.
Palehorseman
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If you can come across a Savage 340 or a Stevens 325 in 30-30, (340 is D&T for scope, 325 for aperture sight only) they are an excellent little bolt action rifle. I took my first deer with a 325 when I was 13, blundered across one in a LGS for $160.00 and snapped it up.
ThomasT
Member
Nice rifle Palehorse. You made me go to GB to check them out. I will have to think about getting one. I really like simple rifles like that.
I have been helping a 15 year old girl get her first deer on a youth hunt through her school. We went a couple of weeks ago and all but two get their deer. She was one of those who didn't see a deer in range.
Like I said she is 15 but just over 5 foot tall. She has been shooting my remington model 7 in 7-08 with reduced loads. I loaded some Sierra 120gr bullets to about 2650fps and she has no trouble shooting those. We are going again on the dec 13th down in brownwood. I really hope she gets a deer. I went to her house a few weeks ago and when I got there she was shooting at a rabbit with a 22. She got him too. I helped skin it and she scraped the hide and salted it. Everyone is saying she is the son I never had. She is a hoot. I love helping young people. I would much rather see a kid shoot a dove or other animal or catch a fish than for me to do it.
And that reduced load pretty much duplicates a 250 savage load. Thats a round I would love to have a rifle chambered for. Some day I will find one.
My two sons love to dove hunt but never had a lot of interest in killing a deer. I guess because they don't like the meat that much they don't have a lot of interest. They don't eat the doves either but like shooting them.
I have been helping a 15 year old girl get her first deer on a youth hunt through her school. We went a couple of weeks ago and all but two get their deer. She was one of those who didn't see a deer in range.
Like I said she is 15 but just over 5 foot tall. She has been shooting my remington model 7 in 7-08 with reduced loads. I loaded some Sierra 120gr bullets to about 2650fps and she has no trouble shooting those. We are going again on the dec 13th down in brownwood. I really hope she gets a deer. I went to her house a few weeks ago and when I got there she was shooting at a rabbit with a 22. She got him too. I helped skin it and she scraped the hide and salted it. Everyone is saying she is the son I never had. She is a hoot. I love helping young people. I would much rather see a kid shoot a dove or other animal or catch a fish than for me to do it.
And that reduced load pretty much duplicates a 250 savage load. Thats a round I would love to have a rifle chambered for. Some day I will find one.
My two sons love to dove hunt but never had a lot of interest in killing a deer. I guess because they don't like the meat that much they don't have a lot of interest. They don't eat the doves either but like shooting them.
MMA1991
Member
Perfect timing for your question.
My 11 year old shot his first deer in East Texas just this past Saturday. He used a youth model Winchester Range Master in .243. Dropped the doe at 80 yards. Hit her 6 inches behind the right shoulder.
To quote George after he pulled the trigger: "That was awesome!".
I highly recommend a .243.
My 11 year old shot his first deer in East Texas just this past Saturday. He used a youth model Winchester Range Master in .243. Dropped the doe at 80 yards. Hit her 6 inches behind the right shoulder.
To quote George after he pulled the trigger: "That was awesome!".
I highly recommend a .243.
Attachments
jack44
Member
A savage axis 243
InertiaDriven71
Member
I'd let him hold and shoulder as many different models as the stores around you have. Fit is just as important as caliber. I'm a bit taller and heavier than average, and even to me a Remington Model 7 or a Winchester M70 Compact just shoulders and feels just right.
If you don't reload, you'll have to buy. Not all ammo shoots well in every rifle. Finding the ammo the rifle likes can take a bit of effort and money. Be aware of twist rates also; a .223 with an 8 or 9 twist is more desirable for deer hunting than a 12 twist, due to stabilizing heavier bullets.
Recoil is hardly ever noticed when shooting the deer, but can make or break a young shooter at the bench. Keep that in mind when zeroing and practicing.
If you don't reload, you'll have to buy. Not all ammo shoots well in every rifle. Finding the ammo the rifle likes can take a bit of effort and money. Be aware of twist rates also; a .223 with an 8 or 9 twist is more desirable for deer hunting than a 12 twist, due to stabilizing heavier bullets.
Recoil is hardly ever noticed when shooting the deer, but can make or break a young shooter at the bench. Keep that in mind when zeroing and practicing.
41 Mag
Member
I'll throw in a couple of things I have found while dealing with my three grandsons, these two quotes are big ones,
No matter what caliber you decide on look for something with a shorter lenght of pull.
Also look into the long eye relief scopes, one offered by Weaver is great and I have two of them mounted up for the kiddo's, just don't remember the numbers off hand and they are not here to look at. Remember a longish stock shouldered by a youth with short arms and not much neck to stretch into the scope isn't going to fit well at all. If it doesn't fit even a lighter recoiling round can induce some not so fun impacts to collar bones and such.
Ammunition is another consideration you should look into before you purchase. Find out what is locally available on a sudo regular basis. If you handload your almost set if you can find you some H-4895, and some mid weight bullets for caliber that will suffice for hunting deer. Say for instance with a 243 the 85 and 90gr offerings might give a touch less recoil than the 100's do, In the 6.5 and 7mm calibers, it would be the 120 - 130gr offerings, and in say .308 those from 125 to 135 would be the ticket. Any of these can be handloaded down to levels which make shooting them pleasant as well as accurate and deadly on game.
The biggest factor as mentioned above is practice. I cannot emphasize this enough. If they are not steady and sure when they get out to hunt the results aren't going to be nearly as good as if they were rock solid in their shot. If they haven't practiced enough they will jerk triggers, squint when aiming just at the wrong times, and sometimes simply close their eyes before pulling the trigger in anticipation of the rifle going off. Even if they know it isn't going to hurt them, they still do so.
I have three grandsons ranging in age from the oldest which just turned 12 to the youngest which is 6. The oldest used my Ruger Compact chambered in .308 to drop his first hog two weeks before his 4th birthday. He held the rifle, he aimed it, and he made the shot all with no more aid from me than setting him up on my knee so he was high enough up to rest the rifle. (This is also something you have to consider as you cannot loo through the scope to help them they must be able to do it on their own and practice to do so.)
My middle one is how can I put this, more talk than he can back up. He really does want to hunt and shoot, but he doesn't like the recoil, or the amount of noise when the trigger breaks. I have had him in both ear plugs and ear muffs, to counter the noise, and he only wants to shoot one round or two at most from his .243 with as light a loads as I can get away with.
The youngest, heck he'll jump in behind my .308 with full tilt loads once, but then he is done. With the lighter .243 loads he is good for about half a dozen but he simply isn't big enough yet to fit even the smaller Compact rifles. I guess we don't call him "Tank" for no reason.
Anyway, you need to keep the fit of the rifle, and the eye relief of any optics you purchase as a top priority as well. IF it fits, and has enough eye relief, it will make shooting even something with a bit of a kick MUCH easier on them, and they will be much more accurate, and enjoy it more as a result.
No matter what caliber you decide on look for something with a shorter lenght of pull.
Also look into the long eye relief scopes, one offered by Weaver is great and I have two of them mounted up for the kiddo's, just don't remember the numbers off hand and they are not here to look at. Remember a longish stock shouldered by a youth with short arms and not much neck to stretch into the scope isn't going to fit well at all. If it doesn't fit even a lighter recoiling round can induce some not so fun impacts to collar bones and such.
Ammunition is another consideration you should look into before you purchase. Find out what is locally available on a sudo regular basis. If you handload your almost set if you can find you some H-4895, and some mid weight bullets for caliber that will suffice for hunting deer. Say for instance with a 243 the 85 and 90gr offerings might give a touch less recoil than the 100's do, In the 6.5 and 7mm calibers, it would be the 120 - 130gr offerings, and in say .308 those from 125 to 135 would be the ticket. Any of these can be handloaded down to levels which make shooting them pleasant as well as accurate and deadly on game.
The biggest factor as mentioned above is practice. I cannot emphasize this enough. If they are not steady and sure when they get out to hunt the results aren't going to be nearly as good as if they were rock solid in their shot. If they haven't practiced enough they will jerk triggers, squint when aiming just at the wrong times, and sometimes simply close their eyes before pulling the trigger in anticipation of the rifle going off. Even if they know it isn't going to hurt them, they still do so.
I have three grandsons ranging in age from the oldest which just turned 12 to the youngest which is 6. The oldest used my Ruger Compact chambered in .308 to drop his first hog two weeks before his 4th birthday. He held the rifle, he aimed it, and he made the shot all with no more aid from me than setting him up on my knee so he was high enough up to rest the rifle. (This is also something you have to consider as you cannot loo through the scope to help them they must be able to do it on their own and practice to do so.)
My middle one is how can I put this, more talk than he can back up. He really does want to hunt and shoot, but he doesn't like the recoil, or the amount of noise when the trigger breaks. I have had him in both ear plugs and ear muffs, to counter the noise, and he only wants to shoot one round or two at most from his .243 with as light a loads as I can get away with.
The youngest, heck he'll jump in behind my .308 with full tilt loads once, but then he is done. With the lighter .243 loads he is good for about half a dozen but he simply isn't big enough yet to fit even the smaller Compact rifles. I guess we don't call him "Tank" for no reason.
Anyway, you need to keep the fit of the rifle, and the eye relief of any optics you purchase as a top priority as well. IF it fits, and has enough eye relief, it will make shooting even something with a bit of a kick MUCH easier on them, and they will be much more accurate, and enjoy it more as a result.
BoilerUP
Member
My eldest is 3, and I thought about this topic a lot while in stand this year.
It'll likely be a rifle he can grow with, a Savage or AR15 platform. I have found (gasp) 77gr bullets from a 223 is ample medicine for Kentucky whitetail and likely will start him there, as my first deer rifle at 11 was a 270 and it honestly was way too much gun for me. Other possibilities would be 6x45 or 6.5 Grendel, or a downloaded 260 with 100gr bullets.
Regardless of caliber, significant range time will happen before stepping foot into the deer woods...and if he shoots the mouse gun best, thats what he'll hunt with as shot placement trumps everything.
It'll likely be a rifle he can grow with, a Savage or AR15 platform. I have found (gasp) 77gr bullets from a 223 is ample medicine for Kentucky whitetail and likely will start him there, as my first deer rifle at 11 was a 270 and it honestly was way too much gun for me. Other possibilities would be 6x45 or 6.5 Grendel, or a downloaded 260 with 100gr bullets.
Regardless of caliber, significant range time will happen before stepping foot into the deer woods...and if he shoots the mouse gun best, thats what he'll hunt with as shot placement trumps everything.
Hokkmike
Member
Go with a 6.5x55, .260. .257 Roberts, or 7mm.08. It will be the rifle for now and forever.
Because of the need for super critical shot placement I would avoid the .222, .223, .22-250, and even the .243 for deer. That being said, even with the "middle calibers" he needs to be able to hit what he is shooting at. But they will be fun and not punishing to practice with.
Because of the need for super critical shot placement I would avoid the .222, .223, .22-250, and even the .243 for deer. That being said, even with the "middle calibers" he needs to be able to hit what he is shooting at. But they will be fun and not punishing to practice with.
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