Looking for scope recommendations.

[scythefwd]

When I was looking through scopes, I never touched the adjustments. I figured, once I got them set... I wouldn't be messing with them much. I have never had a scope that didn't click when adjusted... how can't they? My 40 year old weaver doesn't have an audible click, but you can feel each and every adjustment. My generic scope that came with my shotgun has an audible click. What do you guys mean by "click"?

 

[Mr_Pale_Horse]

Some scopes, lower end Leupolds, are bound only by friction, which in reality, is part of all reticle adjustment systems. Therefore, there is no detent and spring loaded ball to make the "click" more or less fixed adjustments at 1/4 or ? MOA, depending on the product line.

For what it is worth, I setup 6 rifles over the last year, 2 Nikon Prostaffs, a Leupold Rifleman, and a VX-III 2.5-8, a Bushnell Banner 1.5-4.5x, and a Simmons Prohunter 2x Pistol.

The Nikons were sound once setup, but have unrepeatable adjustments for POI. Glass is OK.

The Riflemen was about on par the the Prostaff, but I found it easier to adjust POI. Glass is OK.

The VX-III stainless finish was a breeze to setup and use.

The Bushnell, an older Japanese made model was surprisingly good.

The Simmons had irritating barrel distortion, but other wise was servicable on a scout mount.

For the money, the $50 dollar (albeit 1980's price) Bushnell was the bargain of the bunch.

YMMV

 

[Fumbler]

If you like the VX-I's that's cool but the only thing they offer that you cannot get for less money with any scope from Nikon, Sightron, Bushnell, Burris, Weaver etc. is the Leupold warranty.

I disagree.
If you're looking at the features on paper then you are correct; the VX-I is outclassed by cheaper scopes.

But, you will not find a cheaper scope that will have better center to edge distortion than a VX-I. Even the nicer scopes from other brands don't have better center to edge distortion.

Also, a VX-1's adjustments will give you repeatability that other scopes at the same price or lower do not offer. You can't read that in the specs sheet.
I've owned quite a few $200 or less scopes and none of them have been as repeatable as my VX-I, even with its friction adjustments. It doesn't track perfectly, but it's best in class.

The team primos is a better scope than the VX-I and VX-II and closer to last year's VX-III model.

Why?

I don't doubt that you're telling the truth as you know it, but if you're going to say one thing is better than another then give explicit reasons.
If you do not give good reasons then you don't have any credibility. Don't just say "the glass is better," describe how it is better. Are colors more true to life? Is it more clear overall? Is the center to edge distortion better? Is the depth of field better?
Lenses have many attributes and people weigh those attributes differently.
Help the original poster out by giving him better info.

I have never had a scope that didn't click when adjusted... how can't they? My 40 year old weaver doesn't have an audible click, but you can feel each and every adjustment. My generic scope that came with my shotgun has an audible click. What do you guys mean by "click"?

"Click" adjustments have detents. If you turn the adjustment then it will move to the next notch that's a set distance away from the others. The adjustment is discrete.
Click adjustments do not necessarily have an audible click but you should feel it click.

Compared to the rest of the market, the Leupold Rifleman and VX-1 are dinosaurs in their adjustments. Their friction adjustments do not have any sort of detent. Because of this, you can actually adjust it finer because there are no distinct increments.
Some will tell you that it won't hold a zero because it relies on friction. This isn't necessarily true because the adjustments have a pretty good amount of friction. I've adjusted many scopes with click adjustments that turn much easier than the Leupolds. The detent in most cheap scopes do nothing to lock the adjustments down.

 

[Fumbler]

Nice post Walter.

About repeatability; Yes, it is easier to make adjustments with clicks.
However, cheaper scopes with clicks may or may not adjust in a repeatable fashion or at least will need some settling.
For instance, assume you have a rifle that's perfectly accurate.
To test the tracking/repeatability, you shoot one shot.
Then adjust 4 inches to the right and shoot one shot.
Then, adjust the POI 4 inches down, shoot a shot.
If the holes make a perfect 4" square then the scope tracks well and the adjustments will be repeatable.

Most $200 scopes will not do this test well, but the cheap Leupolds will be better than most in the price range.

I don't adjust my VX-I often because it's on my hunting gun that's sighted for one load.
I sight it in for 2.5" above POA at 100 yards.
Sometimes for fun I'll take it to the range and adjust the POI down 2.5"
It will hit POA at 100 yards after I do that.
I've tried that with other cheap scopes and non of them will do it. Some will do it after the adjustments settle, but some will need to be adjusted more or less.

If you can turn the friction adjustments on a Leupold in fine increments then the Leupold is repeatable. Other cheap scopes may seem to be repeatable because they have clicks, but those clicks don't always transfer to the correct POI change or the scopes needs to be shot for the adjustments to settle down to the correct POI.

 

[ScareyH22A]

I did a lot of research for a scope for my 10/22. My friend recommended a Nikon Buckmaster. I checked out it's reviews and everyone seems to like them, especially at the higher magnifications that rimfire benchrest shooters prefer. Maybe all you need is a 3-9x which I'm sure looks crystal clear with that scope. Maybe a little out of your price range between $300-$350 but I'd really "look into" them first before making a decision.

Check out the reviews on MidwayUSA and there's guys that love them so much that after trying it out, they bought several more for their other rifles. That's saying something.

 

[kansas45]

Or you can just run to the local Wal Mart & buy a 4-16X40 Center Point for under $80.00 & a couple boxes of ammo.

 

[Fumbler]

Be aware while looking at any scope in a store.
Scopes are set parallax free at 100-150 yards. That parallax distance is where the scope is actually focused and cannot change unless the scope has an adjustable objective or internal focus adjustment.
If you're looking inside a store then things will not be in focus unless it's a realllly big store where you can see far.

IIRC, Nikons are set parallax free at 100 yard and Leupolds are at 150 yards for their centerfire rifle scopes.
If this is true, then a Nikon will be closer to focused than the Leupold at short distances thereby giving you the appearance that the Nikon is more "clear."

 

[Fumbler]

The only scopes that seem to have a noticeable problem with parallax making things fuzzy are scopes with parallax adjustment. I have a Simmons scope that looks completely out of focus unless I adjust the parallax at any given distance. But for some reason scopes without parallax adjustment aren't nearly as bad.

I'm not sure if this is an explanation, but here's what I've noticed.
The shorter the parallax free distance is set to, the more out of focus a closer or farther object will be.

For instance...
#1 - set an AO scope to 50 yards and look at a target at 75
#2 - set an AO scope to 100 yards and look at a target at 75 or 125 yards.

#2 will be closer to focused. Maybe it's because in #1 the target is 33% off of the parallax free distance vs 25% off of the parallax free distance in #2.

With every AO scope I've had, if I set the parallax free distance to the same setting as another scope I had and looked through both then they'd be comparable in parallax error at the same distances.

I don't know...I'm no expert. It'd be nice if someone who's an optics expert can chime in on what they think of budget scopes.

 

[Fumbler]

And the fact is that parallax issues increase with distance. They don't decrease. You will have much more problems with parallax on targets 1000 yards away than you will with targets 100 yards away as long as the parallax is not set correctly for that particular distance.

Cool.
So what about the example I posted?
Would scope #1 or #2 be closer to focused?