Everything AUG

[Zangetsu]

I tried to get some questions answered by reviving an old post, but for some reason people don't seem to think that information 5 years old is still good

Anyway, with the new US AUGs rolling out, I decided to poke around and see what I could find on the torture tests that the originals were put through some twenty odd years ago, and much to my surprise, I couldn't finsteyrd a damn thing other that people talking about how reliable and rugged the Steyr AUG was, and how terribly the foreign cloning programs were. That's great and all, but I want to hear some numbers! Tell me exactly how tight your groups are at what distances and with what ammo. I want to learn everything about the original that I can from someone(s) who actually have owned/worked with (or still do) one...every last little detail. I have a ton of questions and I'd love to get asking on them, but I'll wait to see if some good info is posted first (it might answer many of my questions before I even ask them).

So yeah, anyone up for discussing ALL the merits and pitfalls of this weapon system?

 

[TexasRifleman]

Anyway, with the new US AUGs rolling out

They are on the shelf there, right next to the Shrikes......

 

[Zangetsu]

Wow, thank you for that productive and insightful information. The FACT of the matter is, MSAR has been shipping theirs for a few weeks now, so quit the neigh saying, because it's happening. Also, I'm reasonably sure that the TPD AXR will be rolling out before the year is out, and just like that, we've gotten nowhere on the topic which I asked that we'd discuss. :banghead:

I want to know why I should buy an AUG, and I want to know why I shouldn't, and scarcity and price are not an issue because they really don't matter; look long and hard enough and eventually you'll find what you want, and for me, that's not a problem.

I want to know the good stuff, so can anyone tell me exactly how a Steyr AUG performs in as many environments as you can? I'm especially interested in how it fairs in sandy places...

 

[Tyris]

This is one of the reasons I have one on order from MSAR.

AUG's full 20" barrel smaller than 10.5" SBR'd AR15. I've always though that SBR was the wrong approach compared to bullpups if the goal was compactness. AUG retains bullet velocity and is still handy, AR15 not so much.

-T

 

[PercyShelley]

From personal experience handling one, I know the following:

The AUG is not particularly lefty friendly. Even after slipping in a left-ejecting bolt, you will find that the charging handle is still on the left side. The charging handle is terribly important, as it is also a forward assist and bolt release.

The switchology of the front end of the AUG is rather more complex than the M-16/AR-15 series. Along with that all important charging handle, the gas valve adjustment, vertical grip lock and release and barrel quick change are all within inches of each other.

From talking to that rifle's owner, I gathered the following:

The rifle runs more reliably with a little less lubricant than most are used to.

Probably not as rigorous of information as you were looking for.

Check the AR15.com thread on the MSAR-556, the first few were shipped and I believe that there is a range report on it there.

 

[El Tejon]

Shot one a lot in the late '80s. Difficult weapon to manipulate. E.g., I like having the magazine out in front of me so I can keep the well and the threat in front of me.

I think if you trained with one extensively my concerns would be reduced.

I saw the ad just last week in SAR. I'll reserved judgment on the quality until I handle one.

I said I would buy some if they actually came out (I cannot believe ATFE is permitting this weapon to be made). Looks like I'm good for a few.

 

[TexasRifleman]

The FACT of the matter is, MSAR has been shipping theirs for a few weeks now

Compared to the people that have put money down they are WAY behind, which is why I compared it to the Shrike. And I am one of them. They have had $1000 from me for quite a while.

Given the problems they had with the initial run I may be glad I don't have a rifle yet anyway.

If you have information that the rifle is shipping IN QUANTITY I'd love to hear it. As of 10/8 they were still trying to get back most of the original batch they shipped to make repairs. No repaired rifles had gone back out and the few that had shipped they had UPS return undelivered for something else.

http://www.msarinc.com/repair.html

That and the fact that Pete Athens has terminated his relationship with the company and given no reason why. Maybe it's nothing, but it may be a red flag too. Since no one is talking it makes you wonder.

As recently as Oct 2 a letter went out to some owners asking for their 30 rd magazines back for repairs, that letter was sent by Pete then all of a sudden he's gone.

I certainly hope they can make it work, it's great to see a company try something so bold but it's a VERY hard thing to do but 250 rifles shipped is not a lot especially since they have asked for all of them back.

From everything that's out there it seems that the company is doing everything it can to make it work, but it's too early to say this venture is a success.

 

[Tyris]

My take is that the 30 rnd mag is OK, and the letter was a mis-diagnosis of another problem. The stock was made a few thousandths too small, causing difficult insertion, pinched mags and making the follower hang up. This was the source of the FTF jams. They have also smoothened the feed ramp to help feeding.

Ejector spring has been beefed up and is reported to have fixed the failure to eject.

MSAR has been on the ball and been open and upfront. My black STG556 rifle ships tomorrow, I'll call them for a shipping number and will post pictures when it gets here. Early pictures showed fit and finish better than any Steyr AUG I've handled. One thing is for certain, Microtech really knows how to machine some metal, they've gone from beautiful knives to beautiful guns.

Regarding the complaints about left/right handedness, I suppose the same could be said of the FAL, HK-9x, XCR, or any gun with a lefty charging handle. I suppose AKs are more lefty friendly? Anyhow I've always thought the charging handle at the back of the receiver on the AR was counter intuitive and clumsy, plus it allows a nasty blast of gas in your eye when shooting suppressed

I am curious as to what the thread is under that flash hider. I'm going to toss a silencer on that sucker as fast as I can

-T

 

[Zangetsu]

Thanks for the info so far....I'm glad I'm not a south paw, but I can feel your pain...or at least pretend I do Anyone know of any torture tests?

 

[Zangetsu]

I meant torture tests on Steyr's AUG, not one of the new ones (I don't think anyone's crazy enough to break a rifle they just got ). Hopefully that's what was holding up the discussion here...I can't believe I'm the only one interested in something like this

 

[ftierson]

If I had my druthers, I'd be more willing to torture test one of the new ones than the original AUG that I have...

For those of you lefties out there, keep in mind that the Steyr black M16 mag stock that CDNN is currently offering (to allow M16 mags to be used instead of the proprietary Steyr synthetic mags) is designed exclusively for right handers, with the left hand ejection port cut in the stock filled in (solid) and unusable...

I hope that this 'new' version of the AUG works out well...

Forrest

 

[daniel (australia)]

They were trialled pretty extensively against the M16A2 by our Government in the mid-1980s. Testing included all the usual torture, such as immersion in mud, leaving out in the weather, operating under water, in sand etc. They were even driven over by trucks and continued to work. I was only very peripherally involved but as I understand it there was little to choose between the two on this test regime, and the final decision to adopt the AUG involved a few other considerations including the fact that we would get the licence to make it locally.

There were a few teething troubles with the first ones made at Lithgow but these have long been sorted out and there have been about 70-odd thousand made there.

I finished up before they actually went into service, but I understand that the soldiers are pretty happy with them. It must be admitted that our 4RAR Commando and SASR blokes often seem to be using the M4 - but probably because of its modularity with the Picatinny rails more than anything else.

 

[Zangetsu]

So how did the platform compare to the M16A2 in these tests? Did it pass all of the debris tests? I'm curious about the sand test in particular because I have not heard anything about that yet. Thank you very much for the info though.

 

[HorseSoldier]

I finished up before they actually went into service, but I understand that the soldiers are pretty happy with them. It must be admitted that our 4RAR Commando and SASR blokes often seem to be using the M4 - but probably because of its modularity with the Picatinny rails more than anything else.

I know a couple guys in the Australian military (who seem well read on stuff, but are not SASR or 4RAR) that the preference for the M16 and then M4 for those guys had to do with the Steyr or AUSTEYR proving less reliable then the AR-15 pattern weapons in certain operating environments. (Been years since the conversation, but my recollection is that it was specifically swampy and/or amphibious kind of environments.)

 

[Silvanus]

I can't say much about it, I've never shot one so far. But a good friend of mine has used one extensively in the army. He sais he's never had a malfunction and that it is a very accurate rifle at up to 300 meters. He also likes it because it's relatively compact (compared to other rifles with the same barrel length) and lightweight. He sais it's very durable too (that surprised him, he's not really a gun guy and didn't know much about "plastic" weapons). Most of the other guys like it too. I hope that's the information you're looking for

 

[Zangetsu]

I know a couple guys in the Australian military (who seem well read on stuff, but are not SASR or 4RAR) that the preference for the M16 and then M4 for those guys had to do with the Steyr or AUSTEYR proving less reliable then the AR-15 pattern weapons in certain operating environments. (Been years since the conversation, but my recollection is that it was specifically swampy and/or amphibious kind of environments.)

See, here's where I was hoping to shed some light on the subject by hearing it from someone who has actually used this platform in environments like this, because a friend of the family has one (that he has trusted with his life) and said that he's fired it wet, in, and under water and has never had issues, but didn't know how well it would work in the sand, citing that that new HK416 that still works after being completely filled with sand would probably take the cake. But that's another subject...anyone have some personal experience operating an AUG in much less than ideal environments?