Full Auto implications? (Ohio)

[whm1974]

What legal hassle?

Let's see, all the paperwork you have to fill out, the fact that the ATF can come by at anytime...

Nothing's illegal unless you're caught. The best way to not get caught is to keep your %$#! mouth shut. Your buddy hasn't figured this out.

Or doing something else that draws the notice of the ATF or police.

Where will he shoot his unregistered MG? The local rifle range? Hmmm . . .

I always wonder about that. Personnally if I had an illegal firarm I'll make sure I'm not seen in public with it. Then again I wouldn't have illegal firearm to begin with.

-Bill

 

[VirgilCaine]

Nothing's illegal unless you're caught. The best way to not get caught is to keep your %$#! mouth shut. Your buddy hasn't figured this out.

If he buys an "off the books" full auto, odds are the seller is either a government agent or a paid informer. In either case your buddy would be in deep you-know-what.

Where will he shoot his unregistered MG? The local rifle range? Hmmm . . .

Considering the downside of acting on his wants, your buddy is not the sharpest knife in the drawer.

The obvious solution is to rent the legal version of the gun you want to convert, learn to shoot it well...of course, I wouldn't be inclined to do this since semis are as good as full auto, in pretty much any situation.

He'll obviously be caught quickly, what with him talking about it to people.

 

[shortydog]

Originally Posted by Molon Labe
It is illegal to own a machinegun that isn't registered per the National Firearms Act of 1934. But it is not unlawful.

Uh-huh. Ok, thanks for clearing that up ...

so you agree with the
Firearms Act of 1934 ?

 

[444]

Try 13% per year on average. Do that with your mutual fund)

I bought a Sten tube gun for $3250. I sent it to a guy and paid him $1100 to use the tube to make me a Sterling. I see Sterlings in the last Shotgun News I bought, built by the same guy for $7900. That is a pretty good gain, virtually over night.
But you are right, it is such a hassle. You wouldn't be up to it.



"Let's see, all the paperwork you have to fill out, the fact that the ATF can come by at anytime..."

Two totally false internet rumors in one sentence. Repeated over and over on this board. However, that doesn't make them so. Now I would agree with those that say that machine guns are expensive. I don't believe that they are out of the reach of the average middle class guy, but they are expensive. I bet everyone I know, and everyone I work with owns a TOY that they bought for as much as a machine gun costs. Heck, there are televisons that cost more than a machine gun and I personally know people that own them. A lot of ATVs cost more than my machine gun. A Harley costs more than an MP5 and so does a bass boat. My partner at work has some kind of cool Dodge pickup truck with a Viper engine in it: I could have bought an M2 Browning for what he paid for that and had money left over.

 

[whm1974]

He'll obviously be caught quickly, what with him talking about it to people.

Chances are he wouldn't be discreet about having or using it either.

-Bill

 

[Bubbles]

Let's see, all the paperwork you have to fill out,

Yup, I'll be the first to admit after legally purchasing several full-autos and suppressors, it's a major PITA. Plus, having to give $200 each to FedGov also sucks.

the fact that the ATF can come by at anytime...

This is where I call BS. ATF can not and does not come by anytime to check on your stuff. They do compliance checks on dealers periodically, but that's true for all gun dealers, not just the ones who sell Class III firearms.

 

[444]

"ALL the paperwork"

Two sheets of paper, front an back, in duplicate: total of four sheets. One of those forms requires you to print your name and then sign. The other form is easier to fill out than a "yellow form" that you fill out for any gun purchase. Oh, and ALL this paperwork is on-line in PDF format: you fill in the blanks and print it out. Then you sign and have everyone else sign.
If you consider filling in the blanks on two sheets of paper ALL that paperwork, you must be living in a cave somewhere. Our society runs on paperwork and as paperwork goes, this is short an sweet.
When I bought my house, I did enough paperwork to buy every machine gun ever built.

Don't believe me ?
Rather believe the on-line experts that don't own any titleII stuff ?
Here are the forms that make up ALL the paperwork:
http://www.atf.treas.gov/forms/pdfs/f533020.pdf
http://www.titleii.com/pdf/010205-Form4.pdf

 

[Keith Wheeler]

.... My partner at work has some kind of cool Dodge pickup truck with a Viper engine in it: I could have bought an M2 Browning for what he paid for that and had money left over.

And had something that didn't depreciate as soon as it left the dealers...and would be far more reliable!

 

[Keith Wheeler]

"ALL the paperwork"

...If you consider filling in the blanks on two sheets of paper ALL that paperwork, you must be living in a cave somewhere. Our society runs on paperwork and as paperwork goes, this is short an sweet.
When I bought my house, I did enough paperwork to buy every machine gun ever built.
...

And if you are some 21 year old total NFA noob who always wanted a subgun since you got to shoot that Thompson a couple of years ago, your friendly local dealer will probably help you fill out the Form 4, "so it'll go through the first time."

Sometimes I think the "it's such a hassle" came from the same places that gave us the NFA of 1934 anyway.

 

[444]

Come on people.
Every time I read a thread where someone tries to make the ownership of title II stuff out to be a big deal, I present the other side of the argument.
For those of you that have always wanted a machine gun, supressors, short barreled rifles, short barreled shotguns, AOWs, etc. I am doing away with all your excuses not to go ahead and do it. It is fun. It is cool. It is your right. Live out your fantasies. Most of the stuff you read on-line about how tough it is, is crap.







*There is no point in posting that you live in a place where ownership of these weapons is illegal, or that you live in a place where you can't get CLEO signoff. I know that everyone can't own this stuff. You don't need to repeat it. Just because you can't, doesn't mean it is hard for everyone.

 

[Molon Labe]

Uh-huh. Ok, thanks for clearing that up ...

The difference between illegal and unlawful is crystal clear to me. I apparently made an erroneous assumption that it was also understood by other gun owners.

 

[Zedicus]

One of my coworkers keeps saying he wants to get a full auto rifle without a class 3 license, and several of us have told him that even though we can't cite regulations it surely wouldn't be worth the trouble you would get into. Rather than try to find the laws myself it would be easier to ask you guys. I don't know if there are state laws as well as federal ones.I'm hoping some LEO's on here that can enlighten me so I can convince him that's it not worth it. Thanks in advance!

If you are saying what everyone thinks you are saying, tell your Co-Worker to forget it untill after we Kill the NFA & 89 MG ban, or go the legal route, unless they have a overwhelming desire to spend a number of years as Bubba's unwilling GF.....

 

[KC&97TA]

Either pay the 200 dollar tax and then pay $13,000 for a $700 rifle or go to prison. Too much cash for too many problems, in my opinion. But then I have a fairly low opinion of full auto fire as well.

unless it's belt fed what fun is it anyway

Tell your co-worker he's going to go to jail if he does, and he'll meet Buba in there.

America is a great country, even the taxes are great. Pay the $200 and you can have a machine gun... Non-Resident of CA pay $78 and you can have your AR-15's here and take them out of the home w/o too much harrassment.

I'm partial to the Hell Fire for the AR-15's, $39.99, easy in, easy out... full auto is a great way to just waste ammo and smoke the barrel in your rifle, makes the wallet a bit lighter out of plain stupidity, and a few giggles that last about 4 sec on a 30 round mag. The Marines for the most part only use the semi selection on the M16A2/A4 & M4, I've never had a M16-M41, so I can't speak of the full auto selecability.

I've only been taught one time in over 6 years how to use the 3 round burst, aim for the knees and pray that the next 2 rounds get the abs and chest! I'll admit, I've used "burst" to shoot through doors, while holding my rifle around the corner.

 

[444]

You definitely need to get out more. Marines can't plink.
There is a place where I sometimes shoot where losers dump off their trash: torched cars, home appliances, TVs, computer monitors, beer bottles, there was even a boat there once. Now ordinarily I am a big accuracy fanatic. I love longish range rifle shooting. I don't really enjoy plinking usually. But, when I take my submachine gun out there and start dumping mags on a washing machine or whatever. I can't load mags fast enough.
And all that noise you hear while I am shooting ?
That is the sound of freedom.

 

[saddenedcitizen]

Trying to sidestep the paperwork is a NO-NO

I thought about getting one of these things in the mid 80's and came to several conclusions.
1) expensive to operate
2) expensive to get, now anyway, but at the time saw a MAC 10 with 3 mags and supressor - $225 + $400 in transfer taxes !!
3) WHERE are you gonna play with this thing ( where I live, no way - most ranges won't allow it and 'deserted' land is just too far away)
4) The dealer with the above MAC10 said 2 things - don't take the **** thing as far as your back yard without having the paperwork ON YOU and tell NO ONE you own it !!

'K - so you can occasionally go out and 'empty' several magazines - for me at least, that would be fun for a while but would eventually lose its allure'

So in conclusion, you have an expensive toy that you really can't enjoy all that much.

As for being an invesment - maybe.
Very limited market ( I can sell mutual funds the same day with a phone call )
The 'transfers' could be permanently stopped at ANY time with the stroke of a pen ( Sorry, you gotta keep it - no more transfers - only way to legally get rid of it is to turn it over to the gov't - for free of course !! )

Nah, not a good enough fun/cost ratio.

Finally, anyone who wants to do this without the 'paperwork/expense' is lining up to be in a 'heap o'trouble'.
and if they are telling people that they want to do it this way, they will NEVER keep thier mouth shut about what they've done and how.

Give'm about 38 minutes before the gendarmes haul them away in irons.

Don't believe it ??
Waco started out as an issue over whether or not the transfer tax had been paid !!!!!!

 

[whm1974]

I live in IL so I can't own a Class III weapon or device anyway if I wanted to.

-Bill