Has anyone been checked for 922R compliance?
- Thread starter jwsturr
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I've been unable to find any evidence that anyone has ever been charged with this. If they were, it would likely be in addition to more serious stuff.
No problem using the foreign wood, you just need to juggle some other stuff around so you maintain the correct count. Here's a handy worksheet to help: http://gunwiki.net/Gunwiki/BuildAkVerifyCompliance
No problem using the foreign wood, you just need to juggle some other stuff around so you maintain the correct count. Here's a handy worksheet to help: http://gunwiki.net/Gunwiki/BuildAkVerifyCompliance
Badlander
Member
I had my fal throughly checked over by about 10 deputy sheriffs. (long story)
I had just built it and had no compliance parts in it. (It does now).
They had no Idea about 922R. They did not even ask about the selector switch.
I think if you are in enough trouble that they check your gun out that throughly you aren't getting out of jail any time soon.
I had just built it and had no compliance parts in it. (It does now).
They had no Idea about 922R. They did not even ask about the selector switch.
I think if you are in enough trouble that they check your gun out that throughly you aren't getting out of jail any time soon.
Z-Michigan
Member
I'm not aware of any prosecutions, however the potential penalties are very stiff and I've got better things to do with 5-10 years of my life than sit in a concrete box. And I sure wouldn't advertise in advance if I were planning to disregard it.
Although intended as a ban, 922r has really turned out to be more of a make-work law for US gun parts makers, and frankly has increased the popularity and options for many of the foreign designed guns it was intended to ban.
I agree with RatDrall's comments in spirit, but see first paragraph above for my practical take.
Although intended as a ban, 922r has really turned out to be more of a make-work law for US gun parts makers, and frankly has increased the popularity and options for many of the foreign designed guns it was intended to ban.
I agree with RatDrall's comments in spirit, but see first paragraph above for my practical take.
SCPigpen
Member
Z-Michigan
Member
SCPigPen, the law controls manufacture, importation or re-assembly of a "nonsporting" weapon. It doesn't prohibit possession or ownership. Therefore, if someone else makes a noncompliant rifle and you buy it, you don't have any legal problem with the 922r compliance issue.
However, if you modify a weapon, your modifications must be or remain 922r compliant.
jwsturr, it did no good. Like many gun laws.
However, if you modify a weapon, your modifications must be or remain 922r compliant.
jwsturr, it did no good. Like many gun laws.
nalioth
Member
The ATF has stated that "inserting a magazine" - in their opinion - is "assembling".
FWIW.
FWIW.
MachIVshooter
Member
How do you prove that you didn't do it? ATF isn't known for carrying the burden of proof; Guilty until proven innocent is the paradigm today.
OpenSights
Member
Z-Michigan
Member
Join Date: May 19, 2008
Location: Michigan
Posts: 1,893
SCPigPen, the law controls manufacture, importation or re-assembly of a "nonsporting" weapon. It doesn't prohibit possession or ownership. Therefore, if someone else makes a noncompliant rifle and you buy it, you don't have any legal problem with the 922r compliance issue.
However, if you modify a weapon, your modifications must be or remain 922r compliant.
jwsturr, it did no good. Like many gun laws.
Z-Michigan is online now Report Post Quick reply to this message
Sorry, Gotta figure out the right way to quote here....
Is that for any modification, or just Mag capacity?
Member
Join Date: May 19, 2008
Location: Michigan
Posts: 1,893
SCPigPen, the law controls manufacture, importation or re-assembly of a "nonsporting" weapon. It doesn't prohibit possession or ownership. Therefore, if someone else makes a noncompliant rifle and you buy it, you don't have any legal problem with the 922r compliance issue.
However, if you modify a weapon, your modifications must be or remain 922r compliant.
jwsturr, it did no good. Like many gun laws.
Z-Michigan is online now Report Post Quick reply to this message
Sorry, Gotta figure out the right way to quote here....
Is that for any modification, or just Mag capacity?
Z-Michigan
Member
All the legal actions I've heard of on 922r have been against licensed (FFL 07) manufacturers. How do you prove you didn't make the gun noncompliant? I don't know, and with an abundance of caution you might want to be careful not to buy a noncompliant gun, even though possession/ownership/purchase of it is not itself illegal.
Any modification that affects the "nonsporting purposes" criteria, which includes the type of magazine the gun can take. Some interpretations say that inserting any magazine over 10 rounds makes the gun nonsporting even if you didn't touch anything else. If you want to be absolutely sure (well, as sure as you can be), don't insert any magazine in a gun containing foreign parts other than the magazine it came with. That could make it difficult to get normal usage out of such a gun.
This could easily devolve into 10,000 what-if questions. I would recommend that anyone who's concerned, and that should be almost anyone who shoots, study up on 922(r).
Quentin
Member
Nope, no one's ever raised the question. My WASR was compliant when I bought it but I did cut off the welded muzzle nut. However I screwed on a US made Tapco flash hider so the net effect is no change.
Ditch-Tiger
Member
Quentin,
I'm pretty sure your WASR is now NOT compliant untill you add another 5 US made parts...
I'm pretty sure your WASR is now NOT compliant untill you add another 5 US made parts...
jwsturr asked:
Picture yourself, in a locker room shower, and you're the "prettiest" one of the lot.
It finally dawns on you, that them other boys iz lookin' at chu wit' a lustful eye, an' one whispers in yo' ear, "Me gonna love you long time, babe!" 
You really wanna etch that stock?!
Geno
Picture yourself, in a locker room shower, and you're the "prettiest" one of the lot.
It finally dawns on you, that them other boys iz lookin' at chu wit' a lustful eye, an' one whispers in yo' ear, "Me gonna love you long time, babe!" You really wanna etch that stock?!
Geno
offthepaper
Member
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- 1,446
Simply Put....
It ain't worth the risk.
It ain't worth the risk.
Z-Michigan
Member
It depends. The single-stack WASR is all foreign parts and you would be right. But a double-stack WASR has to have enough US parts to be legally a "US made" gun, and if that's what he has then what he did is probably (?) legal.
As to the 922r issue, I agree it simply is not worth any risk. I have only been able to find one case where someone was charged with violating 922(r). Not surprisingly there were other charges involved.
It is a serious enough crime, and easy enough to comply with that its plain stupid to flout it IMO, even if the risk of prosecution (right now) seems low.
It is a serious enough crime, and easy enough to comply with that its plain stupid to flout it IMO, even if the risk of prosecution (right now) seems low.
OpenSights
Member
jwsturr asked:
Quote:
Has anyone been checked for 922R compliance?
I've been looking at a set of Russian wood furniture for my Arsenal AK. Has anyone ever been questioned if they are in compliance? Couldn't you just write or etch US on the wood? Who could tell?
Picture yourself, in a locker room shower, and you're the "prettiest" one of the lot. It finally dawns on you, that them other boys iz lookin' at chu wit' a lustful eye, an' one whispers in yo' ear, "Me gonna love you long time, babe!"
You really wanna etch that stock?!
Geno
....OK.... thanks for the image.... not sure if I'll make it to the toilet in time.
Quote:
Has anyone been checked for 922R compliance?
I've been looking at a set of Russian wood furniture for my Arsenal AK. Has anyone ever been questioned if they are in compliance? Couldn't you just write or etch US on the wood? Who could tell?
Picture yourself, in a locker room shower, and you're the "prettiest" one of the lot. It finally dawns on you, that them other boys iz lookin' at chu wit' a lustful eye, an' one whispers in yo' ear, "Me gonna love you long time, babe!"
You really wanna etch that stock?!
Geno
....OK.... thanks for the image.... not sure if I'll make it to the toilet in time.
Quentin
Member
Five parts? Why do you think that, D-T? It was compliant when sold then I exposed the muzzle threads but covered them with a US made part. It's a fairly common thing to do now that the AWB has sunset. Of the 16 parts counted 10 are foriegn and 6 are US. 10 foreign does meet the test for compliance.
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Ignition Override
Member
How does a spike bayonet on an SKS make it more dangerous, if you still have the correct ammo?
As with the grotesquely over-bloated FAA, too many lawyers seem to need to justify their existence in other flabby govt. bureaucracies.
As with the grotesquely over-bloated FAA, too many lawyers seem to need to justify their existence in other flabby govt. bureaucracies.
Really aside from LE/Gov executing a search warrant specifically for guns OR being in possession of guns and drugs OR possession of guns while under a protective order: No one really has a right to search the gun for compliance parts.
nwilliams
Member
I always make an effort to ensure my guns are 922r compliant. However I didn't know about 922r until just a couple years ago when I started using firearm forums. In the many years prior to my knowledge of 922r I know that I owned many rifles that were probably way out of compliance.
Those years that I never knew about 922r I was exactly like the millions (maybe an exaggeration) of gun owners that right now don't know what 922r compliance is. I would estimate that only 2 out of every 10 gun owners know what 922r compliance even is and maybe 1 out of 10 have even the slightest idea how many parts are required to make their gun compliant.
I've always felt that unless you are gun importer or you in the business of manufacturing firearms using foreign made parts kits I don't think 922r is something that most people need to be overly concerned about. I honestly can't imagine any individual gun owner being charged with breaking 922r, a gun company/importer maybe. I think unless the ATF really wants to pin a charge on someone then they probably have more important crimes to worry about than whether Joe Smith's FAL has six US parts instead of the required seven.
I'm not saying that people should disregard 922r completely, my feeling on the matter is that if you know about it and can abide by it then you should. However I also feel that if you own a gun and don't know if you have enough compliant parts it's not something you should loose sleep over. While I feel 922r is one one the most ridiculous and absurd firearms laws that exists it is still a law and should be obeyed, if you want to prove that your are a law abiding gun owner then that means abiding by all gun laws no matter how stupid they may seem.
Those years that I never knew about 922r I was exactly like the millions (maybe an exaggeration) of gun owners that right now don't know what 922r compliance is. I would estimate that only 2 out of every 10 gun owners know what 922r compliance even is and maybe 1 out of 10 have even the slightest idea how many parts are required to make their gun compliant.
I've always felt that unless you are gun importer or you in the business of manufacturing firearms using foreign made parts kits I don't think 922r is something that most people need to be overly concerned about. I honestly can't imagine any individual gun owner being charged with breaking 922r, a gun company/importer maybe. I think unless the ATF really wants to pin a charge on someone then they probably have more important crimes to worry about than whether Joe Smith's FAL has six US parts instead of the required seven.
I'm not saying that people should disregard 922r completely, my feeling on the matter is that if you know about it and can abide by it then you should. However I also feel that if you own a gun and don't know if you have enough compliant parts it's not something you should loose sleep over. While I feel 922r is one one the most ridiculous and absurd firearms laws that exists it is still a law and should be obeyed, if you want to prove that your are a law abiding gun owner then that means abiding by all gun laws no matter how stupid they may seem.
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I think this sums it up very well.
In my view, compliance just means not giving the Federal government any reason to take away my rights.
And if that sounds like a dichotomy to you, (as it does to me) thats what gun laws are, an erosion of out rights.
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