M1 carbine vs 7.62X25-compare?

[The_Antibubba]

I've always been fascinated by the M1 Carbine, but put off by the round-not so much by it's performance, but the paucity of manufactured loads for it. I've also been itching for a CZ-52, which takes the 7.62X25 round. Two questions:

1. How do the two rounds compare, in velocity, chamber pressure, bullet weights, etc.?

2. What is the feasibility of converting an M1 carbine for the 7.62X25? I could have a pistol and a carbine chambered for the same round.

Thanks

 

[DMK]

Comparing them side by side at Winchester's website shows that the 30 carbine not only has the benefit of a heavier bullet, it's considerably hotter. Plus, 7.62x25 HPs are non-available.

(I used the specs for 10" and 11" barrel lengths for a fair comparison, both would be faster in a rifle barrel)

http://www.winchester.com/products/catalog/handgundetail.aspx?symbol=X30M1&cart=MzAgQ2FyYmluZQ==

http://www.winchester.com/products/...spx?symbol=MC762TOK&cart=Ny42MngyNSBUb2thcmV2


Just in case you're thinking that domestic 7.62x25 ammo probably isn't as hot as European (as I also thought), view the specs on this site:

http://members.nuvox.net/~on.melchar/tokarev/index.html


If you want a .30 carbine rifle/pistol combo, you can get an M1 and a Ruger Blackhawk to share the ammo.

http://www.ruger-firearms.com/Firearms/FAProdView?model=505&return=Y

 

[M2 Carbine]

The_Antibubba

It wouldn't be a problem making a barrel for the 7.62x25 but it would be a major job to get the slide and bolt light enough so the 7.62x25 would operate them.

I haven't tried the 7.62 in the magazines but I suspect they won't work.

They did make a 9mm M1 Carbine at one time. I don't think it worked well.

 

[Sunray]

Only .30 carbine ball ammo is, shall we say, weak? Good handloads with 110 grain HP bullets make an enormous difference. Blows a hole the size of a grapefruit in a ground hog with the load I use. Mind you, I met a guy, long ago, who had been with 2PPCLI at Kap Y'ong who swears by them. Ball ammo or not.
The 7.62 x 25 is a real pistol cartridge and despite the fact you can load a 110 grain bullet, it doesn't compare to a 110 grain .30 carbine round. It's velocity is about 1140fps using a jacketed soft point. A .30 carbine 110 grain bullet, flys at 1900fps plus.
Here's some data for the 7.62 x 25.
http://members.nuvox.net/~on.melchar/tokarev/
Here's some for the .30 carbine. http://www.reloadersnest.com/query_bw.asp?CaliberID=50&BulletWeight=110

 

[Sven]

Sunray,

Can you PM me your pet 30 loads?



-s

 

[Snowdog]

It's velocity is about 1140fps using a jacketed soft point. A .30 carbine 110 grain bullet, flys at 1900fps plus.

1900 FPS is from a carbine's barrel I'm sure, but what of the 1140 FPS listed? I'd imagine that's from a <5" barrel. I'm certain it wouldn't be up to par with a .30 carbine from a longer barrel, but I do believe the 7.62x25 could be loaded to offer ballistics a sight hotter than that if loaded with the intent for carbine-length barrels and stronger actions.

Unfortunately, I don't believe there's anyone currently loading the 7.62x25 to be used in anything other than pistols.

I would agree it would be wise to keep the M1 Carbine chambered in what it was made for.

 

[Abominable No-Man]

If you want a .30 carbine rifle/pistol combo, you can get an M1 and a Ruger Blackhawk to share the ammo.

Doesn't AMT also make an autoloader in .30 Carbine?

ANM

 

[Gewehr98]

Sort of.

Doesn't AMT also make an autoloader in .30 Carbine?

THey did make an autoloader in .30 Carbine, called the Automag III, before they went out of business.

And it shouldn't be too hard for somebody to come up with the muzzle velocity of 7.62x25 Tokarev out of a carbine, considering the PPSh-41 SMG was shooting the stuff years before the M1 Carbine entered the picture.

If my 7.62x25 handloads are moving at 1600fps+ from a CZ52 with 4" barrel...

 

[444]

What would be the purpose of a 7.62x25 carbine ? Just for fun ?

 

[seeker_two]

Some company is making a replica PPSh semi-auto w/ 16" bbl. (can't remember who, but it was in a SHOTGUN NEWS ANNUAL that I have somewhere...

It would be cheaper and more practical to buy a PPSh than trying to convert an M1. Or you could try converting a 9mm carbine to 7.62x25 if necessary.

Me...I'll just wait for the Kahr M1's...

 

[JohnKSa]

DMK,

Winchester doesn't make 7.62x25 ammo, they import and sell S&B under their name.

BTW, that velocity spec on the Winchester page is plagiarized (with permission, I'm sure) directly from the S&B page. In both cases, it's a bit optimistic.

http://www.sb-usa.com/pistol_ammo_page.htm