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Kirst 45acp for 1860 Army!!

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Blackpowderwarrior said:
Mike,

Sounds good brother! I'm excited for you man and I hope any suggestions you give to Walt he'll take to heart.

I just ordered another kirst but in 22LR for my pocket police. My thoughts are this, I can take my pocket police and have a excellent .36 cal revolver orbit can slide on my kirst 22 lr abd have a nifty pea shooter for some front yard plinking and or squirrel medicine :)
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Thanks bro!! He's fun to talk to and understands the properties exactly!! Very sharp guy!
I'm sure that pocket gun with 22's in it is a hoot !!!

Jim Watson said:
As I understand, the .45 CS is meant to hold the SASS minimum 1 cc of black and a light bullet, 160-180 gr.
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You're probably right ( that makes total sense), I was just relaying that the specials fit these cyls like they were made for them as well. I have heard folks talk about that round but I have never shot one of those. That said though, I may have to order some brass ( as well as cut down any cracked/split 45C cases). It sounds like some good test "ground " to turn over!!

Dirty Bob said:
For me, the appeal of the .45 Colt over the .45 ACP is that I can use black powder cartridges. I've never checked to see how much bp I can stuff in a .45 ACP case and still crimp in a 200 grain Big Lube bullet, but I'm guessing it's something like 18-20 grains, at most, with a compressed load. I went with a Kirst in .45 Colt for my Uberti 1858, and it was a great purchase that I've never regretted.

Nothing against the .45 ACP, but the .45 Colt and black powder kinda go together for me. I love the smell, the BOOM and the cloud of smoke. I also enjoy thumbing in those big .45 Colt rounds. Fun!

I would, however, love to hear about anyone who's used black powder in a .45 ACP conversion. I'm willing to admit I'm wrong if it turns out that .45 ACP and black powder go together -- at least in a conversion revolver -- like ribs and BBQ sauce!

All my best,
Dirty Bob
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I understand where you're coming from but, I see it as a way to use an efficient round ( as far as reloading) that is much more readily available. Even as a reloader, if you can't get components for the 45C and new ammo isn't available, 45acp is about as common as you can get. I've seen folks run a 1911 with bp loads and it's way cool but I think it's a great smokeless round to run in a cap gun! And then there's me!! I can't shoot outside in my county anyway so indoor ranges are "the place to be "!! Of course you can't shoot bp indoors so . . . there I am . . . a smokeless guy!!

Mike
 
45 Dragoon said:
Thanks bro!! He's fun to talk to and understands the properties exactly!! Very sharp guy!
I'm sure that pocket gun with 22's in it is a hoot !!!



You're probably right ( that makes total sense), I was just relaying that the specials fit these cyls like they were made for them as well. I have heard folks talk about that round but I have never shot one of those. That said though, I may have to order some brass ( as well as cut down any cracked/split 45C cases). It sounds like some good test "ground " to turn over!!



I understand where you're coming from but, I see it as a way to use an efficient round ( as far as reloading) that is much more readily available. Even as a reloader, if you can't get components for the 45C and new ammo isn't available, 45acp is about as common as you can get. I've seen folks run a 1911 with bp loads and it's way cool but I think it's a great smokeless round to run in a cap gun! And then there's me!! I can't shoot outside in my county anyway so indoor ranges are "the place to be "!! Of course you can't shoot bp indoors so . . . there I am . . . a smokeless guy!!

Mike
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As much as I love the ol' holy black I definitely value smokeless as well.
I'm a big fan of Alliants Red Dot. Soft shooting in 45 COLT. I usually use tight group in 45 ACP.

One thing I would worry about is the thick copper plated bullets in 45 acp. The Uberti heat treatment seems leaps and bounds over pietras and may hold up better to plated bullets. but all this is is conjecture on my part.
 
Jim Watson said:
Well, bless your heart. Where is that so we can avoid it?
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Well, any highly populated area in the country generally has laws or ordinances against shooting outdoors where you would probably endanger the "wellbeing" of another. Better to go to a controlled area (range) to be safe. If you live in the "country", I totally understand but I don't and there's nowhere in my county that isn't populated. When I was a kid, I could just be outside the city limits and be ok but that was 50 yrs ago . . . a lot has changed since then.

Mike
 
Jim Watson said:
As I understand, the .45 CS is meant to hold the SASS minimum 1 cc of black and a light bullet, 160-180 gr.
Click to expand...
Wow, that is a light load, but it's probably a lot of fun to shoot and great for introducing new shooters to shooting black powder in a single action. I imagine the shorter cases are tiny bit quicker -- and more positive -- if you have to reload on the clock. And somebody mentioned Red Dot, which'd probably be a good choice for a mild smokeless load.

Perhaps I should explore .45 ACP as a practice round....

Gosh darnit, y'all are going to cost me money! :)

All my best,
Dirty Bob
 
I know my recent Kirst acquisition for my pocket police 22LR conversion cylinder really was money WELL spent!

I applaud and support Walts work.

@45D could you ask Walt if he would see about doing a run of longer barrel inserts for the 22LR pocket conversion kits and seeing how well they sell?
 
So...will it shoot .45 Auto Rim? I'm guessing not? What kind of case does this ".45CS" use?

If one had any doubts, they can download the ACP. I have a Webley with the cylinder cut for .45ACP, I don't shoot factory loads in it, and use the Auto Rim cases most of the time. On the other hand, you can sure reload it fast with the full moon clips and the .45 ACP cases.
 
No, looking at the pics I don't see enough space between the back of the cylinder, and the "other stuff" to allow room for a .45AR. ?
 
Blackpowderwarrior said:
I know my recent Kirst acquisition for my pocket police 22LR conversion cylinder really was money WELL spent!

I applaud and support Walts work.

@45D could you ask Walt if he would see about doing a run of longer barrel inserts for the 22LR pocket conversion kits and seeing how well they sell?
Click to expand...

Yessir! I'll bring it up!!

Walt said the rim thickness was the problem with the Auto Rims.

Mike
 
hawg said:
The Big Bopper did it better. As far as .45 ACP goes leave it for the 1911. An 1860 deserves .45 Colt.
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We can agree to disagree about the Big Bopper.

As for the 1860, why not convert it the way the Colt factory did and use the 44 Colt? Either one! The Italians had to alter enough geometry on the revolver to accept the 45 long Colt that it doesn’t even feel like an 1860 anymore.

Kevin
 
StrawHat said:
We can agree to disagree about the Big Bopper.

As for the 1860, why not convert it the way the Colt factory did and use the 44 Colt? Either one! The Italians had to alter enough geometry on the revolver to accept the 45 long Colt that it doesn’t even feel like an 1860 anymore.

Kevin
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Works for me.
 
45 Dragoon said:
Walt said the rim thickness was the problem with the Auto Rims.
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Right, as suspected. I think that would be a good cartridge, but would interest few people, and .45AR is not on the shelves like .45ACP is. The ACP will certainly produce a lot of interest, and brass is certainly plentiful. I'm still finding it laying on the ground, although I've noticed more and more people are not leaving their brass when they shoot.
 
StrawHat said:
As for the 1860, why not convert it the way the Colt factory did and use the 44 Colt?
Click to expand...

For sure, the "holy grail" pistol for me would be in .44 Colt, but I understand why most people would not want to fabricate ammo for one. For me it would be a pleasure, a fun activity.
 
Paul R Zartman said:
I cut a few (with a copper tubing cutter) to test them in my shaved webley, too thin for hammer to hit, too thick with moons....ordered AR 45 to load...
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From what I understand, cut down .45 Colt cases will work in an un-shaved Webley. I like the AR cases which look really cool with the long nose 265 grain Webley bullet seated in it.
 
I watched Mike Bellevue loading ammo with heeled bullets. No thank you sir. :D

The .45ACP in a single action sixgun is the most fun you can have with your pants on.
 
Ugly Sauce said:
From what I understand, cut down .45 Colt cases will work in an un-shaved Webley. I like the AR cases which look really cool with the long nose 265 grain Webley bullet seated in it.
Click to expand...


For Colt cases to work, you will not headspace on the rim. You will need to headspace of the cartridge mouth or something else.

Kevin
 
45 Dragoon said:
Just an update on the 45acp cylinder.
Happy to say after 200 rounds everything is perfect!
As a test for the platform ( open top design) it should be fine for "off the shelf " acp ammo.

Mike
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I have 2 questions -

Kirst says to only use lead projectiles and I interpret "off the shelf" ACP ammo to mean jacketed bullets is that what you're using and feel comfortable with?

Kirst says to only use low velocity ammunition and I interpret "off the shelf" ACP ammo to mean full power loads is that what you're using and feel comfortable with?
 
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