Mosin Nagant and the LER Scope

[kBob]

Just pondering again.

I have noted several places in the past where folks have talked about "scout scoping" a Mosin Nagant by removing the rear sight altogether and clamping 3/8 inch scope mounts directly to the barrel via the mounting slots for the issue front sights.

Has anyone here actually done this? How well did it work? Did you use a purpose built Rifle LER scope or a pistol scope?

Does the M44 and M38 type of M-N rifle have the same 3/8 inch groove under their shorter sight bases and can that trick work on them?

Not thinking of Bubba-ing a "good" -91 or -44 or -38 but thinking of at least making a pre-Bubba-ed Mosin shoot worthy.

-kBob

 

[illinoisburt]

Having used cantilever scopes in the past, I'm not a huge fan of the scout concept. However I have seen it done on these rifles and it seemed to work ok. All of the mosin nagant rifles with the standard rear sight will have the grooves milled in the barrel, so it should be doable. A few quick items of note: 1. The dovetail is short so trying to attach two rings by themselves can be a challenge. Get a base unit with a long clamping bar will be much better choice. 2. A dovetail gives very limited purchase so any mount is subject to sliding forward during recoil. Therefore the smaller and lighter the scope/mount combo, the better. 3. There is no guaranty the dovetail will be straight or in line/centered on the barrel. 4. The rear sight bases werent machined to tight tolerances so many have the pins soldered in place. Be prepared to heat to remove it. 5. The $8 ebay/amazon rear sight base mounts are, shall we say "no bueno." The the design is dependent on a single cross screw which tends to be undersized for the pin hole so it is likely to move slightly when jarred causing wandering zero.

 

[courtgreene]

Everything Illinoisburt said is correct. Mine went through several different mounts before I found one that wouldn't slide (much). It works well, now, but it took a while. I got an IER leupold on ebay. It was pretty messed up but they got it back to factory like conditions for free. I think I got it for 135. Good luck should you decide to do it. They are great guns. Expensive now, but great. If you're curious mine shoots about 1.5 inches on a good day. That's at 100 yards. Makes a decent deer rifle from a stand if you got one cheap. I use mine in the rain, because when I got one I couldn't afford not to get two, so one is expendable.

 

[kBob]

Well I do have one Mosin, but no chance of any sort of Bubba-ing on that one as it was a gift from a pair of ladies that decided I needed a new toy. It was just before the Chinese dumped their guns on us and the wall came down and all that so they thought it odd enough to catch my attention. It is an M44 Carbine and they thought the folding bayonet was cool. I believe it to be a bring back, but no papers came with it. I really must check it more carefully for an importer's stamp, but don't believe there is one. As it happens it is much like a bring back I got to play with when about 15 or 16 that my high school librarian's son brought back from SEA. When that happened I was supposed to clean it up for the librarian so it would not rust in our Florida environment in her un airconditioned house while he was away in Saudi Arabia. Naturally I scrounged around until I found a partial box or ancient US ammo (I seem to remember it was Winchester and some sort of hunting point) and took it out in the swamp behind our place and let fly with it. When I first fired my current M44 I was reminded of that day. I fired a round of Chinese ammo a year or so after I got it and the stuff started coming in. I fired from the kneel and was told the flash was visible to those behind me and that sweat had flown from my hair like in one of those prize fight photos and dust had leapt from the back of my shirt. My shooting partner asked very tentatively "Are you alright?" He thought the gun had blown up!

I occasionally see M44s that Goober sawed the bayonet mount off of or 91s that Gomer tried to shorten and I would not mind having such to play with as I would feel no guilt at throwing good money and time at it for no good reason. I rather like the idea of an aperature sight on the cocking piece and yes I know that wiggles back and forth. I am thinking a ball and spring detent crosswise through it to put it in the same place every time or a flat leaf spring on one side for the same or even just drill and tap a hole and turn a screw (maybe a nylon screw for self lubricity) into it until I get a fairly tight fit as far as side to side motion goes. Those cocking pieces are not that expensive yet so maybe all of the above and see what works. Maybe something as simple as a sling swivel stud or as fancy as the folding rear sight from a Ruger Ranch Rifle so it would be drift adjustable for windage and elevation adjustable with the sliding blade and those two screws.

Like I say just playing.

 

[LoonWulf]

one thing to remember about the dovetails on the barrel is they are tapered with the barrel, which means you either need windage adjustable mounts, or you shim the front with soda can slices or something like that.

I used a cheap one piece chinese airgun mount and a simmons pistol scope on one 91/30 and that worked fine.

Im unsure if 44s have the dovetail under the base, one vid i looked at didnt.

 

[entropy]

Just pondering again.

I have noted several places in the past where folks have talked about "scout scoping" a Mosin Nagant by removing the rear sight altogether and clamping 3/8 inch scope mounts directly to the barrel via the mounting slots for the issue front sights.

Has anyone here actually done this? How well did it work? Did you use a purpose built Rifle LER scope or a pistol scope?

Does the M44 and M38 type of M-N rifle have the same 3/8 inch groove under their shorter sight bases and can that trick work on them?

Not thinking of Bubba-ing a "good" -91 or -44 or -38 but thinking of at least making a pre-Bubba-ed Mosin shoot worthy.

-kBob

It works better on M91 rifles; not as well on the M91/30's. I recommend the BKL 260 http://www.bkltech.com/BKl-1-6-Screw-Unitized-Dovetail-Mount-p/bkl-260.htm for M91's. I have never heard of someone trying to use the base on the barrel of an M44 or M38, as there is none; the sight is a band that goes around the barrel, unlike the block on the barrel of the M91 or M91/30.

http://russian-mosin-nagant-forum.com/app.php/page/95

You would use an IER (AKA LER or Scout Scope) scope. The best way to scope an M38 or M44 is the mounts that replace the rear sight leaf, Darryl's are the best. I don't now his status, If he still makes them, but here is some contact info: [email protected]

 

[lobo9er]

Warne 7.3 scope rings. Not warne 7.3 / 22 the 7.3 are two screws on the top and two screws on the bottom and will hold it on the Mosin Nagant rear sight dovetail secure without any extra piece.

 

[Merle1]

Instead of removing the entire base, I used a mount from S&K arms located in PA. I put this on a M44, using a pistol scope, and it has worked well (and stayed put) for going on six years. Sure helped my tired old eyes!