M1 Carbine finish

[tkthorn]

I have a 1943 Inland M1 Carbine with all matching numbers. This is a great shooter. It was devalued by the former owner when he sanded the stock and put a high gloss varnish on it. Though pretty it was not original. I have restored it back to the oiled finish and was considering going ahead and redoing the metal since there are a number of shiney spots, mainly the bolt. My question is what was original issued finish? Was it manganese or zinc parkerizing ?

 

[Lee Roder]

I have a 1943 Inland M1 Carbine with all matching numbers.

Eh, which numbers match???

I don't know the answer to your question, as both manganese and zinc were used at various times by various manufacturers, but Inland is known to have used a manganese phosphate finish known as Parco-Lubrite during mid to late production.

 

[tkthorn]

The serial number of The rifle. A number of The rifle components are stamped with the last 3-4 digits of The full serial number. Would that not mean that it is all original and not a parts gun ?

 

[rcmodel]

I don't know what it would mean.

No part of a GI M1 carbine was ever numbered to the receiver.

Any additional numbers on parts would be drawing numbers, and would not match the actual serial number, or any other part.

rc

 

[Lee Roder]

Only the receiver was "numbered" as originally manufactured. These carbines were loaned out all over the world by the US after the war. Germans, Austrians and Bavarians typically "numbered" the parts to the receiver "to keep them together" for some nonsensical reason. These weren't "fitted" guns, the M1 carbine was DESIGNED for swapping parts of any USGI manufacture.

You can read more on the history of these "special" carbines here

http://www.bavarianm1carbines.com/

The fact that the original parts appear "all together" means that you may have something "special"

DON'T CHANGE/REFINISH ANYTHING. Learn about the M1 carbine, and send the Carbine Club a datasheet. Contact Jim Mock thru the website above. Et cetera ...

 

[tkthorn]

Too late for the stock as I stated earlier the previous owner had gloss varnish on the walnut. Was I wrong to remove the varnish a rub in tung oil ?

 

[tkthorn]

I was mistaken about multiple parts being numbered just one. Behind the rear sight is the serial number and behind that is the retainer with the screw, that has two digits that match the serial number, this is all.

 

[Jim K]

The other posters are correct. No part of a GI carbine was originally numbered to match the serial number and that includes the recoil plate.

Carbine parts did not have "drawing numbers" either. The use of drawing numbers was a Springfield Armory convention used on guns they developed. The carbine was neither developed nor manufactured at Springfield. The only markings on carbine parts are the manufacturer's marking, usually 2 letters showing who made the part and, if not the prime contractor, what prime contractor it was made for.

Jim

 

[dprice3844444]

Parkerizing is a chemical process using a low strength acid combined with either Manganese (usually WWII up to summer of 1944 and then again on all post war new production) or Zinc ( summer of 1944 to end of WWII and post war rebuilds). The metal is media blasted and then submerged in the acid bath at about 180 degrees. This etches the metal from the acid bath into the work piece. A good park job is important because it provides a porous surface for the rifle to hold oil and prevent rust.

[email protected] he's in the cmp forum/m14 forum as chuckindenver.
does military parkerization,military rebarreling,03a4 bolt conversions,receiver drilling (not smith corona) for scope mounting 03a3,1903's etc
chuck moline 720-841-1399

 

[Jim K]

I wouldn't do anything to the metal finish on that carbine unless it is seriously rusted or the finish is completely gone. If there are shiny spots, that is very common and nothing to worry about. Those carbines, scorned for years, now have serious collector interest and refinishing will reduce the value.

Removing the stock varnish was OK, but I would leave the metal alone.

Jim

 

[tkthorn]

Thanks for the input, I think I will leave the metal alone. Its not that bad, mainly just the bolt. Is there any way to find out what theatre it might have been in ?

 

[rcmodel]

I think I will leave the metal alone.

Wise decision!

find out what theatre it might have been in ?

No.

Anyway, your part-numbered lend-lease carbine has been a lot of places bewteen WWII and when it came back home in the USA to roost in your nest.
Simply no way of tracking it's movement after it was made.

You might look real careful for a tiny importers stamp in all the out-of-the way places you haven't looked with a magnifying glass yet.

rc

 

[Jim K]

Probably not "lend lease" but provided to our allies as military assistance post WWII. They were given to the French, the Germans, the Austrians, the anti-communist Chinese, the South Koreans, the Japanese, and heaven only knows who else. They were especially liked in Asia because of the smaller stature of their troops.

Jim

 

[tkthorn]

After first stating that it had matching numbers I took it out of The stock and examined it closely and there are on import stamps only two digit letter stamp on the bayonet lug which if not mistaken was the manufacturer stamp. The one stamp that does look to have been added later was on the retainer or recoil plate directly behind the rear sight. The last four digits of The serial number are 1306 and this plate is hand stamped 13. Maybe I'm mistaken but this Carbine looks to be in too good of shape to have bounced around parts of Europe after the war.

 

[tkthorn]

That was supposed to be NO import stamps.

 

[dogrunner]

Well, while the # issue addressed is correct, other parts of a GI carbine WILL have various markings. Plus the BBL will be dated and marked with an ordnance cartouche on it's forward end, just before the sight. The sight also may bear a number behind the blade (usually singular), the trigger housing may or may not be marked. Various other internal parts will bear (not always) mfg markings.

Strangest thing I have ever seen was an ordnance bomb mark on a recoil plate......that plate came from a blue sky import that had obviously not ever been tinkered with and was the only one so marked in a batch an FFL friend purchased.

 

[Jim K]

Using units sometimes stamped rack numbers on the guns. That was banned in U.S. service with only paint allowed, but other countries did it, and sometimes U.S. units didn't play by the rules and used stamps.

All that can be said is that the number is not factory and I doubt anyone today knows the meaning or why it is there.

It should be noted that some post-WWII carbine users, like Germany and Korea, made parts for their guns, and Korea made parts for the M1 rifle as well. I don't recall seeing any markings on those parts, but won't swear there weren't any.

Jim

 

[tkthorn]

Yeah, there are some single letters hear and there and Inland division of general motors 1943 behind the front sight also Inland Div. Behind the rear sight along with the full serial number.