I think some people need to calm down

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I actually agree with you OP. I believe in all states, with the exception of California and Massachusetts, gun laws have become a lot less restrictive over the past few decades.

I think people here are just trying to stay vigilant... I dunno.
I do know you probably won't make many friends here with that attitude. :p
I don't think history would agree with you. I think in the last few decades gun laws have gotten worse. Correct me if I am wrong but I think there are like 22,000 gun laws right now in the US. My father used to be able to walk into walgreens and buy an M1 Garand. My granadfather as a kid could ahve gone to the sore and bought a bb gun or even a real gun. You used to be able to talk about guns at schools. the largest shooting ranges in the US exist below schools where they used to have high school shooting teams. Hos anyones kids here been on a team that shoot in the basement of a school?
 
specer, you didn't read the replies.

I just wish ya'all were as feverent to all our rights a A2. Warrentless wiretaps? Unjust accusations? Innocent untill proven guilty? Life, liberty and persut of happyness? You know, inalieneble rights endowed by the creator for EVERYBODY, not just you and your drinkin' buds.
 
My state has been adding gun control tidbits every year to our laws. We just elected an openly anti-gun governor. Maybe this is thanks to the droves of Californians who keep moving here. I don't know.

Gun control is alive and well, and it is on the move. They want my guns, but they just have to figure out socially acceptable and incremental ways of getting them, before they succeed.
 
burley:
I just wish ya'all were as feverent to all our rights a A2. Warrentless wiretaps? Unjust accusations? Innocent untill proven guilty? Life, liberty and persut of happyness? You know, inalieneble rights endowed by the creator for EVERYBODY, not just you and your drinkin' buds.

This bears examination. A2 rights aren't the only important ones. The 4th amendment was eviscerated beneath Bush Jr, and those policies have been sustained beneath Obama. The 4th is what is supposed to keep them from grabbing your guns and holding them without legal cause, or on a flimsy pretense.
 
Oh, bother. I should really keep my mouth shut..... but I won't! :(

First, not everyone owns guns. A lot of people own them, but probably not a majority. You would have to check with statistics people... and the NRA probably has a percentage number somewhere in their archives. The majority does not guaranty our firearms possession.

Second, while the Bill of Rights does address firearms ownership, AND the current court agrees that it guarantees an INDIVIDUAL RIGHT, courts in the future can disagree with this ruling, and overturn it. As you stated, the 4/5 split. It COULD have been 5/4!

Third, while we have a rich firearms heritage, we are under an organized campaign from people who want to disarm us. You can see the Brady and other antigun organizations, but there are others behind the scenes who want us to "throw down our firearms and come peacefully". (the UN Council on Small Arms" comes to mind) They see individual firearms ownership as a big hurdle in their race to a "one world government". If they get their way, all the years that you watched "Gunsmoke" isn't going to keep them from knocking on your door.

Fourth, some people are paranoid. What is that saying…. “Just because you are paranoid doesn’t mean that there aren’t little green men chasing you…” But….. We DO need to join the NRA and other RKBA organizations. We DO need to vote. We DO need to be vigilant and watch what is happening in the world. We also need to plan ahead for attacks against our firearms ownership. We have to believe that they will come. But are you paranoid when the very thing you are afraid of has happened before? This leads me to my final point.

Finally, someone above me mentioned Hitler. We gotta learn from the past!!! While our Constitution may guarantee the right, it doesn’t guarantee the application. The application can erode over time, leaving you with an empty shell that will put you in bondage.

Stay awake, stay vigilant! And may God (with a capital “G”) bless the land of the free.
 
Finally, someone above me mentioned Hitler. We gotta learn from the past!!! While our Constitution may guarantee the right, it doesn’t guarantee the application. The application can erode over time, leaving you with an empty shell that will put you in bondage.

Stay awake, stay vigilant! And may God (with a capital “G”) bless the land of the free.
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Amen Brother!
 
we have it in our constitution and supreme court 4/5 people agreeded to it.

You misheard. It was 5-4, as in it was 5 out of 9. Not such good odds now, eh?
 
They hypervigilant among us offset, somewhat, the lazy, ill informed, or lukewarm who do either nothing or almost nothing.

We need to have people that you see as worry warts as much as we need the even keeled folk in our ranks.
 
Second amendment discussions often slide into a 'ability to revolt against a government' tone.

The 'ability to revolt against tyranny' argument often comes not from sports shooter or self-defense advocates, gun folks, but from academics who bother to read the writings of the revolutionaries who founded the United States with the Constitution and Bill of Rights, when the Second Amendment was being debated and hammered out.
 
The 'ability to revolt against tyranny' argument often comes not from sports shooter or self-defense advocates, gun folks, but from academics who bother to read the writings of the revolutionaries who founded the United States with the Constitution and Bill of Rights, when the Second Amendment was being debated and hammered out.
Maybe, but I've heard it spoken by some alarmingly insane sounding politicians in this last election cycle.
 
Yup, only one supreme away from loosing the vote.

And what does this mean??What?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tt2yGzHfy7s
He's talking about the Peace Core and the USA Freedom Core. Here's the whole speech:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USA_Freedom_Corps


Obama, July 2, Colorado Springs, CO: [As] president I will expand AmeriCorps to 250,000 slots [from 75,000] and make that increased service a vehicle to meet national goals, like providing health care and education, saving our planet and restoring our standing in the world, so that citizens see their effort connected to a common purpose.

People of all ages, stations and skills will be asked to serve. Because when it comes to the challenges we face, the American people are not the problem – they are the answer. So we are going to send more college graduates to teach and mentor our young people. We'll call on Americans to join an energy corps, to conduct renewable energy and environmental clean-up projects in their neighborhoods all across the country.

We will enlist our veterans to find jobs and support for other vets, and to be there for our military families. And we're going to grow our Foreign Service, open consulates that have been shuttered and double the size of the Peace Corps by 2011 to renew our diplomacy. We cannot continue to rely only on our military in order to achieve the national security objectives that we've set.

We've got to have a civilian national security force that's just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded. We need to use technology to connect people to service. We'll expand USA Freedom Corps to create online networks where American can browse opportunities to volunteer. You'll be able to search by category, time commitment and skill sets. You'll be able to rate service opportunities, build service networks, and create your own service pages to track your hours and activities.

This will empower more Americans to craft their own service agenda and make their own change from the bottom up.
 
People who say they have guns in case they have to fight the government are a great example of people who shouldn't be allowed to speak for the RKBA movement, or even own guns themselves.

The Second Ammendment was put in place specifically to give the people the means to overthrow the government.

Are you saying we should 'tone things down' for the sake of political correctness?
 
The Second Ammendment was put in place specifically to give the people the means to overthrow the government.

Are you saying we should 'tone things down' for the sake of political correctness?
So what? That's not what it's good for now. It's used now for sports, self defense and pleasure. I'm not the OP, so I'm not saying tone down. I'm saying you're loosing grip with reality if you're considering armed revolution with rifles.

In 1776, a militia and a nation state would use the same weapons while conducting warfare. In 2010, nation states have armor, an air force and satellite imaging. If you're hinging the continued legitimacy of the second amendment on revolution, you had better find another reason real quick.
 
In 1776, a militia and a nation state would use the same weapons while conducting warfare. In 2010, nation states have armor, an air force and satellite imaging. If you're hinging the continued legitimacy of the second amendment on revolution, you had better find another reason real quick.

Revolution has not been made obsolete by mere hardware.
 
So what? That's not what it's good for now. It's used now for sports, self defense and pleasure.

Oh, okay, I guess we can forget about that whole 'freedom to peaceably assemble' thing, from now on the first ammendment will only concern porn and cursing on T.V.
 
I don't understand what you're trying to say.

I'm saying that you shouldn't just ignore the intent of the constitution.

You pretty much said that a revolution was impossible, so we should just forget about the real reason the Second Ammendment was drafted. Instead, we should focus on hunting and self defense, which have absolutely nothing to do with the 2'nd ammendment.
 
I'm saying that you shouldn't just ignore the intent of the constitution.

You pretty much said that a revolution was impossible, so we should just forget about the real reason the Second Ammendment was drafted. Instead, we should focus on hunting and self defense, which have absolutely nothing to do with the 2'nd ammendment.
I'm not ignoring it, I'm just saying that assuming the intent of the 2nd amendment is to allow violent overthrow, said intent is obsolete.

I think that if the intent is to discourage foreign invasion by making said invasion more costly it's not obsolete. Gun owning Americans alone could no more resist invasion than Iraqi or Afghani insurgents could resist the United States invading. They can inflict losses and cause disruption.. make an invasion more protracted and difficult.. but it's hard to resist a force that carpet bombs you or launches cruise missiles from 250 miles off shore.
 
I'm just saying that assuming the intent of the 2nd amendment is to allow violent overthrow, said intent is obsolete.

Obsolete or not, you should still support the spirit of the ammendment. That the people have a right to throw off an unjust government.
 
Obsolete or not, you should still support the spirit of the ammendment. That the people have a right to throw off an unjust government.
I agree that they do; the most successful revolt against a well organized, well armed and modern unjust government was orchestrated in India by Gandhi. That's not going to work in Burma, but concentrated political action should precede a failed state by a good margin.
 
First, not everyone owns guns. A lot of people own them, but probably not a majority. You would have to check with statistics people... and the NRA probably has a percentage number somewhere in their archives. The majority does not guaranty our firearms possession.


Exact numbers are vague, but most estimates are that between 25% to 35% of Americans legally own a firearm. This puts us gun owners as a minority. Thankfully......the anti-gunners are a minority also. The majority of Americans are neutral to gun ownership, which means in our Democratic society, they need to be either kept neutral or be swayed to our side for us to keep our right to legally own a gun. This can only be accomplished by a positive and ethical image. All the tough talk of "from my dead hands" is worthless, if our image as gun owners is negative enough to sway the majority to the other side. Laws and Amendments are passed by the majority....that's how our system works. Altho we need not be paranoid, we do need to be vigilant. We need to continue to educate and introduce new folks to the sport of shooting/hunting and show to others that, we as legal gun owners are responsible and law abiding. That we are just like them, but we own a gun. Protesting and belonging to the NRA won't help at all if we act like bullies and doofusses.


Plus, I highly doubt that they will ever ban guns.

....I bet there were folks that never thought they'd remove the "In God we trust" from our currency either. A democratic society does what the majority wants.......like it or not. The thing that makes America so great is the biggest threat we have.
 
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