"I shot him. ...I can't believe I did this..."

[Fred Fuller]

On the local news last night they played the 911 recording of the call Eliyahu had made while leaving the store and following Pope outside. The thread title is a paraphrase, as close as I can remember to what Eliyahu actually said.

Read and learn...

lpl/nc
===================
http://www.myrtlebeachonline.com/news/local/story/95142.html

Posted on Sun, Jun. 10, 2007
Suspect in beachwear shooting put on house arrest
By Lisa Fleisher - The Sun News

(photo)
Eli Eliyahu, 22, is charged with voluntary manslaughter.

In what was described as a volatile hearing, a judge set bail at $40,000 Saturday for a man accused of shooting and killing another man during an argument in a beachwear store parking lot.

Eli Eliyahu, 22, of Myrtle Beach, who was working at his family's Garden City Beach store, was charged with voluntary manslaughter Saturday and ordered to wear an electronic monitoring device.

Lawyer Tommy Brittain said his client, Eliyahu, does not dispute that he shot Samuel Bradley Pope, 23, of Myrtle Beach, on Friday.

But it was in self-defense, Brittain said.

Members of both families attended the hearing at J. Reuben Long Detention Center.

"It was a volatile situation," Brittain said. "It was the kind of thing that you worry about a little bit."

Pope's family members said they were disturbed by the bail.

"What? That's all? For killing my grandson?" Lloyd Georges, Pope's grandfather, said when he heard. "Good grief. That's nothing."

Magistrate Judge Chris Arakas placed Eliyahu under house arrest, which means he can go to work, do chores such as grocery shopping, and worship, Brittain said. He must also turn in his passport.

On Friday, Pope, known to his family as Brad, went to Jaws Resort Wear with his wife, two children, and other relatives, family members said.

Eliyahu asked the group to leave after the children ran around the store, Georges said. Pope pushed Eliyahu, and Eliyahu called the police, Georges and Brittain said.

Eliyahu came outside to get Pope's license number, Brittain said.

While still on the phone with police, the argument continued and, according to the arrest warrant, Eliyahu shot Pope.

"He was ... defending his property and his person," Brittain said.

"It sounds like a very defendable case."
(snip- follow link for full story)

 

[Fred Fuller]

http://www.scnow.com/midatlantic/scp/news.apx.-content-articles-BTW-2007-06-11-0021.html

Beachwear worker's story told through 911 tapes

Monday, Jun 11, 2007 - 11:28 PM Updated: 08:22 AM

A Grand Strand beachwear worker got out of jail Monday after police say he shot and killed a customer.

It happened Friday morning at "Jaws Resort Wear" on 17 Business in Garden City.

Police say Eli Eliyahu shot and killed Brad Pope in the parking lot of the store.

Officers charged Eliyahu with voluntary manslaughter.

Eliyahu is under house arrest on a $40,000 bond.

News13 obtained the 911 tapes from that deadly shooting in Garden City.

In the tapes, Eli Eliyahu admits to shooting Brad Pope.

Eliyahu says Pope threatened him before Eliyahu pulled the trigger.

Just before 10 Friday morning at the “Jaws Resort Wear” store, one man, Brad Pope lay dying in the parking lot and another, Eli Eliyahu calls 911 for help.

"He started coming at me, I told him to leave the store and I went to get his license plate," Pope told the dispatcher.

Pope's cousin, Christina Ray says she, Pope and the four children they had with them all left the store.

Ray says as they were loading the kids into their car, Eliyahu came out of the store with a gun.

"Me and my cousin were walking around the end and saw him standing there holding the gun, just pointing it at us and my cousin threw his hands up and was like what, you going to shoot me? And the guy was like, (makes gunshot noise) and shot him, just straight shot him and just stood there," Ray told News13.

“Sir, please focus on me,” the dispatcher told Eliyahu.

“I just shot him,” Eliyahu told dispatch.

“Excuse me?”

“I just shot him,” Eliyahu said.

“You just shot him?" the dispatcher asked Eliyahu.

"I have a license to carry, he threatened my life, he already pushed me in the store and he came at me like he was going to punch me and then he came in the parking lot and I went to get his license plate number and he told me to get out of here and then started coming at me and he said I'm going to ******* kill you," Eliyahu told the Horry County dispatcher.

Crystal Ray says her cousin did push Eliyahu inside the store, but Ray says Brad Pope, or his children did not deserve what happened.

"You don't do that; you don't kill somebody like that. You don't take some body's family right in front of them," Ray said.

"Oh my god, I can't believe I did this. I never wanted to pull my gun out; I pulled it out and he kept coming at me. I understand sir; nobody understands something like this. You're right."

At a hearing Saturday, a judge set Eliyahu’s bond at $40,000.

Eliyahu will face a general sessions hearing in a few weeks to have his bond set on the voluntary manslaughter charge.

 

[RubenZ]

Thats all stupid. I think he was wrong in shooting the customer. The threat had already left the store just leave it at that. Why the hell go out with a gun drawn.

 

[buzz_knox]

Why the hell go out with a gun drawn.

The cousin says he had the weapon drawn, the shooter says he drew when the decedent advanced on him and threatend to kill him.

There's too little information to determine whether this was legitimate self-defense.

 

[jlbraun]

Christina Ray (relative of the decedent and unknown criminal history): "Me and my cousin were walking around the end and saw him standing there holding the gun, just pointing it at us and my cousin threw his hands up and was like what, you going to shoot me? And the guy was like, (makes gunshot noise) and shot him, just straight shot him and just stood there"

Eli Eliyahu (CCW holder and verified good citizen with no criminal history): "then started coming at me and he said I'm going to ******* kill you"

Looks like a bit of contradiction here. I believe the CCW'er. Good shoot, IMHO. This man should not serve a day in jail.

 

[oobray]

I'm not so sure either way. I think that the store clerk needs to prove that a reasonable person would have feared for his life. I'm finding it hard to believe that he might have genuinly feared for his life.

I will say this though. It really, really, really looks bad for RKBA people when things like this happen.

 

[buzz_knox]

I think that the store clerk needs to prove that a reasonable person would have feared for his life. I'm finding it hard to believe that he might have genuinly feared for his life.

If the facts are as the shooter alleges:

1. He was physically assaulted by the decedent inside his store.
2. He went out to get the license plate number (probably to file a complaint), which he was legally entitled to do.
3. The decedent, who had already attacked him, advanced on him and threatened his life.
4. He drew his weapon.
5. The decedent continued to advance in the face of the drawn weapon, and may have again threatened him.

We don't know about the differences in age and physical condition between the two or whether the shooter could or couldn't make it back into the store in time.

Assuming that the shooter is credible, it's easy to understand why a reasonable person would believe his life was in danger from an attacker who is advancing in the face of a drawn gun and threatening death. Whether or not this will hold up depends on the believability of the shooter versus the decedent's family, and other facts like ability retreat (yes, I know about the Castle Doctrine but that's not a cure all) and disparity of force.

 

[Biker]

I dunno...you follow a man outside with a gun in your hand and shoot him. Don't look good. It could be argued that the dead boy thought his life was in danger and decided to defend by attacking.

Poor judgement on the CCWer's part, IMO.

Biker

 

[buzz_knox]

I dunno...you follow a man outside with a gun in your hand and shoot him. Don't look good. It could be argued that the dead boy thought his life was in danger and decided to defend by attacking

If we assume the cousin is telling the truth, that is correct. Of course, we have about as much reason to suspect the cousin of lying as we do the shooter. All we know right now is that someone is lying.

 

[auschip]

I dunno...you follow a man outside with a gun in your hand and shoot him. Don't look good. It could be argued that the dead boy thought his life was in danger and decided to defend by attacking.

Depends on who you believe. You were just assaulted, and walk outside to get the license plate number (while on the phone with 911). At that time the guy who just assaulted you rushes at you again screaming he is going to kill you, at which time you draw and fire. Since the two stories are so different, we need another source to verify. I wonder if you can hear anything on the 911 call.

 

[RubenZ]

I find that BS. If you are already leaving the store with Family. Why would you run back to assault the Victim. Why would you also continue to assault in front of your family members.

 

[auschip]

I find that BS. If you are already leaving the store with Family. Why would you run back to assault the Victim. Why would you also continue to assault in front of your family members.

Why would you committ assault in front of your family to begin with?

 

[RubenZ]

First of all. Look at the Conversation. "Oh my god, I can't believe I did this. I never wanted to pull my ...... " That right there says you werent ready to shoot the victim or you weren't in any real life threatening situation. That is big time doubt. And I'm surprised that didn't get him into more trouble.

Thats almost like saying ahhh I didn't want to but I did.

 

[Sniper X]

This is why they have courts, lawers and the judicial system, because with so little information as shown in text, there is no where near enough to convict or release him. Or even make a determination from the events listed.

 

[Sniper X]

BTW, here in New Mexico there are confrontations like this all the time with store owners and customers who can't or won't control their kids, get asked to do so by the store owners and then physically assault the store owners. I guess a big part of it is the Macho mentality, but these days it seems more aggressive people are everywhere, which is exactly why I got a CCW. Seems people have the will to try to kill someone over "dissing" or embarrassing them in front of their family or friends and THAT is ridiculous.

 

[Lonestar49]

Dismissed From Jury Duty

...

I'd be out, as it seems obvious, that the store owner had a short temper with kids, let alone a family doing business in his store. And as mentioned, in saying "I never intended too...." says just the opposite in my book, as it points to "his gun was on his mind" and his short temper, most likely from "words" exchanged from the parents (Dad) most likely, and that could include, Dad backing up Mom's words to the short tempered store clerk/owner.

Nope, I'd be sitting there with a little hang-man's noose waiting to be called.


LS

 

[auschip]

First of all. Look at the Conversation. "Oh my god, I can't believe I did this. I never wanted to pull my ...... " That right there says you werent ready to shoot the victim or you weren't in any real life threatening situation. That is big time doubt. And I'm surprised that didn't get him into more trouble.

Thats almost like saying ahhh I didn't want to but I did.

I disagree, all it says, is that he didn't want to have to do it, but feels like he was forced. Very few people are "ready to shoot", but that doesn't mean they didn't have a need to do it.

I still don't think we have all the info yet, and hesitate to convict the store owner until we do have more info. The reason i'm leaning towards believing the owner over the dead guy, is that the part of the story both sides agree on, is his assault of the store owner (inside).

 

[RevolvingCylinder]

He chased an unarmed, fleeing man down and shot him. That is the consistent fact as told by both parties. If that isn't murder I don't know what is.

 

[jlbraun]

He chased an unarmed, fleeing man down and shot him. That is the consistent fact as told by both parties. If that isn't murder I don't know what is.

Are you kidding? That's the one part that isn't consistent. On one hand, the lawful-citizen-no-criminal-record CCW holder says that the decedent threatened to kill him and continued to advance on a drawn gun, and the relative-of-the-decedent-with-unknown-criminal-history says Eli shot the decedent unprovoked. Which story are you reading?

 

[CannibalCrowley]

I'd be out, as it seems obvious, that the store owner had a short temper with kids, let alone a family doing business in his store.

He asked them to leave because the children were a nuisance inside the store, the father retaliated by assaulting him; how does that add up to Eliyahu having a short temper? If anything it shows that Pope had a short temper as well as an inability to control his children.

 

[1BLINDREF]

Sounds like the shooter might be in trouble if all that is written is true.
If so, antis have some more ammo for their cause :banghead:

 

[Clipper]

1. People with mannerless, undisciplined kids who let them run around like idiots in stores need a boot in the ass, and I wouldn't put up with it in my store either.

2. Macho, 'Don't talk that way about MY kid' parents of these little monsters, who wish to open the ball by making a physical attack on the complainant NEED to have the law sicced on 'em.

3. What is unreasonable about taking a license plate #? Persumably so police can identify whom to arrest when I sign the complaint.

4. If macho boy approaches me in a threatening manner on MY property, especially if I'm holding a firearm, in a castle doctorine state, then I think it's reasonable to assume he's a couple sandwiches short of a picnic, and probably dangerous.

Sounds like I'd rather be the defense lawyer than the prosecutor. I would be interested to know if Macho boy has ever had a DV beef against him, or is a boozer or doper. Might turn out to be just the shot of chlorine the gene pool needed...

 

[Jeff White]

jlbraun said;

Eli Eliyahu (CCW holder and verified good citizen with no criminal history)

Not even close. Like it or not, Eliyahu now has a criminal history. Even if he is acquitted, his criminal history file will always read: 1 charge 0 convictions - Voluntary Manslaughter.

This is the Strategies and Tactics Forum and here we talk about the nuts and bolts details of an incident. Feel free to start a thread in Legal and Political about how CCW holders are God's chosen people and incapable of wrong doing. Here in Strategies and Tactics all we will assume about Eliyahu is that he met the requirements to be issued a CCW permit in South Carolina when he applied. That is no guarantee that he's a model citizen. For all we know, he just has never been caught. You can't make blanket judgments about people based on if they are a cop, have a CCW permit, go to church every Sunday, volunteer at the retirement home, are scout leaders, give stray puppies a good home or any other criteria you care to use.

Buzz is right, at this time we don't have enough details to tell if this was a good shooting or not.

Jeff

 

[RevolvingCylinder]

Are you kidding? That's the one part that isn't consistent. On one hand, the lawful-citizen-no-criminal-record CCW holder says that the decedent threatened to kill him and continued to advance on a drawn gun, and the relative-of-the-decedent-with-unknown-criminal-history says Eli shot the decedent unprovoked. Which story are you reading?

The part where he said that he followed the man who was leaving as he was asked to out to the parking lot. This is what is consistent between both parties.

 

[RubenZ]

Why are some of you all making the person shot seem like a criminal? All we know is that he pushed the clerk. Thats hardly grounds for arresting someone. How do we know the Clerk wasn't all in his face telling them to get out? If someone were that close to me yelling get or whatever I'd probably push them to.