I picked up a Rossi M92 in 44 Magnum today and am getting one in .45 LC when it comes in - and probably one in .357 when I sell another gun. Anyway, how should I load for these? Would like to work up both plinking loads and hunting loads. Should I use the revolver recipes, or is there data expressly for rifles, sort of like the 30 Carbine loads? Anybody got a favorite powder and bullet?
Loading for lever actions
- Thread starter Armymutt
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4895
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I like a 200 grain bullet with win296 powder. Load charges are the same, only the velocity changes from a longer barrel.
buck460XVR
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Most all manuals have recipes for loading handgun caliber carbines in the rifle section of the manuals. Hodgdon also has recipes for handgun caliber carbines in it rifle section on it's online reloading center. Otherwise loads that work in revolvers work in carbines. They are built to the same SAAMI specs. Only thing I advise is to keep plinkin' loads from revolver recipes to those that produce 850fps or above to avoid a stuck bullet in the longer carbine barrel. Slower burning powders work better in the carbines than the faster burning ones. I usually don't use anything faster than Unique in mine. All of mine like IMR4227 or H110/W296 for upper end loads. I also find that standard weight for caliber bullets work best for me...i.e. 158s for .357 and 240s for .44.
buck460XVR
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........
RainDodger
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My Hornady manuals (8th and 9th editions) both say that you should stay towards the maximum loads for rifles. I found that interesting. There are sections for the .44 Mag in both the pistol section and the rifle section.
I've got a Browning B92 in .44 Magnum on the way, so I've been studying up on it also.
I've got a Browning B92 in .44 Magnum on the way, so I've been studying up on it also.
4895
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I only shoot jacketed bullets in .44 mag rifle.
NeuseRvrRat
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think about it this way...
if you didn't reload, you'd just go in a store and buy 44 mag. there wouldn't be 44 mag revolver and 44 mag rifle boxes.
if you didn't reload, you'd just go in a store and buy 44 mag. there wouldn't be 44 mag revolver and 44 mag rifle boxes.
Salmoneye
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Salmoneye
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My 4th edition says nothing of the sort...
For the life of me, I can not imagine why they would suggest such a thing...
ADDING:
Just reread it...The 'at or near max' suggestion was only in reference to slow powders...
buck460XVR
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I run jacketed bullets thru my carbines. They just shoot the best for me. H110/W296, even at start loads, pushes plated bullets too fast in carbines for their thin plating. H110/W296 can work with hard cast bullets that are properly sized to the bore. One thing especially in .357 levers, is that due to the way a lever bolt locks up at the rear, there is some flex in the action when shot. This can tend to stretch cases when used with max or near max loads. This is why many recommend using only new or once fired brass for max or near max loads in handgun caliber lever actions.
JLDickmon
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Hey.. the reason we handload is so we can use lead bullets in our stuff..
now if you REALLY wanted to get froggy, you could use a gas check and shove it a little faster..
then gun I have that won't shoot a lead bullet is the gun that gets traded off..
now if you REALLY wanted to get froggy, you could use a gas check and shove it a little faster..
then gun I have that won't shoot a lead bullet is the gun that gets traded off..
buck460XVR
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If every handloader used only lead bullets, there would be no jacketed bullets for sale. If every handloader used lead bullets, those jacketed bullets for sale would have still been on the shelf during the latest frenzy. While I do use lead bullets, I also use jacketed. I have some guns that just shoot jacketed better and I have some guns I just prefer to shoot jacketed outta. Many of the old guys I learned to reload from 30 ago and many of my friends that reload now, have never seated a lead bullet. Commercial hard cast many times cost as much as jacketed and commercial gas checked even more. Since many of us reload for accuracy and saving money, it would be foolish for folks in those situations to load lead when jacketed would serve them better. I've got some guns handed down to me by my dad and grandfather. They don't really shoot lead that well. Doubt if I'll trade 'em off because of it.
RealGun
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I have 6 of my guns at the gunsmith now to make them better with lead. Basically, he is matching the cylinder throats with the bore. I wouldn't sell them just because I have to clean lead after every outing. I am not confident I understand what is meant by "not working with lead".
dagger dog
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Make sure to monitor COL, especially if loading LSWC bullets they tend to run longer than the RNFP and will cause feeding problems if your brass is on the long side of the trim to length and crimp into the crimp groove.
They will work without problems in your revolver but will tie up our lever gun if too long.
I really like the Lee 452 255 gr RNFP and they shoot great in my Rossi, the Lyman 454190 is another.
For plinking with the 45 Colt I like TrailBoss and the Lee RNFP, dip lubed with alox. I load Ruger only loads of H110 and the RCBS 45-255 LSWC with Emmert's lube.
They will work without problems in your revolver but will tie up our lever gun if too long.
I really like the Lee 452 255 gr RNFP and they shoot great in my Rossi, the Lyman 454190 is another.
For plinking with the 45 Colt I like TrailBoss and the Lee RNFP, dip lubed with alox. I load Ruger only loads of H110 and the RCBS 45-255 LSWC with Emmert's lube.
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greyling22
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the 92 design isn't quite as picky as the marlin 94 in this, but 2 things about reloading for a lever gun, and neither has to do with lead/jacketed or powder type:
1) these guns typically cycle the magnum length case more smoothly with fewer jams (I have noticed this more in 38's than 44's).
2) bullets with a lip or rim around the edge, like a semiwadcutter, tend to get caught on the chamber as they cycle and jam up the gun.
1) these guns typically cycle the magnum length case more smoothly with fewer jams (I have noticed this more in 38's than 44's).
2) bullets with a lip or rim around the edge, like a semiwadcutter, tend to get caught on the chamber as they cycle and jam up the gun.
Please nobody flame me for this, but I usually load a bit hot for my Marlin than I would for a pistol because imo it can take more pressure. I don't bump it much, and you can't anyway or your brass sticks. The only pistol in 44mag I've ever had was a Contender in 10" which are very strong, I load most of those rather light because full loads take the fun out in the form of pain, full loads are more for entertainment.
Since both my guns are long barreled I use slower powder as a general rule, usually H110 or 296, but I've experimented with Blue Dot as well which is more for mid to 44 special range power because it's too fast if you want power. If I tried any other powders I've forgotten.
So I guess to answer your question I'd consider slower powders on avg, which H110/296 is ideal imo. As for peak power it's not a prob at all in the rifle where it can be harsh on the hands in a pistol.
Something else is you might look is seating depth, many rifles can take a longer cartridge than a revolver which opens the door to more power. Crimp is another, a rifle doesn't need as much as a revolver, especially with a compressed charge. Less crimp = longer lasting brass.
Since both my guns are long barreled I use slower powder as a general rule, usually H110 or 296, but I've experimented with Blue Dot as well which is more for mid to 44 special range power because it's too fast if you want power. If I tried any other powders I've forgotten.
So I guess to answer your question I'd consider slower powders on avg, which H110/296 is ideal imo. As for peak power it's not a prob at all in the rifle where it can be harsh on the hands in a pistol.
Something else is you might look is seating depth, many rifles can take a longer cartridge than a revolver which opens the door to more power. Crimp is another, a rifle doesn't need as much as a revolver, especially with a compressed charge. Less crimp = longer lasting brass.
RealGun
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Such a gun doesn't justify itself unless there is a handgun with which to share ammo. Therefore, the true magnum handgun loads make the most sense.
RainDodger
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All interesting comments for me too, as I have a Browning 92 in .44 Mag on the way next month I believe. I've never loaded for .44 Mag before and the above is good information.
As for lead bullets.... back in the day when I had no money, I used to scrounge for wheel weights and cast my own bullets. Since becoming marginally successful and being able to eat regular meals, I have loaded only jacketed bullets. The only exception to that is wadcutter loads for a .38 Special, which I pretty much never shoot. It's all jacketed for me... much less time and hassle in my view.
As for lead bullets.... back in the day when I had no money, I used to scrounge for wheel weights and cast my own bullets. Since becoming marginally successful and being able to eat regular meals, I have loaded only jacketed bullets. The only exception to that is wadcutter loads for a .38 Special, which I pretty much never shoot. It's all jacketed for me... much less time and hassle in my view.
gamestalker
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I've always preferred 200 gr JHP's or JSP's for hunting. I run them at near max 296 / H110. I've used 220 gr. also, but nothing any heavier, I prefer as much velocity as is accurately possible, you'll have to decide what you prefer.
I haven't really noticed much difference between rifle data and revolver data between the two. I noticed that Hogdon does differentiate between the two, but I don't think the loads are different, but it's been a while since I've loaded for a 44 mag. rifle. But if the rifle data is in fact different, you could just use revolver data for both. You probably wouldn't see enough difference to justify loading exclusively for each.
GS
I haven't really noticed much difference between rifle data and revolver data between the two. I noticed that Hogdon does differentiate between the two, but I don't think the loads are different, but it's been a while since I've loaded for a 44 mag. rifle. But if the rifle data is in fact different, you could just use revolver data for both. You probably wouldn't see enough difference to justify loading exclusively for each.
GS
buck460XVR
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The major differences one see in mauals between loads for revolvers and their matching caliber carbines is the difference in pressure and velocites developed by the longer barrel. One does not have to load heavier to increase performance, the longer barrel does this for you. What one does not see for the carbines is the low velocity loads using fast powders. The actions of most levers is no stronger than the actions of their revolver counterparts. One needs to remember that most .44 bullets are designed with revolver velocities in mind. Using light for caliber, thin jacketed bullets will not give the best terminal performance on medium to large game, when used at rifle velocities.
In my Marlin 44 Mag, it shot best with H110. After this chronograph testing I came to the conclusion that H110 and W296 were the same powder, just in different cans at different prices. It was only later that this was verified in the gun press.
Code:
[SIZE="3"]M1894 Marlin Ballard Barrel
240 Speer JHP 22.0 grs 2400 CCI 500
21-Dec-01 T = 54 °F
Ave Vel =1747
Std Dev =21
ES =68
Low =1717
High =1785
N =7
240 Nosler JHP 24.0 grs W296 WLP Fed cases
23-Mar-05 T = 65° F
Ave Vel =1725
Std Dev =7
ES =21
Low =1715
High =1736
N =5
240 Nosler JHP 24.5 grs W296 WLP Fed cases
23-Mar-05T = 65° F
Ave Vel =1752
Std Dev =12
ES =28
Low =1735
High =1763
N =5
240 Nosler JHP 24.0 grs H110 WLP Midway cases
23-Mar-05 T = 65° F
Ave Vel =1710
Std Dev =3
ES =9
Low =1705
High =1714
N =5
240 Nosler JHP 24.5 grs H110 WLP Midway cases
23-Mar-05 T = 65° F
Ave Vel =1745
Std Dev =12
ES =45
Low =1723
High =1768
N =10
240 Rem JHP 24.0 grs H110 WLP Midway cases
23-Mar-05 T = 65° F
Ave Vel =1719
Std Dev =10
ES =29
Low =1705
High =1734
N =10
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